Francis has lots of room for improvment, for you to even hint that he's the best at anything is ridiculous. Well, actually he does dunk well...
That's not the point, the point is that your criticism is a load of complete and utter dogsh-t and is not based in fact but in your own version of reality which you have conjured for yourself. The guy played his heart out, right or wrong, stupid or smart, dunk or turnover, he came to play and to win. Now, since I won't dogpile onto a former Rocket who was a very good, though flawed player, and I won't invent fake/warped/stupid criticisms of him and retroactively apply them, you can accuse me of being a ***-homo-francis lover, whatever you want, and then everybody else can cluck-cluck-cluck like a bunch of hens about how obsessed I am and how pgabriel can't let it go, and then you can start the next thread each time the Magic lose and do the same thing over again and feel superior in that you have let it go, and don't care anymore, and you can say it in the next 63 threads that you or somebody else starts in order to denounce him post hoc, politburo style
I did not see the game or the play. I was using this as a reference... My apologies to Steve, his family, Cuttino, the Magic organization, the fans that vote Steve to the All Star, to pgabriel and to you but especially to SamFisher. It was quite a leap for me to think that Steve would have ever allowed his passion to overcome his court sensibilites.
What's ridiculous is all these people coming out to say Francis doesn't care about winning when they were absent in threads about the Rockets new franchise player admitting he didn't play hard every night last season. Its Okay McGrady we all know you only make 15 million. Just don't travel on a dunk.
You go GATER!!! Edit: I do want to say that life really imitates art. As my post foreshadowed, you are a vastly superior person for having gotten past steve francis, and for recognizing his flaws and identifying them repeatedly and retroactively Your pigeonholing of myself and pgabriel was, really, the master stroke. I must say that it really put me/him in my place. We are a bunch of obsessed fools, dwelling in the past, while you have moved on to bigger and better things. Plus, I'm glad there was just a smidgen, shall we say, of implied homosexuality there. No need to bring out the big guns just yet, there will be other threads and posts for that, dear friend.
Not based on fact? My whole criticism is of Francis is that he hadn't improve his game since his first 2 years, which his stats would show. Your whole rant about my criticism being a load of dogsh-t is just that, dogsh-t. This year some of his stats have improved and some have gotten worse. His A/T for a point guard is still crap(of course that doesn't matter to his homo-***-francis lovers), but his shooting percentage is back to respectable. Ooooo, he plays hard. And? What good is the effort if it drives him to lead the league in Technical fouls and TOs? I always wondered how coaches expect Francis to run a team when he can barely control himself.
Severe Rocket Fan logic 101: McGrady's stats are down since he joined the Rockets. Why has McGrady let his game deteriorate? Not only is he not improving it, he's regressing. This is based on COLD HARD NUMBERS. Obviously he doesn't want to win.
For you guys wanting the dunk, here it is: http://s15.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=1U039PMECYG1H3MNLV59IHRU81
So stats mean nothing Sam? Percentages and ratios mean nothing as far as player efficiency goes(which were the only things I mentioned)? I know you're just all hot and fussy b/c your boy doesn't get all the praise that you want him to, but regardless of how hard he plays, if he's going to screw up just as much as he helps, it'll kill your team. That's his criticism. BTW, all of Tmac's stats are up from last year(except for PPG), strange that his have gone up since coming to a JVG team...
Stats mean something, I never said they didn't. Your chicken sh-t logic doesn't mean anything though, which I showed with the example in the previous post. Either address the McGrady counterexample or don't. I'm guessing that you can't, which is why you retorted with the above.
My logic was talking about steve's horrible A/T ratio and shooting percentages which he hadn't improved over the years. I really don't have the time to run Tmac's numbers(but I'm pretty familiar with steve and his past 5 years) but I'm pretty sure they're better than steve's. YOU still don't acknowledge that fact about steve's shortcomings and that fact that he's playing the Point Guard with those flaws. But, hey, he plays hard, right? Honestly, I never thought steve would average 7 apg, but then again, I never thought he'd average about 4 TOpg again, either.
Ummm...what about McGrady's dunks like that in the past? Because he's on the Rockets now, does that make him immune to such criticism? It's a double standard some of you all have against Francis now, and it's crazy.
Double standard? Kinda like when you thought Tmac would bring in Kobe + Shaq combined, and when the Rockets deal went through, you denounced him as being a selfish player who can't lead? It was a stupid play. What would you be saying if he did get called for the travel? I wasn't saying Francis doesn't care about winning, I was just saying his basketball IQ has not improved since he entered the league, and that play shows it.
Actually, SRF, I acknowledged ad nauseum that Francis turned the ball over too much, and made stupid plays, and that Yao was the more efficient plyaer for us last year. He's not perfect, he has flaws. This is obvious to anybody. I said this MANY MANY TIMES last year. If we had search I would show you. Of course, I don't get apopleptic about it like most people do and whip themselves up into a frenzy several months after the fact. And I don't invent bogus things like "he doesn't want to win" in order to criticize him. I also don't buy into the myth that, due to designation, a player is automatically a POINT GUARD and can not ever do anything that a POINT GUARD IS NOT SUPPOSED TO DO and has to play like Bob Cousy OR ELSE HE IS DOING IT WRONG. That is a separate point entirely, and one that I have also discussed ad nauseum. Likewise I don't believe that is impossible to win if you don't buy into this myth. Chauncey Billups anybody? Let's just say this, if you or anybody else expects Steve Francis (or Tony Parker, or Gary Payton, or Mike Bibby, or anybody else this side of John Stockton) to be like Bob Cousy after watching them play for this long, well, you're being unrealistic.
You prolly know more than I do, but when was the last time T-mac pulled a stunt in a game like Francis did? The allstar game 3 years ago? Francis tried a gimmicky dunking contest dunk during a real game on the road. He's just dumb, and he doesn't get it. Even if Tmac ever did try a dunk like that in the past, which i doubt, the point is that he has stopped doing it. He doesn't even do windmills and reverses when they're not necessary anymore. How old will Francis be before he stops showboating? When he can't even dunk anymore? The Kings were all about the fancy behind the back passes, but they gave that up to try to win.
