So, basso, you have no support for your statement from the article you posted, which I found interesting but, as I said, showed me nothing new. You only have your personal opinion, which we all have here, and a bunch of photos of fringe anti-war protest groups. Pretty lame, basso, in my opinion. Were I a photoshop guru, I could post a series of photos of Bush, with excepts from the speeches he gave at which the pictures were taken, that were misleading, inaccurate, and simply lies told to the American peiople. That, using my opinion again, which is apparently all you have, is far more damning, as well as dangerous to our country, then anything you've shown us here. Come on, basso... I know you can do better than this. What happened to real discussions based on reality? Keep D&D Civil.
C'mon Deckard, don't you know that that is a comprehensive collection of EVERY SINGLE war protest photo? I mean, if I show some pictures of white people who are in the KKK, that means that there are no white people that are not racist?
here's some more: http://www.cpt.org/iraq/response/06-23-03statement.htm -- CPT Statement: CPTers Freed 23 March 2006 Our hearts are filled with joy today as we heard that Harmeet Singh Sooden, Jim Loney and Norman Kember have been freed safely in Baghdad. Christian Peacemaker Teams rejoices with their families and friends at the expectation of their return to their loved ones and community. Together we have endured uncertainty, hope, fear, grief and now joy during the four months since they were abducted in Baghdad. We rejoice in the return of Harmeet Sooden. He has been willing to put his life on the line to promote justice in Iraq and Palestine as a young man newly committed to active peacemaking. We rejoice in the return of Jim Loney. He has cared for the marginalized and oppressed since childhood, and his gentle, passionate spirit has been an inspiration to people near and far. We rejoice in the return of Norman Kember. He is a faithful man, an elder and mentor to many in his 50 years of peacemaking, a man prepared to pay the cost. We remember with tears Tom Fox, whose body was found in Baghdad on March 9, 2006, after three months of captivity with his fellow peacemakers. We had longed for the day when all four men would be released together. Our gladness today is made bittersweet by the fact that Tom is not alive to join in the celebration. However, we are confident that his spirit is very much present in each reunion. Harmeet, Jim and Norman and Tom were in Iraq to learn of the struggles facing the people in that country. They went, motivated by a passion for justice and peace to live out a nonviolent alternative in a nation wracked by armed conflict. They knew that their only protection was in the power of the love of God and of their Iraqi and international co-workers. We believe that the illegal occupation of Iraq by Multinational Forces is the root cause of the insecurity which led to this kidnapping and so much pain and suffering in Iraq. The occupation must end. Today, in the face of this joyful news, our faith compels us to love our enemies even when they have committed acts which caused great hardship to our friends and sorrow to their families. In the spirit of the prophetic nonviolence that motivated Jim, Norman, Harmeet and Tom to go to Iraq, we refuse to yield to a spirit of vengeance. We give thanks for the compassionate God who granted our friends courage and who sustained their spirits over the past months. We pray for strength and courage for ourselves so that, together, we can continue the nonviolent struggle for justice and peace. Throughout these difficult months, we have been heartened by messages of concern for our four colleagues from all over the world. We have been especially moved by the gracious outpouring of support from Muslim brothers and sisters in the Middle East, Europe, and North America. That support continues to come to us day after day. We pray that Christians throughout the world will, in the same spirit, call for justice and for respect for the human rights of the thousands of Iraqis who are being detained illegally by the U.S. and British forces occupying Iraq. During these past months, we have tasted of the pain that has been the daily bread of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis. Why have our loved ones been taken? Where are they being held? Under what conditions? How are they? Will they be released? When? With Tom’s death, we felt the grief of losing a beloved friend. Today, we rejoice that our friends Harmeet, Jim and Norman have been freed safely. We continue to pray for a swift and joyful homecoming for the many Iraqis and internationals who long to be reunited with their families. We renew our commitment to work for an end to the war and the occupation of Iraq as a way to continue the witness of Tom Fox. We trust in God’s compassionate love to show us the way. Living through the many emotions of this day, we remain committed to the words of Jim Loney, who wrote: "With God’s abiding kindness, we will love even our enemies. With the love of Christ, we will resist all evil. With God’s unending faithfulness, we will work to build the beloved community."
