All of the b****ing has made me almost wish that the Texans would just go away. It has really ruined it for me. I love football and I can't hardly stand to hear about my own team.
Plummer knows the system. Sage is work in progress and may be a career backup. Kubiak favors QB's that can throw on the run. If we drop Carr for a 3 or 4 rounder, pickup Plummer, and draft Kolb, I will be happy. I was one that was hoping Carr did well, but sometimes you just need a change and Kolb could be that local hero we need to silence some of the VOF.
it's not what i saw; it's not what you saw, either - it's what the coaches saw. and carr beat rosenfels out last year and started every single game. don't like david carr; fine. i don't have a problem with that - but don't put things through your "i dislike david carr" filter - it's disingenuous. i mentioned the first tennessee game - he was terrible and likely cost us the game. otherwise, in the home game against the titans, carr led them to a game-tying FG and never saw the ball again after that. in the giant game, lundy dropped a pass on the opening drive that would have converted a 3rd down (brown then missed the FG) and cook fumbled at the giant 38 with 5 minutes remaining and the team down 4. against the bills, cook fumbled again (this time at the bill 13) and the team STILL was in position to win but the defense gave up a GW TD pass by jp losman with :09 remaining. that's not to absolve carr of any blame, but to BLAME him outright....? no, sorry; it doesn't float.
and Carr has differed how? carr is still starting because of how much he makes...not because he is so good if you are right about Sage, then they get a high pick....if he can play, well whatddya know!
I doubt Sage really had the opportunity to put Carr on the bench. Carr was going to be the starter Remember - For evaluation purposes this year
who's blaming Carr outright? this isn't even an argument anymore. everyone in Houston and across America knows that Carr has been as much of the problem as anythign else with the Texans. you don't have to always win games on final drives. you can win them beforehand. but if final drives are important, it's not like the Texans even tried to win the 2nd Titans game even though they got the ball back, with time on the clock..."oh no, we're on the 7 yard line and we have David Carr at quarterback!!! Let's not screw this up an dplan for overtime."
Did he really beat Rosenfels out, or was he given the job because the team was committed to him? Starting QB's often just get the job rather than truly competing for it on the field. The problem with this is that the people that believe Carr cost us a few games don't look at it as a few plays here and there. You're assuming the rest of the game would have been the same. The other viewpoint is that in all these close losses, a better QB makes a few more plays throughout the game. Maybe a FG turns into a TD. Maybe instead of a 3-and-out, they go 6-and-out and get better field position, turning an opponent FG into a punt, etc. As a result, a close loss has the potential to become a close win. Is it provable? Of course not. But if you believe Carr was a disaster of a QB, it's not a stretch to believe that a decent QB would have made more plays.
Romo couldnt beat out Carter, Wright, Vinny, Bledsoe, Henson...and now look at him. Im not comparing Sage with Romo, but just because he has been 2nd string in the past, doesnt mean he cant do the job now.
Thanks Ric- good response and reasonable I realize that Sage is not much of a choice. I think he has better pocket presence than Carr when I watched him. I think he had decent reads at least against the Titans and made some nice plays in the 2nd half of that game. Although I would like for Carr to improve his pocket presence, his reads on 3rd down and his deep throws- I don't think he should be brought back. My reasoning is that if Carr comes back and regresses any at all or flounders early then we have a big distraction and it could shake the team. I would rather see Carr get a fresh start somewhere else, then continue to improve both our Oline and Dline, add another LB and try to upgrade the secondary- all in the draft. We have to come up with a better RB also. We need a huge draft this off season IMHO
Well said. With his 2006 performance, David convinced me overwhelmingly to reverse my position 180 degrees. I still love the guy, but he needs a change of scenery. And the Texans need a different QB. Blame for losses is really a strawman in this discussion. The real question is, can the Texans build a winning tradition with David Carr at QB? The answer, IMO, is "no."
well, let's see... you, when you said carr's mere removal would translate to a few more wins next year. right, namely because those few plays here or there would seem to exonerate carr from total, or even partial blame for the losses in question. hold on - i'm not "assuming" anything, major; i'm relaying what actually happened on the field of play. these are indisputable facts. you could certainly argue carr could have done more; and i said as much. but to hang the losses on him and assume better results had he not been there is (and continues to be) irresponsible. and also an assumption. now these, major, are assumptions. if you want to deal with what actually happened, then find reasons to blame carr for those 3 losses - you know, like fumbles, missed FGs, losing the coin toss; otherwise, i'm not terribly interested in going round and round on what might've been.
When the Texans first started playing here, I had high hopes that we weren't going to be an expansion team like the Browns (2nd time around) who blew their 1st pick on a sorryass QB in Tim Couch. Fast forward to today...well...it's just pretty sad.
The argument you present, based on those undeniable facts, most certainly does depend upon the assumption named by Major. And they're very reasonable ones. Just as reasonable--even more so--than the default assumption above.
no, not really; people are theorizing a mere change in QBs will translate to more wins next year. that's not a strawman argument. when asked to clarify which games carr cost the team in '06, 4 were cited and 3 were clearly NOT games carr cost the team. not outright, anyway. he played well while others failed - would removing those failures (cook and brown and the entire defense) translate to more wins next year....?
But then you let them win. David Carr was not the reason we lost three of those four games. It's absurd that anyone would even argue that.
if you mean i'm assuming the texans would have won all those games without the aforementioned issues; then that, my friend, is a strawman, for i never said, nor even implied that. the games are what they are: losses; we're merely discussing how to properly (and fairly) allocate blame.
Everything you just posted applies to the rest of the team as well. Instead of arguing about them as well, we've decided to focus solely on one player. Nah, let's not blame the defense for giving up two 83 yard TDs in one quarter or the FB fumbling the ball twice in very important situations, let's focus solely on the QB.
Humbug to the entire discussion. The only thing folks should be concerned about is how the Texans can build a winner--in the sum total--from this point forward. I don't believe they can do that with DCarr, as much as I like the guy. I believe they need to address a lot of holes, and I believe they now have the management to do it.
u arent wrong...but this goes back to why they fire managers/coaches when they arent the ones not executing bottom line is that regardless of who's fault it is...even if its no one in particular...the position that seems to make the biggest difference to a team when u change it is, infact, QB
No, that's not what I mean at all. That is the assumption to which I refer. Change out a key position like QB, and the dynamic of the entire game is different. It is wild-assed speculation to say that the Texans win *any* of those games if someone else is QB; it is also wild-assed speculation to say that the game goes the same way with a different QB. Are the Texans down 4 when homeboy fumbles, or are they down 21, or are they up 3? Humbug to the whole discussion. Too many variables to fool with; no way to gain empirical evidence. It's far simpler: can the Texans build a winner with David Carr? No, they can't. (IMO)
