Evil Conservative Christian Gov. Tries to Screw the Poor (Again)

cool as Christmas. honestly, i think his motives are awesome.

oh...but we're not a Christian nation, remember? so now we're forcing the moral ethics of Christianity on taxpayers who are compelled to pay by law...so people who choose not to pay, will go to jail so i can feel better about telling them how their own money should be spent...because of MY interpretations of the words of Christ on charity.

charity is no longer charity when it's compelled through the threat of imprisonment.

 

I wonder what that says about Alabamans, who overwhelmingly support the judge and his garish hunk of stone, but who overwhelmingly rejected the christian faith appeal of their governor when it might affect their wallet?

 

The tax cut is way too big. If he just wanted to improve part of the tax code in the face of unexpected deficits, I could see that. But he wants to overhaul the whole tax system in his state and raise them dramatically after promising NOT to in his campaign.

 

Is there another article supporting your statement "that the same Alabamans that supported the Ten Commandments Monument, does not support this tax change?" Or are you just trying to create hypocrisy?

 

There are multiple articles and polls dealing with this, I don't have time to list them all but this is one of the first that popped up on google. Alabamans created their own hypocrisy, not me:

Poll: Alabama Supports Chief Justice Moore, Ten Commandments
Wednesday, October 09, 2002

By Greg Hoadley

Alabama Supreme Court Chief Justice Roy Moore has the backing of an overwhelming majority of his constituents, as he seeks to protect a display highlighting the moral foundations of American law.

According to The Birmingham News, seventy percent of respondents support Chief Justice Moore's granite display, which includes the Ten Commandments, and statements from our nation's Founding Fathers that document America's Christian heritage. Only twenty percent disapprove of the monument's display, which was privately funded by Chief Justice Moore, and cost the taxpayers of Alabama nothing. The other ten percent were unsure.

"In other words, more than two-thirds of citizens from the great state of Alabama stand by Chief Justice Moore, as he seeks to return American law to its moral foundations," said Dr. D. James Kennedy, founder and president of the CENTER FOR RECLAIMING AMERICA. "The voters of Alabama knew full well that Chief Justice Moore was a man of principle and character when they elected him two years ago, and they continue to stand with him."

 

Since Alabamans overwhelmingly favor the Ten Commandments crackpot and overwhelmingly disapprove of this it's relatively impossible that for their not to be a huge overlap there.

Buck, nobody but conservatives and the religious right put political issues in the context of "evil". So it's a little funny that you'd take a jab at those who aren't conservative by using the word evil in your thread title. Also, your article is a little misleading. Riley didn't start a crusade to raise taxes based on his religious convictions. The media has turned it into that because of the work some lady was doing in the state in Alabama churches, not because Riley set out to do it. This article is an exaggeration.

 

That's not true. I see it from the left on this board plenty.

But, Buck, I wouldn't say no one is talking about it; I heard about it on NPR this morning.

Btw, I think it is a great idea. I had no idea Alabama had such a low threshold for taxation.

MM, I wouldn't think of it in terms of charity. He's using Christian Charity as a motivation to want to support the thing, but I think it is more of an issue of justice, which can only be perpetrated (on Earth) by the State.

 

excellent point. perhaps i read more into it than is really there.

 

Well someone will have to point that out next time.

 

I heard this was voted down.

Too bad.

DD

 

This article emphasizes the media not jumping on this idea. So again, where does this article state (or other articles if you have them) that this SAME group of Alabamas OVERWHELMING (as you now put it) do not approve of the tax break for the poor?

 

I don't care why he wants to cut taxes on the poor, I can stand behind that proposal. Rock on, Riley!

 

Type in "moore" "commandments" and "poll" in google. I already did it for you once, I'm not doing it again.

 

I guess the author of the article missed the Nightline episode a few weeks ago that spent half the show talking about it. If I'm not mistaken Riley's approval is very low, something around 20-30%. The conservatives in the state have dropped him like a bad habit and the Democrats in the state don't trust him. So yes an overwhelming amount of Alabamans are against this for various reasons. A large majority of Alabamans don't support Riley and support Moore, to say there isn't a large overlap is simply not possible.

 

Don't worry about it, there is nothing hypocritcal about supporting the Ten Commandments and opposing taxes.

 

The governor needs a big rock with the scriptures of Jesus stating that helping the unfortunate is helping Jesus - doing his will.

ain't it funny that the Governor is ACTUALLY being a Christian and is hated for it by "good Christians" in the state, while Judge Roy is being anything but a good Christian, and he's got worshippers?

 

Alabamians are wise... let out the inmates and fire the teachers! Woo!

Resounding NO

In defeat, Riley pledges to rebuild trust

09/10/03

KIM CHANDLER
News staff writer

http://www.al.com/news/birminghamnews/index.ssf?/base/news/1063185741142230.xml

Alabama voters crushed Gov. Bob Riley's $1.2 billion tax referendum Tuesday by more than a 2-1 margin after opponents pounded a message that it was too much, too soon and that politicians would only squander the money.

With 100 percent of precincts reporting, the vote was 866,623, or 68 percent, against the plan to 416,310, or 32 percent, for it.

Voters rejected Riley's pitch that the money would be a worthwhile investment in public schools to brighten Alabama's future. A looming fiscal crunch had been described as the perfect storm that could prompt traditionally anti-tax Alabama to approve increases. But Riley found only a tidal wave of opposition from voters that pummeled his camp with a lopsided outcome.

A smiling, upbeat Riley conceded defeat just 90 minutes after the polls closed. Standing before cheering, sign-waving supporters, Riley reached out to opponents of the plan. He thanked them and said he will heed their message and work hard to earn their trust.

