The shooting % difference between Francis, Pierce and AI this year is only 1/2 as much as you say--.442 to .418 to .414--and careerwise Pierce and Francis are identical in most every way. Also, because Pierce and AI get fouled more and Pierce takes a higher % from the 3 point line, the difference shrinks for PPS, a better measure of efficiency, where Francis is at 1.32, Pierce at 1.29 and AI at 1.16 I am not about to put AI, Pierce, Dirk or Francis in the company you mention (Kobe doesn't belong on the all-time list either), I don't even put the 4 we are talking about now in the superelite right now--though Dirk is the closest IMO, further of the superelite now none of whom except Shaq (perhaps Duncan with another title or two) at this point deserves mention with those "all-time" elites you rattle off. You totally missed my point--it wasn't that FG% or even PPS (efficiency) is unimportant, it is that you can't solely rely on that and ignore total production (PPG) and other contrubutions. If all you look at is FG% Stockton, Barry and Sam Cassell are much better players than Steve Francis or do you think Francis PPG of 21.5 does represent a significant edge over Cassell's 19.5 and Stockton's 11. If you think total PPG does matter in this case (e.g., Stockton's 11 to Francis 21.5 is relevant even though Stockton shoots much better) you cannot discount's Pierce's 26.1 and AI's 27.2 as irrelevant either. Finally, Dirk beats Francis in every offensive shooting statistic and every other recorded statistic (usually by a healthy margin) with the exception of assists and steals--if we stick to your rules no reasonable person could conclude Francis is better.
You shouldn't over count a few games. Otherwise the Knicks and Allan Houston must be far superior to the Rockets and Franchise.
You are the bigger moron stupid. Stop posting and try to learn a few things first because it is clear to me that you are daft.
DAFT what a big word u obviously don't know jack about bball ranking vince carter great. he has barely played the past two years. his cousin is way better than he is
Sorry to bring up this thread but Steve Francis has fallen a bit (at least behind Marbury now) in my player ranking. He's good but NOT great. Also, if Francis is such a great player but still couldn't take his team to the playoffs, isn't it pretty clearly proven that a guard-led team would never get you anywhere especially in this Western Conference? Shouldn't we change our team from a guard-led team to another type starting from NEXT year? This "Francis and Mobley show" experiment has tried for 4 years now and still couldn't get it done. Shouldn't we admit the failure of this experiment and starting over the team again NOW?
He is the leader of this team and he's definitely not showin he has the maturity to do it. Steve is erratic, throws up ill-advised shots, and is a horrible point gaurd. Steve is a great talent, don't get me wrong....but he's not a superstar. Steve cannot be said in the same breath as McGrady, AI, Kobe, Kidd, and even Pierce. If he was a shooting gaurd, he might be.....but he's not now.....after these last 2 games, it shows that he cannot be a leader of a team. Yao is the leader of this team now. Not Steve, Yao. Yao has a better feel for the game and is much more in control than Steve, and Yao's only a rookie.......imagine that.......
Can we just put this arguement to rest......the evidence is clear and we all know the answer. He is NOT a GREAT player.
Sad but true. What hurts the most is that Starbury (who no one considers great except himself) is doing it for his team and carrying them with an unbelievable "WILL" and "CLUTCHNESS" but Stevie is not doing the same. We can afford Yao struggling (since he is still a rookie) but seeing Steve struggle during the time we need him the most just breaks your heart. If we don't make the playoffs (I still believe though the writing is on the wall) I hope we be better for it. Loosing our lottery pick to Memphis hurts but we can be active in via trade and aquiring at least one vet via MCE.
Well said.....I believe that if Steve was going to be that "GREAT " that he would have elevated the play of his teammates by now..... such as A.I., T Mac,. have managed to do with less talent. Steve is great 2 guard and that is not a bad thing. We need a team leader out there that distributes the ball well and sets his teammates up. What the hell has Moochie done this year. PINK SLIP baby. He is worthless too....Dirk Minniefield was a better point than Mooch. ....I would kill to have Steve Nash on this team right now!!
Not saying that Steve is as good as T-Mac, but how much leading has that guy done? He plays in the Weak Conference and he hasn't been to the confernece Finals.
T-Mac hasn't won anything, again, I know T-Mac is better than Steve, but really, these posts make it sound like he has led his team so far.
Again...I said that these players have a knack of elevating the players they play with. Orlando has less talent than the Rockets...That's a fact.....Can't argue that....What I will says is that maybe it's a combination of his leadership and overachievers working harder. The Rockets have not played to their potential...they have an average #2, 3, and 4 and and they are getting Fat on long term deals...We have have a bunch of underachievers with Fat contracts....Who does T-Mac have? Don't see Grant Hill? I am a frustrated fan right now and I don't want the Rockets make the playoffs because they don't deserve it.....They have NO HEART!!!
Damnit, again forgetting about the lack of ability to edit....... Just my opinion, but the only thing that seperates the east and west is KG, Duncan, and Shaq.
Stevie doesnt get the chance for takin 20 shots a game like Marbury, and stevie is wwwaaayyyy more talented
Marbury's got Marion, Marion steps up when Marbury got a bad shooting nite(like their last game against mavs) do we have a guy beside steve dats as good as marion????
