Flacco got his money because of previous accomplishments... He earned it. The Texans were just plan stupid for paying Schaub.
Flacco lost Boldin, Ray Rice turned into a pumpkin overnight, his tight end was out most of the season, and they had offensive line issues. So yes Bobby, an intelligent argument can be made.
The Ravens won the Superbowl, not Joe Flacco. NE scored 13 friggin' points and all anyone talked about was Flacco's TD's to Boldin that game. Flacco is a mediocre QB who's contract will hamstring the Ravens for years to come. The bottom line is the Ravens HAD to sign him. The fans would have gone insane and the organization would look like it didn't support it's "franchise" QB. Same thing goes for Schaub. We HAD to sign him. What were the options at hand? We were in "win now" mode. The fans would have gone nuts if we trotted out TJ Yates. Kubiak wasn't in position to afford a 7 win season outlook. Schaub. Flacco... Cutler.... these are deals that simply have to be done. Nobody has the balls to say no. Say no and start fresh with a new QB and the coaching regime is done for. Nobody has that kind of time.
Flacco got his money because he earned it. Did he get lucky _ sure he did but many QBs do. Like the Tom Brady tuck rule when Oakland should have went to the super bowl. And who's fault is it that New England only scored 13 points...? They only scored 14 points in the super bowl the year they had Randy Moss and was destroying everybody. And it's rare when a team wins a super bowl solely on the back of the quarterback. Even when Farve won his super bowl Desmond Howard was the best player on the field (the kick returner). People don't like to give Flacco credit and that's fine, but you can't pick and choose if you do that. You have to be fair across the board. Elway got lucky for having Davis. And look at Kubiak now for paying Schaub after coming off an injury and not letting him play out the rest of his contract. They were not in a position where they HAD to sign him and the Texans are paying for it now. Schaub got allll that money for two wins.
But no one questioned the greatness of Favre or Elway before those events. There was little question that both guys were Hall of Fame bound even before. That's particularly true of Elway. No one confused Flacco with a Hall of Famer before the playoffs last season.
Agree 100%... I wasn't questioning their greatness. Just pointing out it's rare when a QB wins a super bowl on his own and or without some luck...
Well you can try....However since Flacco has never actually had a good season, it's hard to say he "turned into a pumpkin" because that implies that he wasn't a pumpkin all along. Look at his career, mediocre is all you will see. His team winning the SB doesn't make his performance any better. The fact that Flacco performed no better than Schaub and Keenum last year, yet the Ravens sill won more games shows just how unimportant the QB position really can be.
Put all QB's in a draft right now with the same cap figure and Flacco goes 12-16 (not factoring age). Reinsert Flacco into this year's draft and include his cap figure and he probably doesn't get drafted until Minnesota's selection at best. Do the same with Schaub before this year (back when we signed him) and you'd get about the same result. The major difference being Schaub had a solid chance of being the #1 QB taken last year over Manuel. No way in hell Flacco goes before Bridgewater in this draft, not with that cap number. Ravens and Texans both made bad decisions. But they were decisions that absolutely HAD to be made when you factor in the circumstances.
