Evidence that Hakeem and Akeem whipped Jordan's Bulls

MR. MEOWGI · Feb 11, 2008

Bulls Wilt, Blown Apart by Rockets

Dec 12, 1992

http://www.chicagotribune.com/

link

But when they look in the mirror, they can smile because of the way they made the Bulls disappear with an overwhelming 110-96 victory Friday night at the Stadium.

The Bulls played lamely, shooting 43 percent, relaxing on defense to allow Houston 54 percent shooting, mostly from close range, and committing almost twice as many turnovers as the Rockets.

Coach Phil Jackson chose to paraphrase cartoon character Pogo. "We faced our opponents and our opponents were oursleves," he said. "We were our own worst enemy, although Houston did play terrific basketball. Their speed and size dominated us, and it's the most unselfish we've ever seen them play."

----------------------------------

Rockets Burn Bulls - As Usual

Jan 29, 1993

http://www.chicagotribune.com/

link

The Bulls (28-14) sliced a 15-point lead early in the third quarter to six late in the period and did the same early in the fourth. But the Rockets went on a 12-2 run to build their advantage back to 16 at 78-62 with 7:07 left in the game and then boosted their edge to 19 with five minutes left on a fading, baseline jumper by the villainous Vernon Maxwell-his eighth point in the run.

The Rockets (23-18), as erratic as a highly talented team can possibly be, continued their remarkable streak of success against the Bulls. They have won five straight over the Bulls at the Summit and six of the teams' last eight meetings overall. They have the best record of any Bulls opponent over the last three seasons.

Thursday night's storyline: - The Bulls went to the foul line just eight times, making six of those-season lows for both the Bulls and a Rockets opponent. - The Bulls shot just 42 percent-33 percent and 39 percent in the the second and third quarters-and had a season-low 14 points in the second quarter. - The Rockets, playing before their first sellout of the season, turned the ball over 22 times but outrebounded the Bulls 46-33 and scored 18 points off 16 turnovers. - Hakeem Olajuwon scored just six points in the second half but finished with 18 points, 17 rebounds and five blocked shots. - Maxwell drove Jordan crazy.

Jerry36 · Feb 11, 2008

tinman said:

There is a perception by some members of this board who weren't even embryos when the Dream and Jordan started in this league that Jordan's teams were better than Dreams.

I'm going to drop some facts for you. Not just scores, but articles so you can vividly read what awesomeness was dropped on the Bulls by our Houston Rockets.

I'll be the John Connor of this board and send you back in time. I want to terminate any doubt in your minds which team in red was the better team.

Paper: HOUSTON CHRONICLE
Date: SAT 10/19/1985
Section: Sports
Page: 7
Edition: 1 STAR

Rockets roll past Bulls

By FRAN BLINEBURY
Staff

CHICAGO - Just as the wet floor that briefly threatened to cancel the final exhibition game against Chicago dried up, so, too, have many of the questions concerning the Rockets' backcourt evaporated.

Now while Coach Bill Fitch continues to claim that he doesn't have all his questions answered, there is little doubt that the situation has come much more into focus following two weeks of these glorified scrimmages.

Further evidence of that was the way Mitchell Wiggins and Allen Leavell dominated the Bulls backcourt in igniting the flame in a 105-99 victory over the Bulls Friday night before a crowd of 9,342 at Chicago Stadium.

The win gives the Rockets a final 7-1 mark on exhibition season.

"I guess if you can't be 8-0, you might as well be 7-1," Fitch said. "It's nice, but winning the Grapefruit League doesn't mean anything.

"What I'm happiest about is that we never had to change our perspective on what we wanted to accomplish all through these games. When we were losing leads, we were able to stick with our kids and get them that experience and still come out on top."

But more important than a gaudy exhibition mark, the performance of the backcourt over the last fortnight has got to give Fitch - while not the feeling that he's ready to take on the Los Angeles Lakers or Boston - at least a little more peace of mind.

It was just one more solid performance from Wiggins and Leavell, both of whom have enjoyed very successful training camps. That combination enabled the Rockets to jump out to a 28-11 lead Thursday night in New York and they were the ones who fired up a 26-12 start against the Bulls.

