1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Former Muslim says that ISIS represents true Islam

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by PhatPharaoh, Sep 7, 2014.

  1. PhatPharaoh

    PhatPharaoh Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2014
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    25
    What do you guys think of this? I have never heard of this guy, but he is apparently a pretty popular figure in the Middle East.

    Comment below if you agree/disagree and why. This is my first thread in here, looking forward to a good debate ;)

    <iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/5iZ6u-vqUxc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
     
  2. PhatPharaoh

    PhatPharaoh Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2014
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    25
    meant to say he is popular in the Middle East amongst several of the minority groups, not the Middle East in general.
     
  3. Mr. Brightside

    Mr. Brightside Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2005
    Messages:
    18,924
    Likes Received:
    2,103
    Which minority groups is this guy popular with?
     
  4. PhatPharaoh

    PhatPharaoh Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2014
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    25
    He is mostly popular amongst the religious minorities that are unable to freely practice their religions in Morocco and other areas in Africa/the Middle East.

    What do you think of the substance of his argument though?
     
  5. AroundTheWorld

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    55,489
    Likes Received:
    27,699
    I agree with him that saying "IS does not represent Islam" is a cop-out. They DO represent the ideology of many Muslims. They are a symptom.

    There are many peaceful Muslims. But there are also many - way too many - who support IS.

    And the root cause is Islam itself.
     
  6. PhatPharaoh

    PhatPharaoh Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2014
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    25
    See my belief is that it is not only the ideology, but it is from the Quran itself. If it was just twisted people acting on their own, it would not be as widespread of an issue.

    ISIS may be the extreme of the extreme, but a vast majority of their actions/beliefs are from the Quran and they are inspired by the direct actions of Mohammad himself. I don't believe that they make this stuff up on their own, it is clearly there in the Quran, and if you want to argue that they misinterpret it, that is not even debatable...

    Regardless of their interpretation, the fact remains that many people in the middle east interpret it in that way and because anyone reading it can understand where they acquire this interpretation from, the problem can not just be cast aside as "oh, these people are just the crazies in our society..."

    The difference then is the influence of the crazies in each society. In American society, crazy people are marginalized and pushed off to the side and nobody pays them any mind, plus they have little to no influence. In the middle east, however, they are able to spread their beliefs to millions of people and recruit them from around the world to fight for their cause.
     
  7. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2002
    Messages:
    55,267
    Likes Received:
    35,669
    I'd just like to point out that the landscape of the United States is littered with religious loons representing every kind of idiocy. Some are quite prominent among those who subscribe to religious extremism of one stripe or another, or are simply ignorant of what they actually represent, which in many cases amounts to simple greed. I wouldn't leap to the conclusion that this Islamic fellow is any less idiotic and represents the Islamic religion any more than those religious "leaders" in this country represent mainstream Christianity. In my humble opinion.
     
  8. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    47,416
    Likes Received:
    15,854
    And yet in the middle east the vast majority don't subscribe to the IS philosophy on Islam, and consider themselves opposed to IS.
     
  9. PhatPharaoh

    PhatPharaoh Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2014
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    25
    I acknowledged that in my prior post, but when you have such a large group that believes in the ISIS philosophies, and at the same time, a vast majority (of the true majority) who may not believe the same things, remain silent/do nothing to stop them from advancing, it allows the ISIL philosophy to flourish.

    Also, many Muslims that I know here in the states believe in the idea of a unified Caliphate in the Middle East, but don't agree on how ISIS is establishing it. They view it as a valid form of government that will eventually be created, and can thrive in the Middle Eastern geopolitical structure.
     
  10. PhatPharaoh

    PhatPharaoh Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2014
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    25
    Yes, there are obvious people like that in the states as well, but the difference is that the loons here largely have zero effect on the governance and are unable to forcefully spread their hateful ideologies to large a large number of people, and even if they did, there wouldn't be widespread massacres of minorities/those who disagreed with them.

    In the Middle East, these loons (ISIS/Al Qaeda/Al Nusra Front/etc) are able to gain substantial followings and not only preach hate, but preach the elimination of anyone who disagrees with them, and due to the majority remaining silent, they continue to go unchecked.

    My main issue is how little resistance the Islamic world is putting up against them. If you look back to the cartoonist that depicted Mohammad a few years ago, there were widespread protests and even threats to the guy and his family. However, now the vast majority remain silent and while claiming to be against ISIS, are not doing anything.
     
  11. AroundTheWorld

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    55,489
    Likes Received:
    27,699
    Do you have any polls/surveys, etc. to support this statement?

    I have several which indicate the contrary of what you said, but I will let you go first.
     
  12. okierock

    okierock Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2001
    Messages:
    3,120
    Likes Received:
    186
    I agree with your premise. Many Muslims have said that this is not the true face of Islam but I do not see them sharpening their swords to crush those that are bastardizing their faith and destroying their reputation as a peaceful religion.

    If I believed in something so firmly that I was willing to name myself as a follower and a group of people claiming to be the same thing I call myself were making me look like a genocidal maniac to the rest of the world, I would be pissed and doing something about it.

    I do not see that anger. In my eyes the lack of action from the Islamic world says to me that they agree with the behavior of ISIS and their cause. In short, the inaction is confirming to many that this truly is the face of Islam.

    I hope somebody stands up to change that.
     
  13. Deji McGever

    Deji McGever יליד טקסני

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 1999
    Messages:
    4,011
    Likes Received:
    944
    <iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/ioUS_xwFfXw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
     
  14. sammy

    sammy Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2002
    Messages:
    18,949
    Likes Received:
    3,528
    He sounds like an idiot...talking super slowly.

    I couldn't get through more than 40-50 seconds.
     
  15. g1184

    g1184 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2003
    Messages:
    1,798
    Likes Received:
    86
    Do you believe yourself to be an American?
     
  16. AroundTheWorld

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    55,489
    Likes Received:
    27,699
    What are you trying to say?
     
  17. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2005
    Messages:
    42,163
    Likes Received:
    38,137
    I think it's pretty obvious. (I know you know that.)
     
  18. AroundTheWorld

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    55,489
    Likes Received:
    27,699
    I just want him to spell it out. It's good when they openly show where they stand.
     
  19. Northside Storm

    Northside Storm Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    11,262
    Likes Received:
    450
    wut

    have you been following events closely? half of the Middle East is in open war with ISIS
     
  20. Northside Storm

    Northside Storm Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    11,262
    Likes Received:
    450
    I don't get what this trope of "what are Muslims doing about terrible ISIS"---I'll tell you what many are doing, they're dying and killing to defend themselves from it.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now