Some more what? There weren't any examples of people unwittingly or wittingly supporting Saddam while protesting the war, and there isn't an example here. Was the comment that someone made that being against Bush automatically means you support Saddam really your definition of supporting Saddam? Because you keep showing no examples of anyone doing anything that gives Saddam a nod of approval, and act like you really believe that helps to back up your argument. I'm really trying to understand where you are coming from on this.
basso, if I take a wild guess as to why you are such an ardent supporter of the Iraq War, it is not so much because Saddam was a threat to the US, but because the Iraq under Saddam was a strategic menace to Israel, is that correct?
couldn't be more wrong. while i'm generally an israeli supporter (they are the only true democracy in the region, a staunch US ally), i am not an israeli apologist. i'm a supporter of the war because, as i've stated time-and-time-again, iraq under saddam was a threat to the security of the US. IMHO, the jury is still out as to whether Saddam was involved in 9/11 (the number of "known and unknown unknowns is staggering), but it's irrelevant. sigh..."INTHEWAKEOF9/11" and knowing saddam's history, his intent, his verified connections to terrorists, and yes, to al queda, it boggles the mind that anyone could honestly believe otherwise. we would have had to confront him at some point, russia and france notwithstanding, or rather inspite of R&F. if there is a criticism to be leveled at bush, and i believe there is, it is that he has not prosecuted the war with the vigor necessary to finish the job. yes, to his enormous and everlasting credit, he has recognized and confronted the initial threat, and once again, to his credit, has understood that we must "stay the course" in iraq. but we must also confront the wider nexus of islamic terrorists and muslim fascism in the mideast. this includes going after syria, putting the screws to saudi, and above all confronting iran. we must not back down from the latter. martyrs do not understand deterrance, and anyone who believes otherwise is either hopelessly naive, in unwitting collusion with our sworn enemies (america's, not bush's) or is in the most advanced stages of BDS (Bush Derangement Syndrome) that they are incapable of recognizing the threat.
No, it's all about 9/11 with basso. It's his opinion that Bush is the only thing saving us from the terrorists, and that the invasion and occupation of Iraq was the correct thing to do, and an integral, necessary part of that larger conflict. He believes the Democratic Party to be unable to fight the terrorists, thus his unflenching support for Bush, regardless of what his other policies do to harm issues he has differing views on, like gay marraige, for example. basso will correct me if I'm wrong. Keep D&D Civil.
If necrophilia turns you on, go for it. I guess you would find that it goes well with an unnecessary war that has produced tens of thousands of dead human beings, of varying sexual orientation, I'm sure. Keep D&D Civil.
WOW...JUST WOW. Everyone on the planet, including Bush, Cheney, Rummy have all given up on the 9-11/Iraq/Osama connection. Only the Bush excuse makers keep using this. Paul O'Neil, and Richard Clarke have both come forth, and exposed the fact that Bush wanted a war from the very beginning, and that 9-11 was the excuse. Its funny that people are SOOOOO energized to send someone else to war and to die for bull**** wars. If your so behind it, why not enlist? If its such an ABSOLUTELY important and integral way of life, what are you doing other then crying at the lib media and not fighting the "good fight" youself. As a vet, to me its embarassing that an awol deserter sends others to do what he couldnt do. Its even more embarassing that people have no problem sending OUR troops to die over such bull****.
I'm not sure if this is a correct characterization. Bush was definitively non-interventionist before 9/11.
Every Intel operation in the U.S. believed that Saddam would neither use WMD or give them to terrorists unless they were attacked, with the exception of 1. That 1 group believed that even if attacked Saddam would not use or give the weapons to terrorits. Saddam's aid of terrorists goes to giving out money to families, a very small portion of which were terrorists who confined their attacks to Israel. That is definitely wrong, but also definitely not a threat to the U.S. Saddam's contact with Al Qaeda members and supporters was only contact and not aid. You can believe anything you want, but if it isn't based in facts then I don't think war opponents are the ones suffering any sort of delusions.
uhm, no: http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/011/990ieqmb.asp -- SADDAM HUSSEIN'S REGIME PROVIDED FINANCIAL support to Abu Sayyaf, the al Qaeda-linked jihadist group founded by Osama bin Laden's brother-in-law in the Philippines in the late 1990s, according to documents captured in postwar Iraq. An eight-page fax dated June 6, 2001, and sent from the Iraqi ambassador in Manila to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in Baghdad, provides an update on Abu Sayyaf kidnappings and indicates that the Iraqi regime was providing the group with money to purchase weapons. The Iraqi regime suspended its support--temporarily, it seems--after high-profile kidnappings, including of Americans, focused international attention on the terrorist group. http://www.cdi.org/terrorism/sayyaf.cfm
That is news to me, thanks for posting it. However it looks like the support from Saddam was stopped, and not an ongoing thing.
read the whole article. and these are only 3 of tens of thousands of documents, still awaiting translation. much of the material is likely mundane, but how can anyone say we know the extent of saddam's support of terroists? in the foreign affairs article that started this thread, also cited by the weekly standard, there's this tidbit:
I can already tell you that it will amount to far less than that of the House of Saud or the Pakistani ISI.
