I agree these type of actions by LE are a problem. Whether it's white nationalists, Islamists, or just desperate people having LE entice people to commit fake crimes and providing them the means to do so I think is very morally questionable.
Jury convicts two men of conspiring to kidnap Michigan governor https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/23/politics/michigan-whitmer-verdict/index.html A federal jury on Tuesday found two men guilty of conspiring to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer in 2020. Adam Fox and Barry Croft face a maximum sentence of life in prison for the kidnapping conspiracy conviction. They were also convicted of one count of conspiracy to use weapons of mass destruction.
Here's the thing. I don't have a hard time believing the FBI entrapped them. They have a long history of this. Doesn't mean I think these dudes are pieces of **** but that also doesn't mean the FBI will use entrapment tactics to pump up their numbers of arrests.
A non circus law enforcement agency won’t use entrapment tactics, won’t falsify emails, won’t lie, won’t employ investigators with a preconceived open bias that is unable to restrain such bias (Not saying it’s not OK to have a political bias against someone you are investigating ..I suppose lol, but if you’re investigating that particular someone at least try to appear non-bias I suppose somewhat) … Seriously what has happened to our FBI? they try to take down trump and lose 5 agents to resignation, firing or an act that could have resulted in prison time for one agent …add the recent entrapment failure? Who is to blame for this or college is not teaching our children properly? I’m concerned about the future of our country if our FBI can’t even open the car door on a road trip Entrapment is illegal, while sting operations are legal. That's why entrapment is a legal defense to criminal charges but can only be applied in certain cases. By definition, entrapment prohibits government agents from: Originating a criminal design.Oct 16, 2020
You really are fixated in this. First this case is nothing like the case involving the search if Mar A Lago. That case there literally have been classified material that was supposed to be turned over and that Trump’s own lawyer attested to had been turned over. It’s hard to claim entrapment when you’ve been found with the actual goods. Next yes the FBI does some very questionable things and I’ve expressed that concern in this very thread. What I don’t do is take a binary view and you have to consider each car in context of the overall. As stated before there are protections through Due Process and nothing shown violates Trump’s due process. One more point that is vey important. This is the fate of a lot of Trump’s most ardent supporters. Many are ending up in jail for actions they’ve done out of radicalization for Trump. Most of them don’t have the resources that Trump has, the army of people passionately defending them, or the deference that the DOJ has shown to a sitting and now former President. These guys are paying the price for a movement that Trump unlikely ever will.
The enemy of your enemy need not be your friend. People can simultaneously dislike Trump and feel the FBI (like many law enforcement agencies) does shady things to gather evidence and get convictions. I for one am not willing to give Trump a pass for his probable unlawful behavior just because the agency tasked with investigating him doesn’t have a clean record. Look at the evidence they gather and present skeptically, by all means, but to dismiss out of hand any investigative findings as illegitimate is simply looking for a reason to exonerate Trump of any wrong doing.
Exactly so and this really goes across the ideological spectrum take absolutist and simplistic stances. In some cases in complete contradiction from previous cases. This is why I was so critical of the Defund the Police movement and of the Minneapolis City Council members that first pushed it. They were reacting reflexively and didn’t even have a clear plan or idea of what that meant. Now you have people who condemned Defund the Police calling to Defund the FBI because they don’t like that Trump is being investigated. Leave aside whether Trump should or shouldn’t be investigated I don’t think any of these people know what the implications of what that would mean.
I’m not sure what you mean by I’m very fixated on this I’m just stating the facts…Five FBI agents had careers short cut by firing, resignations and one criminal act out of the five…Now we see the FBI have a entrapment failure on the cited Michigan investigation..These are facts I’m sorry if you seem like I’m fixated on the facts but I guess I am…I have never seen the FBI have such investigative failure before in my lifetime over the course of a few years that’s a fact as well…I predict we will see more I predict we will see Biden admin being involved in the investigation somehow …not good optics …keep hiding joe just in case. What it comes down to is the FBI is failing us..Whether you are pro-Trump or anti-Trump this is still true.. The DOJ completely failed to convict anyone in the "Gretchen Whitmer kidnapping plot" that the FBI concocted, paid for, directed and orchestrated.…this is entrapment and it’s…not ..legal .someone should have known
Oh by the way I do not want the FBI defunded but I do want it restructured something is wrong with it ..it’s obvious
Not sure about what else you had to say after this but if we can at least agree to what you said here I think we’re getting somewhere so thank you for that! No one is perfect no organization is perfect we all have our biases I mean you wouldn’t want me investigating a democrat if I was a FBI agent I’m sure given my written stances although I promise I would be non-bias and fair..of course But the FBI should be held to a higher standard they are supposed to be the best 35,000+ personnel of law-enforcement and supposed to be highly educated many with post graduate degrees so why are they making these errors no one can answer that apparently
https://news.yahoo.com/3-men-convicted-supporting-plot-151807368.html 3 men convicted of supporting plot to kidnap Gov. Whitmer Three men accused of supporting a plot to kidnap Michigan’s governor were convicted of all charges Wednesday, a triumph for state prosecutors after months of mixed results in the main case in federal court. Joe Morrison, his father-in-law Pete Musico, and Paul Bellar were found guilty of providing “material support” for a terrorist act as members of a paramilitary group, the Wolverine Watchmen. They held gun drills in rural Jackson County with a leader of the scheme, Adam Fox, who was disgusted with Gov. Gretchen Whitmer and other officials in 2020 and said he wanted to kidnap her. Jurors read and heard violent, anti-government screeds as well as support for the “boogaloo,” a civil war that might be triggered by a shocking abduction. Prosecutors said COVID-19 restrictions ordered by Whitmer turned out to be fruit to recruit more people to the Watchmen. “The facts drip out slowly,” state Assistant Attorney General Bill Rollstin told jurors in Jackson, Michigan, “and you begin to see — wow — there were things that happened that people knew about. ... When you see how close Adam Fox got to the governor, you can see how a very bad event was thwarted.” Morrison, 28, Musico, 44, and Bellar, 24, were also convicted of a gun crime and membership in a gang. Prosecutors said the Wolverine Watchmen was a criminal enterprise. Morrison, who recently tested positive for COVID-19, and Musico watched the verdict by video away from the courtroom. Judge Thomas Wilson ordered all three to jail while they await sentencing scheduled for Dec. 15. Defense attorneys argued that the three men had broken ties with Fox by late summer 2020 when the Whitmer plot came into focus. Unlike Fox and others, they didn’t travel to northern Michigan to scout the governor’s vacation home or participate in a key weekend training session inside a “shoot house.” “In this country, you are allowed to talk the talk but you only get convicted if you walk the walk,” Musico’s attorney, Kareem Johnson, said in his closing remarks. Defense lawyers couldn’t argue entrapment. But they attacked the tactics of Dan Chappel, an Army veteran and undercover informant. He took instructions from FBI agents, secretly recorded conversations and produced a deep cache of messages exchanged with the men. Whitmer, a Democrat running for reelection on Nov. 8, was never physically harmed. Undercover agents and informants were inside Fox’s group for months. The scheme was broken up with 14 arrests in October 2020. Fox and Barry Croft Jr. were convicted of a kidnapping conspiracy in federal court in August. Daniel Harris and Brandon Caserta were acquitted last spring. Ty Garbin and Kaleb Franks pleaded guilty.
FBI did it again. Excellent work by the bureau in this case. They've had a lot of successes recently.
