Yeah they generally support the GOP except when it comes to their pension plans and union rights. I say give them a 401(k) plan and a right to work initiative.
The man was ****ing handcuffed, how big of a threat was he really? Let me tie your hands behind your back and kneel on your neck for nine minutes...I bet you’d have a change of heart.
I address it directly, that is hardly ignoring it. If the prosecutor just showed the video and rested, they would certainly lose the case. I am not ignoring anything. To me, when a coroner says he has a lethal amount of fentanyl in his system and if he had been found dead at home, I would have ruled it a drug overdose death, that casts doubt on the ultimate conclusion that the cause of death was "police restraint" and that that must me knee on neck, especially in light of the other things I posted above. Why are you not addressing any of those other factors? For all the reasons I have stated, as well as the tremendous pressure that has been put on everyone involved to find Chauvin guilty of murder. What might someone say to avoid murderous riots breaking out in the streets? Look at the report itself, where he dissected Floyds neck and found no evidence of any injury. How do you kill someone by doing something to their neck without injuring their neck in any way? Again, I have ignored nothing. You have ignored all of the evidence that is anything except Chauvin had his knee on Floyd's neck.
The coroner said explicitly what the cause of death was and it wasn't Fentanyl. A second coroner reviewed it and greed. The conclusion of both coroner's was that Floyd died because Chauvin kept his knee on his neck and killed him. You picking one thing out of the report and choosing to highlight that rather than the conclusion just makes you a poor juror. You keep hanging on to one statement within a report that reached a very different conclusion than what you are hanging your belief there was reasonable doubt. A conclusion was reached, reviewed and agreed upon. You say you have doubt on the cause of death and cite the report to back up that belief. The conclusion of the report itself does not claim there is doubt. It is clear on the cause of death, and it was homicide at the hands officer Chauvin.
Let's review what you typed. Nope, no where do you acknowledge the part where Chauvin had his knee pressed against Floyd's neck for 5 minutes while he was motionless and not tensened up indicating zero sign of any desire to resist while bystanders were begging him to check his vitals due to his motioneles state for FIVE ENTIRE MINUTES. All you do is acknowledge his knee was on his neck. So stop this bad faith bs. You aren't acknowledging it and keep on avoiding this party to spew your cop but hugging ways. Again the point of pressing a knee on a neck is to pressure the arrested Individual from resisting. Once the arrested Individual stops resisting and a knee is still applies to the neck, their intentions no longer are to stop the Individual from resisting.
Yesterday Donald Williams who has been an MMA fighter and an eye witness testified that Chauvin used a "Blood Choke" on Floyd. That term isn't one that is usually used much but to explain again that the technique isn't meant to cut off the airway but to cut off blood flow to the brain. That is what is meant by a "blood choke". This particularly technique is meant to control an someone and get compliance which it does more by causing pain and stress on the body while leaving one's hands free to cuff them. This is a screenshot of one of my students putting the technique on me during a demonstration. This is on a mat with a 110 pound women. I can attest it is very painful but also there is a lot stress on my head neck and chest. This was only for a few seconds. The issue with this or any other submission / control / compliance technique is that they can be used safely for a short period of time but are not meant to be put on indefinitely.
I agree there is a lot more information that needs to be presented. I would say that the arguments you're making show that there is a lack of knowledge about what this technique is doing. You've said this before but the point is that he wasn't found dead at home. It is a fact he died while Derek Chauvin was on top of him. It is a fact that the ME didn't find that overdose was the cause of death. That Floyd could've died if Chauvin had done nothing is speculation and requires a leap to ignore the fact that Chauvin did do something to Floyd. Again this is based on lack of knowledge of the technique. The technique won't break someone's neck, it is constricting blood flow (not cutting it all of), causing pain and stress including compressing the chest. See the posts I've made explaining this. If it didn't do those things it wouldn't work as a compliance technique. It's not that anytime the technique is used it is lethal but that it is put on excessively under a situation where the suspect is already in control. To head off you restating that somehow a suspect could keep on fighting, that is a frequent argument brought up in these situations. Taking that argument literally then that means that a suspect is never in control so any amount of force including lethal is justified because you can keep on arguing that a suspect could somehow be superhuman and keep on fighting even when restrained with multiple LEO. That isn't how use of force works. Except that the argument that if Floyd had been found dead at home requires us to ignore that he wasn't found dead at his home.
That is why in MMA, you have a ref to check if the guy goes unconscious or taps which normally happens in seconds, and not minutes. Again, I think there situations where the move is needed but it is not after a person is handcuffed and not for more than a minute. There is also an example of another death in DFW with same hold. Not as publicized because the victim was white and had emotional issues.
Also this isn't a technique that would be used much in MMA. If you get to the position where you are at their back like that would most likely go for a rear choke or ground and pound them. In Judo from that position would either take a rear choke or go for an armbar. Wouldn't just put your knee on their neck and sit there for an extended period of time. I have only taught the technique from a self-defense standpoint to disarm an opponent as shown in the pic.
I wasn't implying that the technique was a submission hold. I was just talking in MMA, some of the danger of dangerous moves are mitigated by having a ref being able to stop a fight. I think this should be the role of the the police officers not involved.
Since this has been brought up a few times on the Tony Timpa case I'll admit I haven't studied it enough. In that case from what I've seen it looks like the LEO has his knee on the middle of the back of Timpa which is safer than the position that Chauvin had his. That said these techniques are designed to cause stress on the body and there is no absolutely safe way to do them. In the Timpa case it sounds like the LEO might've suffocated him by keeping his face down in the grass. For the argument that we can still hear the person so that they can't actually be being choked keep in mind that you can be choked while still making a lot of noise. It's not complete absence of air that leads to death. As noted also many of these techniques aren't cutting off air into the body but blood to the brain. Finally even if the person isn't dying from suffocation these are stress techniques. When you're having pressure to the put to the neck and chest area it is very stressful and even if you're still getting air your cardiovascular system is working overtime out of stress. It's no accident then that many of the suspects in these situations death isn't ruled as asphyxiation but from heart failure.
I was actually referring to this incident. https://www.dallasnews.com/news/201...h-after-struggle-with-deputies-in-jail-lobby/ In Tony Timpa's case, it looks like what killed him was the stuff they injected him with when he was pinned.
Acknowledgement: Chauvin had a knee on Floyd's neck for 9 minutes and change. When a blood choke is applied, how quickly does someone lose consciousness? During that time, would one expect the person to whom the blood choke is being applied to speak normally? How long can a blood choke be applied before resulting in death? If a blood choke is being applied, would one expect to see any physical effects on the tissues of the person to whom it was applied? How long would a blood choke be applied before these effects appear? Is this technique blocking the jugular vein, the carotid artery, or both? Would the major symptom you complain of be an inability to breath?
Now acknowledge the next part. He had his knee on his neck for 5 minutes while Floyd was completely motionless and unresponsive while people were begging the officers to check his vitals.
From my understanding it takes roughly 4-5 minutes of no oxygen carried by blood to the the brain to cause the brain to shut down and at the very least cause permanent damage.