Wiggins uncorked his outside shot, hitting 8-for-10 from the field against the Bulls and popping in 16 points, while Leavell shot over and darted through the Chicago defense for 10 points and 5 assists.

Ralph Sampson and Akeem Olajuwon added 10 points each as the Rockets built a 24-point lead in the third quarter, then held off a late Bulls charge.

Michael Jordan led the Bulls with 31 points.

While that may leave the Rockets with still a few minor questions - such as who to sit down at the end of the bench as the 11th or 12th man - Fitch has got to be satisfied with a guard rotation that will have Wiggins and Leavell backing up starters John Lucas and Lewis Lloyd, with first-round draft Steve Harris playing the role of the designated shooter.

"What I have been happy about, "Fitch said, "has been getting the chance to play different combinations of people together and getting to see what they can do in different situations."

What Fitch has seen is that Lucas, despite any overly offensive tendencies, is still the best ignition key for fast break that the Rockets possess. Meanwhile, Leavell, in training camp, for the first time in three seasons, has played aggressive, smart and heady ball and will not allow the pace of the running game to drop off when he is in the game.

Lloyd is once again filling the lanes at the one off-guard position, while the rededicated Wiggins has shown an ability to play both backcourt spots and continue to the offensive boards.

That has left the Harris to concentrate on just one role - the outside shooter - and the rookie has given indications that he'll be able to get the job done.

With those five apparently locked into jobs, it seems it's going to be a tight squeeze for a job in the final week for Craig Ehlo or Eric Turner. For it is doubtful - especially considering Robert Reid's ability to swing into the backcourt in a pinch - that the Rockets would go with than five guards.

But the ever-cautious Fitch is still issuing warnings about making conclusions.

"I think that if I were going to play one game for all the marbles tomorrow, it would be safe to say that John Lucas would be my starting point guard and Lew Lloyd would be at the other spot," Fitch said. "But beyond that, not everything is set.

"Plus, people like Ehlo and Lloyd can play more than one position. They can go to small forward.

"We've had some guys show that they can do some things well in the exhibition season and other guys who can do other things. So it's not accurate yet to say that all the questions have been answered yet."

Paper: HOUSTON CHRONICLE
Date: FRI 01/16/1987
Section: Sports
Page: 1
Edition: NO STAR

Rockets stymie charging Bulls for 107-96 win

By ALAN TRUEX
Staff

CHICAGO - A very dangerous thing happened to the Houston Rockets early in the third quarter Thursday night.

They got a 22-point lead.

Keep in mind, this is the team that blew a 21-point lead to lose a game to Phoenix a month ago.

The Rockets got their big lead against the Chicago Bulls and tried to sit on it.

So the Bulls came back, knocking 18 points off that lead. But the Rockets still managed to win, 107-96.

The Rockets had to offset a 43-point game by Michael Jordan. They did it by getting 20 or more points from three players: Robert Reid (26), Ralph Sampson (25) and Akeem Olajuwon (20).

The Twin Towers, Olajuwon and Sampson, with 15 and 14 rebounds respectively, dominated the Bulls inside. Olajuwon blocked four shots.

But despite a number of impressive individual efforts, it looked as the Rockets might let this one slip away.

"I saw what was going to happen," Reid said. "We lost that edge, killer instinct. We stood back and watched one man try to take over.

"It seemed like he was everywhere."

The one man was, of course, Jordan, who tied his own team record by taking 43 shots.

He made only 17 of the 43, but he took control of the game for half of the third quarter and most of the fourth.

"In the end," Rockets Coach Bill Fitch said, "we were getting tired, making errors and dropping the ball."

One problem is they are shorthanded, following the banishment of Mitchell Wiggins and Lewis Lloyd for cocaine abuse. Also, reserve forward Buck Johnson has missed 11 games with a hyperextended right knee.

But down the stretch, with Chicago trailing by four, at 88-84 and again at 90-86, Reid hit 20-foot jump shots to keep his team from getting caught.

Chicago Coach Doug Collins said, "These guys are so big they give everyone a problem. Sampson got a great streak going where he was hitting everything he put up.

"And then when we tried to force them to hit jumpers from the outside, Reid hit them.

"They are a poised team, a team that's been to the finals, and the way they played tonight is a sign of a team that's been there before."

