Hutz -- I love Mario. He was the icon of ClutchCity for years. Sorry about calling him a vulture. It's just a metaphor. All I meant is that he cleans carcasses that have been killed by others. You can substitute some other word for vulture if you like. Maggot, for example.
Will you make me wonder about you some time, everyone says you are so smart and here you go confusing a maggot with a taxi-dermist!!!! DUKE DUKE DUKE DUKE OF SYNONYMS!!!
Freak, if trading wives was a standard practice in marriage, like trading players is in basketball, then yes, that would be OK. Trades happen every year in basketball. If you've got the feelings of a little kid, then you shouldn't be in the sport. My point is that everyone says you can't talk bad about Mario because of the Kiss of Death, despite the fact that he walked his way through the last half of 1998.
I'd probably still like Mario if it weren't for the fact he gave that "kiss of death" salute to the Rockets, too. Once that fat-faced jackass did that to the Rockets he became nothing more than "a dog", not "the junkyard dog". ------------------ <this space for rent>
Mario Elie is one of the most intense players in the game. Haven't any of you ever heard of Larry Bird? Earlier this year he said that he wouldn't even talk to his opponents and there was no competitiveness in the NBA anymore. Elie should give the Rockets whatever he feels, he helped them get two championships, and then they traded him! You're only ticked off because he beat us by playing his game on a team that suits his talents. For those of you who say he was a vulture do you forget that he was a STARTER on the best Rockets lineup EVER? Olajuwon, Horry, Elie, Drexler, Smith You don't get to be a STARTER on a team that sweeps the NBA finals by being a loser! No offense Will, you are entitled to your opinion, but you people are a bunch of whiners jumping on the most ridiculous bandwagon I've ever read in this board. Elie isn't an offensive star, but he was damn sure a great player. The guy has some serious mileage and it is a wonder that he can even contribute any more.
Forgive me if i'm wrong, but didn't I sign with the Spurs? If not, then who did I get traded for? -Mario. p.s. Tough loss for stevie and cuttino tonight- it just seemed that penny and rogers couldn't be stopped.
DR -- I don't mean to take anything away from Mario. He was totally clutch for two years. But here's the difference: Take away Elie, and Hakeem Olajuwon has at least one ring. Take away Hakeem and Tim Duncan, and Elie has none.
Take away Horry and Hakeem has no rings. Take away Drexler and Elie has one ring. Take away Hakeem and Drexler has no rings. Take away Smith and Drexler has no rings. Take away Thorpe and Cassell has no rings. We all know that Hakeem was the best player on the Rockets, but Elie did a great job. That doesn't make him a vulture. Is Drexler a vulture because he would DEFINETLY not have won a ring by himself. He had his chance to carry a team to a championship, but he coudn't get it done. These comparison's are pretty ridiculuous. The bottom line is that Elie was the smallest forward in the league when he started at SF and he defended the best players in the league every night. While he was doing that he scored about ten points a night by shooting threes, opened up the paint for Hakeem, and nailed clutch free throws and technicals when we needed them the most. To top it off he made the Kiss of Death shot which without, despite Hakeem and Clyde's heroics, the Rockets would have gone down in the NBA history books as the team that barely beat New York in a very ugly year for the league. The Kiss of Death epitomized Elie's play. He had fantastic concentration, wasn't afraid of anything, and had a very steady hand when it counted. I have no idea why everyone doesn't love him. If you want to hate someone, hate Barkley. He pushed Hakeem in mid air at the end of a playoff game causing Hakeem to land directly on his as*. Hakeem could have broken his tail bone and missed the rest of the playoffs. That's enough for me to hate him - he has the self control of a childish bully. Yet everyone is in love with Barkley?
<a href="http://apps3.vantagenet.com/zpolls/poll.asp?id=137132715">Click Here To Vote On What You Think of Mario Elie</a> <a HREF="http://apps3.vantagenet.com/zpolls/count.asp?rlt=137132715&id=137132715">View Results</a> ------------------ ~John~ Trade No One and Keep Rudy T. JohnyRocket's Fan Site [This message has been edited by Johny Rocket (edited March 07, 2000).]