Tell ya what, RR - tell me what Caldwell did to coax one of the greatest four-game stretches in NFL history out of the otherwise thoroughly mediocre Joe Flacco. And further, why not a hint of that stretch materialized a year later under Caldwell's year-long tutelage. I have a hard time giving Caldwell too much credit for Joe Flacco getting white hot. I'm not dismissing it; I'm just giving credit where credit is due: Peyton Manning. Meanwhile, you don't address his failures in Indianapolis, post-Manning, nor his failure with Flacco under his wing for an entire offseason/season. Instead, you keep hanging your hat on a miraculous four-game stretch that is looking more and more like a giant pile of the exception rather than rule. Semantics; been a while since I dusted off the Arian Foster Origin Story. He nonetheless *signed* him, groomed him, and helped turn him into one of the best RBs in football. Again, tell me something Caldwell's done that has a hint of legitimacy and longevity that didn't involve nodding his head at Peyton Manning. Kubiak has a list of rather unexceptional players (late drafts picks, undrafted free agents, etc.) that he turned into Pro Bowlers. This isn't conjecture; I'm not "going to say..." Caldwell *WAS* responsible for Flacco's worst year. Meanwhile, the Carr reference is insanely irrelevant... re: Schaub - the guy had far more great years than worst years with Kubiak, and most generally don't think much of Schaub from a measurables standpoint. Again, what QB has Caldwell sent to the Pro Bowl that didn't have the initials P.M.? Schaub's best stretched nearly three seasons; Flacco's was four games - are you really comparing the two? And yes, Schaub was terrible this year - he also wasn't coming off a Super Bowl MVP. Which QB's worst season was a bigger surprise? Especially considering the genius behind Flacco's playoff run got to coach him for a full season. I don't even understand your point here; I'm not defending Gary Kubiak's 2013 performance, nor have I ever defended it. He earned his firing. But his total resume is far more impressive than Caldwell's. That you can only point to Peyton Manning and an outlier of a 4-game stretch underscores that point. Again, I'll happily concede the point if you can name something - anything - that Caldwell could put on his resume that doesn't crumble under the slightest whiff of scrutiny. But you can't because he doesn't have anything. You can shout all you want abut Flacco's four-game stretch; I think the 16 games that followed it are far more damning.
Well, yeah 2 wins... plus 12 more and a playoff victory. I would much rather be the Texans than Ravens right now. The Texans gambled that paying Schaub when they did was more financially sound than waiting and possibly having to re-up a Super Bowl-winning QB. And we saw exactly how much more that would have cost them - and hamstrung them - had they lost that gamble. As is, they can now move on with relatively decent financial relief. The Ravens won't see any for years. And for a QB who is not, nor has he ever been on a consistent basis, better than Matt Schaub.
Since Kubes doesn't have to worry about game management decisions like fgs, timeouts, reviews, etc... in addition to STs and Defense, I expect him to have a good year. He is a master coordinator but mediocre head coach. The Ravens already use a ZBS but I never really gave Kubes all the credit for that. He always relied on other guys like Gibbs to teach it. So I don't see a major improvement on the Ravens running game upcoming. As a rival now, I hope that he brings his system of audibles or lack thereof which everyone views as a major weakness especially in today's NFL. Kubes as OC can't hide in the AFC North. He will be tested with 6 games against Bengals, Steelers, and Browns which are 3 of the better defenses in the league, nothing compared to the Colts, Jags, and Titans.
Off the top of my head, I don't believe he's lost to any of those three teams since at least 2010. He's 5-0 the past three seasons... including beating the Bengals three times, twice with a third-string rookie QB starting. The only team in the AFC North that seems to give him/his team trouble is Baltimore.
*shrug* What has Kubiak done without a QB named Elway. What was his final record here? I think it was sub 500? Next year . . .we will see . .. . . Caldwell will do what it do in Detroit .. . or he won't Kubiak will do the same in Baltimore .. . or he won't Rocket River
The 12 wins and the playoff victory would have been the last year of his old contact... And we saw Schaub going down hill last season before the playoffs and he just picked up where he left off...
I said Ray Rice turned into a pumpkin overnight (and he wasn't that good during their playoff run either). And I'm sure Baltimore wouldn't have won as many games if Flacco was throwing pick 6 after pick 6 like Schaub was. And I bet we would have had more than two wins if we had Flacco.
The idea that Kubiak can't coach offense anymore is dumb. I heard Ted Johnson on the radio saying Gary Kubiak would probably never coach in the league again just a few weeks ago. Ridiculous.
Flacco threw more interceptions than Schaub and Keenum combined....Of course why let crazy things like facts get in the way.
He built one of the NFL's best offenses over a four-year stretch, Rocket River. He picked and developed multiple offensive Pro Bowlers... I mean... are you *this* dug in? You seem to be having an entirely different conversation, perhaps with an imaginary person? We're talking about his offense, not head coaching career. He routinely had terrific offenses in Houston, and if, for some reason, you don't believe me - ask John Harbaugh. Any progress on coming up with any tangible accomplishments for Caldwell? Or is it now perfectly acceptable to knock a guy to uplift another?
Was he OC in Indy? Didn't they have an older guy who was OC? Either way he's a good coach. I've never heard anyone speak as highly about Caldwell as people speak about Kubiak outside of Houston.