Jordan said, "They played well tonight and controlled the inside. They clogged it up and we couldn't get our inside game going. We let them get too far ahead and then used a lot of energy trying to get back into the game."

Jordan was slightly off on his shooting and was suffering from a bruised right shoulder. He hit only eight of 19 shots in the first half as the Rockets ran up a 57-48 lead.

Had it not been for seven turnovers in the first quarter, the Rockets might have buried the Bulls early.

In the first half, Houston shot 61 percent form the floor (to 40 percent for Chicago), and the Rockets had a 30-17 rebounding advantage.

It wasn't that the Rockets were unleashing one of their furious fast-break assaults. They simply waltzed to a number of easy baskets as the Bulls were offering no resistance.

Paper: HOUSTON CHRONICLE
Date: SAT 02/04/1989
Section: Sports
Page: 1
Edition: 3 STAR

Rockets take Air out of Bulls' sails/Defense, balance the difference

By EDDIE SEFKO
Staff

It was a night to be Air or be square.

So the Rockets slicked back their hair, pulled on a pair of glasses with thick, black frames and put on a nerd-inspiring performance.

It wouldn't have appealed to the taste buds of the beautiful people. But at this stage, the Rockets aren't picky about the nature of their wins. They'll put on plaid pants with striped shirts if it'll help the situation.

The Rockets successfully contained the glamorous Air Jordan Show with one of their best defensive games of the season to take a 105-98 victory over the Bulls at The Summit on Friday night.

Defense, the hard-nosed kind, and a methodical, balanced offense - exactly the opposite of Chicago's - were the primary reasons the Rockets were able to bounce back from their loss to the Los Angeles Lakers earlier in the week.

"We did a great job on the defensive end," said Sleepy Floyd, who had 19 points and 8 assists. "We've had better games, but this was one of our best of the season defensively."

How good was it?

Jordan was 1 of 6 in the fourth quarter, when the Rockets stubbornly clutched a lead that bounced from 4 to 10 points.

Overall, the Bulls were 8 of 21 (38 percent) in the final quarter.

They also suffered 22 turnovers, most of them the result of 14 steals by the Rockets.

"Our game was very sound, but our turnovers beat us," Chicago Coach Doug Collins said. "They got 32 points in the third quarter, basically off our turnovers."

The Rockets took the lead for good early in the third quarter when they scored 8 points in 48 seconds on their way to a 73-59 lead. The Bulls never got closer than 4 points the rest of the way.

"I think we played great defense," said Akeem Olajuwon, who had 20 points as all five Rockets starters scored in double figures. "That was the difference in the game."

That and "limiting" Jordan to 29 points, 10 assists and 6 rebounds.

"Limiting" is the proper word since Jordan was 6 points under his average.

There were no 40- or 50-point outbursts by Jordan, the league's best scorer. He's capable of erupting for enormous point totals without notice. But the Rockets contained him with Mike Woodson providing a solid defensive effort and the rest of the Rockets helping to corral Jordan whenever he shook loose.

"Our main goal was to get the ball out of his hands," Coach Don Chaney said. "The guy can score every time he touches the ball. So we tried to make him give it up."

Jordan did, and while Bill Cartwright had 17 points, the Bulls didn't have enough firepower to support their star.

On several occasions, crisp Jordan passes were mishandled or simply weren't seen coming by the intended recipient.

"We let that little trap of theirs really affect us," Jordan said. "We didn't play particularly well, but we still had a chance to win down the stretch."

Indeed they did. The Bulls had stayed even with the Rockets through the first half, which featured 14 ties. Neither team led by more than 3 points in the second quarter.

Early in the third quarter, the Rockets fell behind 55-52 when Cartwright canned a baseline jumper and converted a three-point play.

But the Rockets began heating up from the outside with Woodson (7 of 12) and Purvis Short (7 of 12) igniting an 11-2 surge, which landed them a 63-57 lead.

The smidgen of momentum blossomed into something big, and it didn't take long.

They got ahead 73-59 and seemed to be on the brink of dusting the Bulls.

But, as is their tradition, the Rockets couldn't put the visitors away.

Despite the 14-point lead, the Rockets found themselves nursing an 88-84 advantage with just under nine minutes left in the game.