"Ladies and gentlemen, I have heard what the people of Alabama have said, and they said very clearly tonight, `We do want you to be good stewards, but we want a smaller government until you prove to us that you are stewards of our money.' That begins also tomorrow," Riley said.

In Jefferson County, a majority in only 12 of 187 polling places voted for the plan. They were all in Mountain Brook, Southside and Avondale. Countywide, the count was 64,322 for and 129,000 against the plan.

In heavily Republican Shelby County, 14,521 voted yes and 35,275 voted no.

Support in Black Belt:

Statewide, the governor's plan won 13 of 67 counties. Its worst defeat came in Cullman and Winston counties, where more than 85 percent of voters cast `no' votes. The strongest vote for the plan was in the Black Belt counties of Macon, Perry and Sumter, where more than 60 percent were for it.

"It's pretty resounding. There's no mistaking the voters' message," said David Lanoue, chairman of the political science department at the University of Alabama. "I think the top reason is voters simply don't trust their politicians in Alabama."

Riley said throughout the campaign that he had never supported a tax increase in his life, but he said Alabama was in a dire financial situation. The plan would have raised property, income and other taxes and given a property tax break to lower-income families. The money would have filled an estimated $675 million budget hole and provided additional money for education.

Hundreds of people packed the Birmingham-Jefferson Convention Complex exhibit hall for a celebration by opponents of the plan. Cheering began shortly after the polls closed, and many held signs or wore shirts and hats that screamed their opposition. Loud boos rose from the crowd as they watched Riley via television as he approached the lectern to concede the election.

"I don't think he can recover from this. He hurt the Republican Party," said Rick Ensley of Pell City. "I don't think he should resign, but I think this will be his last term in office."

Aides to Riley said discussions would start today on how the state will deal with the budget shortfall for the fiscal year that begins Oct. 1. Legislators plan to meet Monday in special session to begin crafting the budgets.

Lawmakers and aides to Riley said they will have no choice but to slash funding for schools and state services.

Richardson's warning:

"It will mean cuts in the budget. The cuts were not some scare tactic. They are real," said Rep. John Knight, D-Montgomery.

State school Superintendent Ed Richardson, who attended Riley's would-be victory party in Montgomery, blamed demagogues for helping to convince voters that state government can't be trusted with more money.

Richardson said state funding for K-12 public schools will be chopped by $100 million, or 3.4 percent, in the new budget. He said he will recommend no new textbooks, no money for teachers to buy classroom materials, and cutting money for technology, library purchases and teacher training.

Richardson warned that without new taxes, 4,000 teachers would have to be pink-slipped before the 2004-2005 school year.

"I would say we are dismantling public education in this state," he said. "You're going to see test scores start to go down, the dropout rate start to go up."

Many voters who liked Riley for governor in 2002 didn't feel the same about his plan. Riley got 672,225 votes in 2002, but just more than 400,000 said yes Tuesday.

The total of 1,282,933 votes cast Tuesday eclipsed the 1,241,091 figure from the 1999 referendum in which Alabamians rejected Gov. Don Siegelman's lottery proposal.

In Shelby County, Ronald Roy had strong words as he left the poll. "I voted no, and I'd vote that way all day if they'd let me," he said. "We already send too much money to Montgomery, and they waste it. Now they want a billion (dollars) more. I say use what you have."

But some voters said they saw the referendum as a chance to get more money to classrooms.

In Section, a city of 769 atop Sand Mountain in northeast Alabama, Debra Hammon, a home economics teacher, said she's had to borrow textbooks for a crowded class.

She said she can't use the cooking equipment because it's too hot with the school's inadequate air-conditioning. She said she voted for the plan to bring in more money for education.

Red-white-and-blue "Vote Yes" signs lined the drive to Riley's home voting place, the Ashland National Guard Armory in Clay County. But Riley lost his home county, where 68 percent of the voters said no.

"I'm afraid if it passes, they'll be back next year wanting more money," said Bennie Mitchell, a disabled telephone company worker.

The income tax portion of Riley's plan would have given a tax cut to most families earning less than $40,000 a year. Supporters reasoned that if Alabama voted its pocketbook, the proposal would pass.

But voters either didn't understand that or disliked the property, cigarette and other tax increases in the plan enough to vote against it.

In Greene County, Danny Tyree, an hourly employee at Hardee's, said he would vote against it even though he would likely see an income tax cut.

A financial mess:

"I don't believe taxes should go up. This is a poor city. This is a poor county," Tyree said.

Riley is not the first Alabama governor to inherit a financial mess and push a record tax increase to deal with it. Gov. Benjamin Miller, who served during the Great Depression, did the same when he proposed a state income tax.

Voters trounced the proposal by a 2-1 margin in a referendum. But later, sobered by the prospect of schools not opening and Miller's assertions that only the rich would pay, Alabamians approved the plan.

Some are already encouraging Riley and lawmakers to follow Miller's precedent and try again with an altered proposal after the effects of the impending cutbacks sink in.

"I don't see it as the end, I see it as the beginning," said Sandra Sims-deGraffenried, executive director of the Alabama Association of School Boards.

But others said politicians should listen to what voters said Tuesday. Russ Fine, a conservative talk radio host in Birmingham, said they'll have short careers otherwise.

"You will do what we say or we will fire you," Fine said. News staff writers David White, Kent Faulk, Darryal Ray, Charles Dean, Thomas Spencer, John Archibald and Patricia Dedrick contributed to this report.

 

Well, this sucks with the budget cuts and all, but I guess only 4 days of school a week isn't going to make the next generation ofAlabamans any dumber than the present one.

 

Jesus loves him, even if Alabamans don't.

Alabama is proud of this:

Khristianity
Konservatism
Konfederacy