We'll trade Carr for practically nothing and then get a cap hit...Not sure how big, but it has to hurt... Jake yes, draft Kolb, hell yes...
sure...keep telling yourself the team believes in Carr. they don't. If Plummer comes in and is basically the same quarterback from a skill perspective, but plays with passion and displays leadership, the team as a whole will improve.
of course; all things being equal, i'm with ya. but they're not equal. i'll try and lay this out as best i can, since it bores me, too. carr's set to make $5M (i'm rounding down to make the math easier) in '07 and $6M in '08. he's also still owed $4M of the $8M buyout, which they can prorate over this and next year, so add $2M a year to his salary. 07: $7M 08: $8M but only the $4M buyouy money is guaranteed. if they cut him, they can absorb the $4M hit all this year, or spread it out over this and next year - $2m/each, but it's a little more complicated/involved than that. if they trade him, the $4M accelerates this year, no ifs ands or buts. so the bottom line: carr is going to cost you at least $2M, more likely $4M this year. with rosenfels and, let's say a 2nd round pick, that would come to (VERY roughly) $7.5M (or $5.5M if you can spread out his bonus, but then you're paying him $2M next year). and that's BEFORE you've signed plummer, who, i believe, made somewhere north of $7M this year... maybe as much as $10M. in my mind, plummer absorbs carr's salary, so you're essentially paying plummer whatever he gets + $4M... and frankly, i don't believe plummer's worth much beyond $4M, so, unless he's willing to play for free.....
what games this year would the texans have won if carr hadn't been here and/or the team had believed in him? i can think of one: at tennessee, a game that, with decent QB play, is probably a W. as for players not believing in him, i've seen no evidence of this, save for dunta's post-patriot comments; but a week later, many players spoke up for carr after the colt win, so... i'm not buying it. i'm just not. what players "believe" in is success.
i'm sorry; i know everyone loves the back-up, but rosenfels couldn't beat out jay fiedler, ray lucas, brian griese, aj feely or gus frerotte in 4 years with miami. do you really want to turn a full 16-game schedule over to him? it has disaster written all over it.
It's not absurd. This team needs to get rid of the aura of losing and David Carr's face is the one that embodies that...right or wrong. That's not to mention that the moment they were to announce that David Carr is back with no competition for next season, season tickets would stop selling immediately. You can't possibly believe that this doesn't play into the minds of Bob McNair and Rick Smith. I'm not sure if Plummer would be better or worse. I do know that he has had his best successes with Kubiak and he has won. It's called change for the sake of change. I still think that Carr can be a good NFL qb...just not in Houston. He needs to go. They need to move on. I don't think he's the reason they've sucked so bad, but he is the face of it, period. I don't hear people blaming Seth Payne, Kris Brown, or Chad Stanley (the only other original Texans). Carr needs to be traded to whomever will take him and give us a hopefully a first day pick.
No, there's purpose behind it and good sound reasoning supporting it--some of which you've detailed here. It's not "change for the sake of change" at all. It's change for the sake of advancing both parties. Change for the sake of change isn't worth the change in your pocket.
This is a business. If McNair thought that dumping Carr and going a different direction would turn things around and generate money sooner, he would be all over it. McNair is a business man Business is what he does. That's just the kind of thing a business man does.
Both Tennessee games. Giants. Bills (defense may have given this game away, but then again, the Dunta touchdown was the reason they were ahead). That's 4 games. Win 2 instead of lose, and the Texans are 8-8.
So, not believing in Carr is why the Texans defense gave up two 83 yard TDs in one quarter and why Jameel Cook fumbled a ball twice, once on the game winning drive? It's drivel like this that almost makes me want Carr back next year.
There's different aspects of money to an organization than just salary cap. For instance, fans and season tickets. Carr has been run out of this town by the fans, plain and simple. You move him for whatever you can, show the fans you care (about their wishes and the direction of the football team) and hope to sell more season tickets with the promise of a better team. (and better QB as far as they're concerned.) Personally, I believe the Texans had a good year, despite Carr. There was a poll on here wondering if we'd even get 5 wins, most said no IIRC - we got 6 wins. I think at the end of the season, a lot of people forget about their original expectations and just see another lottery team. Was Carr holding us back from .500 or playoffs? Of course not, but I don't think he helped us to our 6 win record either. Too lazy to look it up, but I think the last two games of the year Carr had the lowest throwing attempts for the season. (Except the game he was benched, but he was on pace to have more that game, too.) To me that shows Kubiak has lost confidence in him.
why smith? his job is to build a winner, not sell tickets. and mcnair certainly didn't let box office impact what the team did with last year's draft; i don't see why this decision would, or why they'd throw gasoline on that draft decision (passing on young) by admitting their mistake a year later and dumping carr. why would people blame a back-up DT, kicker and/or punter for a team's struggles? have those positions EVER been blamed (aside from game to game)? and for the record, mckinney, pitts and weary (along with faggins & wong) are all original texans, too, and yeah, while not singled out, they're blamed A LOT for being part of one of the worst offensive lines in league history five years running. should we jettison those three as well?
I really don't see the point of Plummer instead of Rosenfels. But Plummer did lead his team to the AFC Championship and a 13-3 record and had 22-7 int/td ratio. Plummer is a decent starting QB in the NFL, wayyyyyyyyy better than Carr, and he would be fine in the short term while we develop the future QB. BTW the Broncos offense and Plummer performed much worse than they did last yr, without Kubiak. The guy can coach QB's, but David's problems are beyond coaching.
What did you see in rosenfels play last pre-season and the game against the Titans that makes you think he can't beat out Carr? Except that he hasn't played very much here, I can't think of one reason that he would be worse then Carr as far as wins. Saying he couldn't beat out that list of QB's is assuming he was given the chance and that he hasn't developed or improved up to last season. I would rather have Sage over Carr and that sadly defines my view of the Carr experiment. Just mentioning Sage as a possible replacement pretty much sums up the Carr legacy. I don't like Plummer either, but desparate times calls for...
Ignoring the fact that we had opportunities to win all these games, either on last drives, or before hand, is the reason David Carr is still the quarterback. Does his teammates not believing in him play a role? Abso-freaking-lutely. Carr started the Bills game by throwing an interception. That happened before the Bills scored.
Jake will start. . . Carr will sit a year in 2008 Carr will start again . or start being 'worked into the lineup' Rocket River
I hear you, but ironically enough, it's drivel like this that makes me NOT want him back. I'm just tired of the whole subject. I'm ready to move on.
good god, i got sucked into another one.... did it seem like that was a concern when they passed on reggie bush and vince young last april? this team has NEVER given in to the fan demands. carr had several bad games, but like there's anyway this team's would have beaten the cowboys or patriots on the road with a different QB? no way. the game at tennessee stands out as the one he really cost us. BUT... they lost twice on the final play of the game with the defense on the field. it cuts both ways... he converted a third down and threw the pass that set-up the GW FG against the colts in the second-to-last game of the season. doesn't really scream lack of confidence. i posted this elsewhere, but, iirc, he threw 4 more passes in the first 8 games than he did in the final 8 games. or averaged 4 more a game; something along those lines. there were certainly GAMES in which kubiak lost confidence, but overall, the numbers don't necessarily back that up.