A Jordan free throw with 5:47 to go kept the Bulls within 92-87, but only served to set up the play of the game as far as the Rockets were concerned.

Floyd took an outlet pass on a fast break and went the length of the floor.

He was fouled on the drive by Jordan and made an incredible, overhead left-handed shot, bringing The Summit crowd to its feet for the first time of the night.

"When it's rolling," Chaney said, "it's rolling."

The free throw put the Rockets up 95-87 and the lead became 10 when Olajuwon hit a shot off a spin move moments later.

The Bulls climbed back into the game behind Jordan, who scored 4 points to help Chicago get within 97-93 with 2:52 to play.

Thorpe, who scored 17 points, then drove through the lane and converted a three-point play with 2:32 to play, lengthening the lead back to 7 points. The Bulls got within 102-98 when John Paxson hit another 3-point shot with a minute to play.

After a Rockets miss, the Bulls had an opportunity to get within 2, but Craig Hodges fired up a hasty shot that clanged off the iron.

Floyd's free throw pushed the lead to 103-98 with 26 seconds to go, clinching the win that moved Houston's record to 26-17.

Afterward, all the Rockets could muster was a sigh of relief.

"To lose this game would have really hurt team morale," said Floyd.

"Now we can put the LA game behind us."

Click to expand...

Those are regular season victories. In the playoffs it's a different story. MJ is not losing in the playoffs, and the record speaks for itself 6-0 in the finals.

ico4498 · Feb 11, 2008

respect to Tinman, one of my fave posters ...

can we get past this? this Rocket fan believes the right Dream Rocks would kill MJ's Bulls in a final matchup. unfortunately, it never happened & won't ever be clearly resolved.

Charlie Thomas & Patterson managed to surround Akeem/Hakeem with the most marginal supporting cast after twin towers and drug busted misadventures. hell, they considered trading Dream fer pocket change! AND lots of so called Rocket fans & local media endorsed Charlie Thomas & Patterson's perspective.

that Dream proved them terribly wrong is an issue worthy of debate. the Bulls v Rockets in the finals is Disney conjecture.

MR. MEOWGI · Feb 11, 2008

Jerry36 said:

Those are regular season victories. In the playoffs it's a different story. MJ is not losing in the playoffs, and the record speaks for itself 6-0 in the finals.
Click to expand...

That's becuase he was too big of a wuss to play the Rockets.

Plowman · Feb 11, 2008

The Bulls simply couldn't match up with us and it showed in the record when they played.

Max defended MJ better than anyone in the League.It was personal and Vernon was always ready for him.

And they couldn't even begin to match up with us on the inside.

It never ceases to disgust me when I hear that junk about asterisks.

MJ sits behind Dream and Magic in my line of favorite players,but C'MON.

Damn those Sonics!

weslinder · Feb 11, 2008

MR. MEOWGI said:

Rockets Burn Bulls - As Usual

Jan 29, 1993

http://www.chicagotribune.com/
Click to expand...

I didn't think you had that headline big enough.

MLittle577 · Feb 11, 2008

Jerry36 said:

Those are regular season victories. In the playoffs it's a different story. MJ is not losing in the playoffs, and the record speaks for itself 6-0 in the finals.
Click to expand...

Bit what else do we have to go on? Dream didn't go to Finals when MJ made it, and MJ was there when Dream made it, so, regular season it is.

Besides, MJ lost plenty in the playoffs himself. Hell, Dream got to the Finals in his second season, did MJ? Sure he lost, but at least he got there. MJ didn't sniff the Finals until five years later.

Angkor Wat · Feb 11, 2008

Dave_78 said:

The Bulls would not have even made it to the Finals at least one of those years that we won the Championship.

I do remember reading a few quotes from Jordan from various sources that gave me the idea that Mike had huge respect for Dream and also seemed to fear him on the court a little bit. I know for a fact that he thinks Dream was the best Center of his era.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Jordan was asked what great Center would he wanted to play with and he said it would be Dream. Oh and the Bulls would have at least made the Finals in those years we won. Remember, Jordan missed a full season and a huge chunk of the next season. Then he went on to help the Bulls win another three titles. I think a Jordan that doesn't retire will get his team in the Finals those years.

kpsta · Feb 11, 2008

Angkor Wat said:

Yeah, Jordan was asked what great Center would he wanted to play with and he said it would be Dream. Oh and the Bulls would have at least made the Finals in those years we won. Remember, Jordan missed a full season and a huge chunk of the next season. Then he went on to help the Bulls win another three titles. I think a Jordan that doesn't retire will get his team in the Finals those years.
Click to expand...

