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Flat Tax Discussion

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Major, Jun 6, 2009.

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  1. Major

    Major Member

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    No. Chrysler investors voluntarily took some cuts - they were not forced to agree to anything. The remaining cuts will be made by a bankruptcy judge, as is determined by US law.
     
  2. ymc

    ymc Member

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    I think printing several trillions is a better flat tax. It has minimal admin cost. Plus, some of that will be paid by foreigners holding USD.
     
  3. basso

    basso Member
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    you have a different definition of "voluntary" than i do.
     
  4. Dubious

    Dubious Member

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    Kudos, I hadn't quite worked up to that realization. Inflation is just an equally applied flat tax that you can spread to all currency holders, even those not subject to your sovereignty: a subsidized recovery program. That Bernanke is a sneaky dude.

    A manageable inflation rate does stimulate consumption by motivating people to make purchases before their money is worth less; but it does require the availability of credit.



    I had been thinking about what the effect would be of just loading up Globemasters with pallets of $100 bills and dropping them off in Beijing . Here's that trillion we owed ya.

    (interesting aside: they said on 60 Minutes tonight that a standard pallet of $100 bills, totals $64 million dollars)
     
    #44 Dubious, Jun 7, 2009
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2009
  5. Refman

    Refman Member

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    Perhaps he has a better understanding of corporate bankruptcy than you do.
     
  6. wakkoman

    wakkoman Member

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    Well, I don't believe they were all gung ho about not being the 1st priority in the pecking order. With reports of the White House using "bully" tactics against some of the Chrysler bondholders as well as companies being refused to pay back TARP money by the administration, there is definitely a lot of politics at play here.
     
  7. juicystream

    juicystream Member

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    Trust me when I say, most pay a lot of tax. Unfortunately I know many people that actually have 50% of their income taken through various forms of taxation. It is simply amazing.
     
  8. juicystream

    juicystream Member

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    Many do not create corps unless they are partners with other doctors. Why do you think it is dumb to run as a sole proprietor? I'm an accountant, so make your answer good.
     
  9. Refman

    Refman Member

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    Maybe, but at the end of the day, the bondholders will likely get more money this way than under a liquidation. The bondholders know that as well.
     
  10. Major

    Major Member

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    Yes, that's probably true. Unlike GM - which was trying to avoid bankruptcy - the government had nothing to threaten Chrysler's stakeholders with since they were going into bankruptcy anyway.
     
  11. Major

    Major Member

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    Then they had every opportunity to not agree to terms and take their chances in bankruptcy, which was the alternative they were facing anyway if the gov't wasn't involved in the first place.
     
  12. real_egal

    real_egal Member

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    It has nothing to do with mortgage interest deduction? Really? They don't give all those deductions as "incentives" to buy a house you can't afford. You are saying it has nothing to do with the subprime mess?

    Flat tax I am talking about is income tax, not payroll tax with ten other extra taxes. Just one tax, one rate (the number can be decided by all parties sitting down together). But, there is no variation, no deduction, no lawyers to "interpret" a simple tax rule.
     
  13. Major

    Major Member

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    That's exactly what I'm saying. Mortgage deductions don't increase the value of what you can purchase - they subsidize the interest rate. But that subsidy hasn't changed. And existed for a long time without any crisis situations or value increases. The primary difference between the US system and the Canadian system (as well as the difference from the US system 20 years ago) is leverage and securitization. The mortgage interest deduction has nothing to do with that.

    If you don't include the payroll tax (where the poor pay a higher rate), you end up with the following:

    $40,000 income pays 15% flat tax + 8% payroll tax = 23% net tax rate
    $500,000 income pays 15% flat tax + 1.6% payroll tax = 16.6% net tax rate
    $3,000,000 income pays 15% flat tax + 0.26% payroll tax = 15.26% net tax rate

    Is that what you want?
     
  14. Refman

    Refman Member

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    The average doctor does not make as much money as you think. There is a romaticized notion of being a doctor immediately making you wealthy. There are lots of wealthy doctors out there, but they are becoming fewer in number.

    Increasing costs for med mal insurance and decreasing payouts by health insurance companies have combined to make it much harder to earn the type of living to justify the expense and work involved in becoming a doctor.

    And no...I did not go to med school.
     
  15. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Why don't they just eliminate the capital gains tax and just count capital gains as regular income???

    I don't trust implementing a flat tax until the loopholes are closed first. And Can someone back up the claim that the u.s. gov't spends upto 600 billion on tax preparation?

    I find that hard to believe.
     
  16. BetterThanEver

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    I like this idea, if the get rid of the 35% tax brackets also. The middle class and the wealthy would be taxed at the same marginal rate of 33%. The middle class would be at 25%(income)+7.65%(fica)=32.65% up to about $200k for a married couple. After 200k, everybody is taxed the marginal rate is 33%(income)+0%(FICA).

    They can lower each bracket by 8%,except the lowest bracket. At least the wealthy be taxed at the same 20% bracket as the middle class then.
     
  17. ymc

    ymc Member

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    Why don't we just print money? Then we don't even need to prepare or collect taxes. Plus, foreigners will also pay to finance our government. :cool:
     
  18. BetterThanEver

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    We have already been doing that. :)
     
  19. ymc

    ymc Member

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    Yeah. But I want more. :cool:
     
  20. real_egal

    real_egal Member

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    I am saying there is ONLY one tax, with a fixed flat rate. It doesn't have to be 15%, it can be 16 or 17 or 18. But ONLY ONE RATE, ONE TAX, ON EVERYONE, for every dollar, NO EXCEPTION, NO DEDUCTION, NO EXTRAS EITHER.
     

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