Wanting and getting are two different animals.....Morey set the price....let's see what Von gets offered elsewhere...same thing happened with Landry, Morey set a low price, he got offered more, the Rockets matched. If Von gets offered a bit more, maybe Morey matches, maybe he exceeds it....it is simply a negotiation where the market sets the price. I don't think it has anything to do with the playoff incident, or anything else people are speculating on here. Pure negotiation. DD
before the beginning of last season Von has shown nothing to prove he belong in the NBA (and IMHO he hasnt shown that much to prove he deserve anything more than the min) so why should any team take a risk on a guy that was actually let go by 3 teams? what changed? he got an opportunity thanks to injuries to the team You say those 2nd round picks, yeah well they haven't had their opportunity yet to show what they can do so why dismiss them so easily? Considering that the upcoming season will be a learning/growing season for the entire team I would rather roll the dice with the two rookies to see what that can do for the team I am not downplaying his leaping over Luther and Barry in the rotation but Barry is on his last legs and was brought more to mentor brooks (which he did a lot of early in the season) and well Luther was a nice surprise his rookie year its just that he didnt improve at all and well its not like there were several people here clamoring to keep Luther. I have a feeling that had we kept Strawberry instead of Wafer it would have probably been a similar situation
Well maybe this guy just isn't good. I mean if he was sooooo good don't you think he would have been signed already by now. Nobody wants him because other G.M's are smart and know what this guy is really about. They don't believe the hype one bit.
YY, The dude averaged 10ppg in only 20mpg, while shooting at a very nice % for a SG, and finished at the rim. If those types are so easily found, why have the Rockets had such a hard time finding one? Von can play, we are not going to agree, for some reason, you think signing a guy that is very young to a contract around a million a year is somehow a bad deal. Well, sir, I am just not in agreement. DD
As much as I can't stand Wafer I believe he did step up though. He actually helped in the season and did things when his name was called. Correct me if I'm wrong but when injuries happen and your name is called aren't you suppose to step up and help the team out?? That's what he did. He shocked me but Still I believe he shouldn't be resigned. Last but not least I thought it was 4 teams instead of three
He scored most of his points against bench player. Although he had his stretch of good games as a starter but after 4 seasons you would think he has because everybody has good stats once in a while in their careers. It is too early to categorize him as a scorer with 45 percent and 39 percent 3pt shooting. I still don't get it. You don't throw tantrums in the playoffs and in front of a trainer that gave you a real chance while the other 4 ball clubs have you play 10-20 games with very limited minutes. You would expect humility and gratitude. Young player or not. I forgive him though.
However, he was not just a young player, he was a young player getting his first chance, and had only a one year contract. He knew that playing well in the playoffs would set up his career, and was probably pressing himself, and by proxy the team. If Von had a longer term secure deal, I doubt he would have had those issues, I think he just needs a bit of security to take off and mature. DD
I would say we have limited resources and limited spots for SG while we are still out there for a big man. Morey really likes the rookies to sign with us. They happen to be SGs. A trade for a veteran is more likely.
You may be right, I will leave it with Morey, but personally I think letting Von walk will be a big mistake. You sign guys that can produce in a down market you stockpile assets for future trades. DD
I am just implying that I could understand why most people are cautious about signing him. Thinking long term he is no longer a No. 1 option to address. Even though I like his quickness we now have other guys who are no sloths either. In a Yaoless system he is more expandable. If he would be a difference maker however, had a game besides scoring and slashing he would be a hot commodity.
You could just as easily argue that the only thing keeping Von hungry and playing within the team concept is the goal of a new contract and the big payday. The history of the Rockets is littered with long-term contracts given to young players who then proceeded to underachieve and become dead weight.
We can agree to disagree I have said that Von for the min I would agree for but for much more than that is where I get a bit hesitant. The team signed Ariza and with McGrady (hopefully) coming back to play at least a few games where will Von get his minutes? Would rather give a chance to a younger just as athletic and good of a shooter in Chase who will be cheaper too. Its not so much that Von cant play, he can play but is limited and comes with a bit of baggage. I would rather go for the cheaper, more potential options given that the mentality for next season isnt "win now" As for the Rockets pursuing the type of player Von is...well neither you or I are the GM I will say as FANS we have been wanting that type of player but as the team been aggressive pursuing that sort of guy? The only guy I could think of that fits that sort of mold was Derek Anderson and he was at the tail end of his career. I guess you can say Ariza (hopefully his shot has really improved) hasnt been too many athletic SGs they were trying to get especially with Tmac at that position, he he did play healthy he got the lion share of minutes . and his run ins with the other teams and being let go has to be troubling, they are plenty of guys in the NBA who are just as young that havent been cut by multiple teams. Heck Ariza was the 43 pick the year before Von was drafted (Von at the 39th pick) and while he has been on 3 different teams prior to the Rockets he was traded for each time and has never been out of the league. He is just as young as Wafer (born ~ 3 weeks apart) yet there isnt that "he is a young player he is bound to make mistakes" label for him. I just dont think Wafer is a good fit with the Rockets next season. We are not seeing Morey pursuing him and if Morey is just letting the market set the price how come other teams aren't trying to get him for the bi-annual, or a piece of the MLE. His name is hardly been mentioned in nba rumors/talks outside of the clippers and knicks ---probably the two worst run franchises this past decade. shouldnt that tell you something too?
Who said anything about a long term deal? I have always said a 2 year deal with a player option in year 3.....where we get his bird rights, and both are in more advantageous position in 2 years. Why do these discussions always border on the extreme cases? What about a deal that was say.... $1.1 million in year one. $1.3 million in year two. $1.5 million player option in year 3. None of those are crazy, he is a very movable contract and IF he develops, you have gotten yourself a bargain. Morey, for all his greatness has screwed the pooch on a few deals, specifically the older guys, let's get some young ones let them compete and see which ones stick and which fall down. DD
Now you factor in that McGrady who is going to fill in the minutes comes back by December. Moreover by the tradeline or next year we trade for or sign a player who plays the SG spot. Where does this leave Von. I for one do believe it is not the perfect situation for him anymore. Whereas a rookie can play 10 minutes, Von does need more than that to develop.
I have a better, more relevant, bet. Once we sign Budinger, we'll have like 3 million of the MLE left, right? Lets say Wafer would be willing to sign a 2 year deal for 3 million per, with the second year a team option. So he basically would have no effect on our cap situation beyond this year. And lets also assume Les Alexander is OK with spending a little more in luxury tax (he did spend several million buying those draft picks this year). If Morey spends that 3 million and gets better production than what Wafer produces this season, you win the bet. If not, then I win the bet.
I think Tmac will be moved, because we lose leverage after the trading deadline. This is a down year anyway, time to find out whom is going to be a player and whom is going to be out of the league. Stockpile assets, compete and may the best men win. DD
So verbal sparring now = shouting.....come on LTF....you are jumping to conclusions because you don't like him. No big deal, let's just stick to what we know, we don't KNOW it was shouting, we KNOW it was verbal sparring. Big amount of "Could be-ness" in there. And they talked it out and Von played the next game.....seriously.......you guys need to manage people or have some kids....then you will understand this stuff happens all the time and it is a great learning tool. DD
come on, I thought you were high on him because you care. Stockpiling assets has nothing to do with it because you know Morey stockpiles 1) hard workers and defenders 2) talents with more than one upside and not depending on their stats (field goal pct) but their potential (and team spirit eg.Ariza) I know you are the only one to guarantee him major PT but I think Rick has other options If you cared you would want him to play big minutes either for the Rockets but in this case for other teams who needs him more