With regard to the second season where he sat out a good chunk of the time, you are completely incorrect about the Bulls making the Finals. He played at as high (or higher) a level in late 94-95 than he did at any other year. Look up his shooting percentages and other stats.

It was his team that could not match up against Orlando. He had to chase around a young, talented Penny... they'd traded away Horace Grant to Orlando. That had the effect of wiping out their interior defense and rebounding. The following year, he had Rodman to shore up that huge missing interior. In 1994-95 Bulls w/ Jordan << Magic <<<< Rockets. That cannot even be debated. End of story.

Desert_Rocket · Feb 11, 2008

MJ in the regular season and MJ in the playoffs aren't comparable. Plus, it took the rockets 7 games combined with some miraculous shots, and Dream partially blocking Starks' 3 in Game 6 to even beat the Knicks much less a Bulls team with MJ.

I would say that the Rockets would have lost to the Bulls in 94 if Jordan hadn't retired, and I think the Rockets would have probably beaten the Bulls in 95 when they had Clyde.

RocketScientist · Feb 11, 2008

WTH took you so long to do this? You obviously realize there have been billions of ascenine arguements brought to Rockets fans over the last 13-15 years about Jordan yada yada yada puke...

Better late than never. Thanks.

MayoRocket · Feb 11, 2008

Great job Tinman. The John Connor thing has me laughing at my desk. Nicely done!

Max, never really stopped Jordan but he made him work as hard as any other defender. The Rockets would definitely have taken the Bulls, I have no doubt.

I really thought it would be the Star Wars series when picked up Barkley and knocked off the Sonics. Then Karla came along and cheated...

tinman · Feb 11, 2008

Jerry36 said:

Those are regular season victories. In the playoffs it's a different story. MJ is not losing in the playoffs, and the record speaks for itself 6-0 in the finals.
Click to expand...

the point is the finals never happened. no matter how many times the terminators try to get john connor they don't and no matter how many times he tries to stop skynet, he doesn't.

they played for pride and honor. jordan didn't 'save his game for the playoffs'.

Jordan did face Hakeem and Akeem
Dream beat him no matter what version of his shoes were out .

Oh Dream made the finals in his second year. It took awhile for Jordan to catch up. I guess some of you 'selectively' forgot that fact.

Rockets2K · Feb 11, 2008

MayoRocket said:

Max, never really stopped Jordan but he made him work as hard as any other defender. The Rockets would definitely have taken the Bulls, I have no doubt.
Click to expand...

that is the thing some dont understand about the really good scorers like a Jordan or Bryant....it isnt a matter of "locking them down", its simple, a player as good at scoring as those guys you can't stop.

What you would consider successful defense against one of them is forcing them to take contested shots everytime, taking them out of their comfort zone so they are less effective creating for themself and others.

No matter what you do, they will get theirs, what you look at is their shooting efficiency to determine if the defender gave them trouble.

I dont think you find anyone in the league that kept Jordan out of his comfort zone like Max did, he was quick on his feet, had long arms and was crazy as hell.

Icehouse · Feb 11, 2008

Angkor Wat said:

I think a big misconception that people make is that Vernon locked down Jordan. That was not the case. The reason we were able to beat the Bulls so many times was a team effort. MJ averaged 29.1 PPG against the Rockets from 90-93. I guess you can say he contained Jordan but it was more a team effort than anything. MJ was always going to get his, you beat the Bulls by stopping their role players.
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone really thinks Maxwell or anyone could "lock down" MJ. Folks think Maxwell and Elie could at least make MJ work for his points (similar to how Battier does now, even thought he doesn't lock folks down).

The Bulls had NO ONE who could contain Hakeem and NO ONE that he had to worry about defensively. I always laugh when folks don't think the 94/95 version of Hakeem would put up awesome numbers against the Chicago big men when he was putting up 30+ a game against the likes of Ewing, Robinson and Shaq...all while having to hold them each on the other end. Much like MJ was able to rest on defense during that second 3-peat since Pippen and Harper were holding everyone, Hakeem would get to do the same thing against the Bulls and just play help defense. And I would argue that he was the best help defender ever....

Folks say "what would you do against MJ" but don't realize that we had the biggest matchup problem, not them. It's no wonder that teams with worse centers that could score came the closest to beating Chicago (NY with Ewing, Ind with Smits, Magic with Shaq).

Icehouse · Feb 11, 2008

Jerry36 said:

Those are regular season victories. In the playoffs it's a different story. MJ is not losing in the playoffs, and the record speaks for itself 6-0 in the finals.
Click to expand...

As last years GS/Dal series shows you, the playoffs are all about matchups. Chicago struggled against teams with centers, and they never faced one as good as Hakeem. Our title Rocket teams struggled against teams with stud PG's and PF's. Chicago had neither.

FYI, MJ has lost in the playoffs on many occassions. He didn't start playing basketball in 1991....

tinman · Feb 11, 2008

Angkor Wat said:

Yeah, Jordan was asked what great Center would he wanted to play with and he said it would be Dream. Oh and the Bulls would have at least made the Finals in those years we won. Remember, Jordan missed a full season and a huge chunk of the next season. Then he went on to help the Bulls win another three titles. I think a Jordan that doesn't retire will get his team in the Finals those years.
Click to expand...

yeah and if i had superpowers i could fly and the ring of power i can control all of middle earth too.

there is no would have. what if Len Bias didn't die? google that up.
What if they didn't hire Phil Jackson.

Hey Angkor, what happened to the entire decade of the 80s?
Angkor - he would have won 6 more championships right if he had played in the 80s

Icehouse · Feb 11, 2008

Desert_Rocket said:

MJ in the regular season and MJ in the playoffs aren't comparable. Plus, it took the rockets 7 games combined with some miraculous shots, and Dream partially blocking Starks' 3 in Game 6 to even beat the Knicks much less a Bulls team with MJ.

I would say that the Rockets would have lost to the Bulls in 94 if Jordan hadn't retired, and I think the Rockets would have probably beaten the Bulls in 95 when they had Clyde.
Click to expand...

You do realize that some of those Bulls/Knicks series went 7 games, right? And Ewing << Hakeem....

tinman · Feb 11, 2008

Desert_Rocket said:

MJ in the regular season and MJ in the playoffs aren't comparable. Plus, it took the rockets 7 games combined with some miraculous shots, and Dream partially blocking Starks' 3 in Game 6 to even beat the Knicks much less a Bulls team with MJ.

I would say that the Rockets would have lost to the Bulls in 94 if Jordan hadn't retired, and I think the Rockets would have probably beaten the Bulls in 95 when they had Clyde.
Click to expand...

what miraculous shots Desert Rocket? what a simple 3 point by Sam Cassell?
What did OJ Simpson throw a hail mary?

Dream blocking Starks? you mean a good defensive play by the MVP of the league and the guy with the banner in the Toyota Center as the most block shots of all time?

Oh I get it.. Its has to be a MIRACULOUS SHOT for the Rockets to win, but for MJ its expected. Gotcha. Still waiting to figure out what Miraculous shot against the Knicks..you are CONJURING UP..I mean talking about

plutoblue11 · Feb 11, 2008

Icehouse said:

You do realize that some of those Bulls/Knicks series went 7 games, right? And Ewing << Hakeem....
Click to expand...

Rockets went 7 with the Suns (in 95) and went 7 Knicks (in 94). The Bulls in their 96 title run beat three great centers....Mourning, Ewing, and Shaq. The numbers say that weren't as much as non-factor as this board is making them out to be.

The Bulls were the best team on the block in 90s, if they weren't they wouldn't have won 6 titles.

The what if game is all speculation....like if the Pats lost the Colts or Ravens this year....they might've won the Super Bowl, because they would've been more focus throughout the seasons and playoffs.

Maybe the 2000 Yankees could be the greatest dynasty in history, if they would've beaten Arizona and Florida in game 7 and finished off the Red Sox.

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