Doctor -- thank you very much for expressing how those of us who are lifelong Elie fans feel about his irreplaceable contributions to the Rockets' two titles. Your points about who would have won how many rings are right on. Da Dakota -- Elie was just as instrumental in the first title run as the second. He was playing better the second year in the playoffs (everybody was -- that team would have swept the Rockets team from the year before, and also would have beaten any bulls team IMO), but his statistics from the regular season were comparable, if not slightly worse, than those from the Rockets' first title. Year 1, 93-94: 24.0 mpg, 9.3 ppg, 3.1 a, 2.7r Year 2, 94-95: 23.6 mpg, 8.8 ppg, 2.3 a, 2.4r his shooting percentages were higher in year 2, but to say he was less of a factor in the first title is completely bogus. Not only that, but for all of the Elie-haters in here, Mario continued to kick ass for 2 more years, playing better than ever. I'm with Doctor Rob on this one. How the hell can anyone on this board harbor ill will toward one of the ultimate ballers to ever play here? Yeah, Elie was pissed during his last year here, but he was pissed because the team wasn't winning and they tried to trade him to freaking Canada, all the while making it pretty clear that Elie was a very tradeable commodity. I would have been pissed too! So he has some pride. JYD is the man -- has anyone noticed that the guy hasn't missed a 3 in houston for like 2 years? I respect that.
Good for you JR, why don't you go root for San Antonio? And while your at it, let whomever roll over you in your life, including your significant other, friends, or anyone else. If Mario gets upset enough about almost being traded to QUIT on the team, and you think that's OK, because he had a few good years here, then I wish that I was your kid. Think about it. If I came in an hour early for curfew for a whole year, then JR would have no problem with me going out and getting high and impregnating women, because, as you know, there were many times when I'd come in earlier than curfew, so whatever I did after that really didn't matter.
Too bad Mario wasn't smart enough to "dream" up some phantom condition in his last year with us. Then he could put forth even less effort--say...as much as Hakeem has this year--and then he could have left the Rockets as a hero.
Take away '93-'95 and the Rockets have no rings. The facts are that we needed a ROLE PLAYER during those years and ELIE just HAPPENED to be that guy. Vulture?? Metaphorically precise... character wise, maybe not. He is/was however to move on when he did. Who can blame Elie for going where the "fire" and desire to win seemed strongest? And as far as business goes, you'd be an ignoramous to not take more money. It was time for him to make a move. Loved him while he was in Houston, great memories... "Kiss of Death" shot will ALWAYS be one of the biggest, best, most loved plays for me personally, especially since I saw it live... that will never drop below the top five plays ever in Rockets' history on my list. But then he got a little too whiny and aired some otherwise private and unnecessary remarks to the media, instead of being professional... EXACTLY the precursor to Mr. Quitten himself. A MAJOR blemish on an otherwise awesome career in Houston for a fan favorite... a shame, but hey sports get that way. At the same time the famous "Kiss of Death" went through the hoop, I was also anti- Sir Charles, not the person, but I didn't like him playing against us... didn't like his mouth (although if it wasn't a comment against Houston, I thought it was hilarious), his comments about Chucky Brown made me furious... but then sign him to our team, and then -as a part of NBA "fan's rights" to be loyal to their teams- I HADD to root for him, and technically he's still a Rocket, and will stay that way, so I'll like him from here out. I didn't like the Blazers either when Drexler was there... once again, how could I like the opposition? But the guy back in his hometown, and it's like "permission" to cheer him on. So take a town hero, one Mario Elie, get him whiny, and malcontented, ship him off whining all the way... and OOOOPS, he's not a Rocket now, can't cheer him on... only remember what he was.... once upon a time. Dream however, whether traded or not will always be someone I'd follow. He's meant too much to Houston and me personally. Similar to the way Earl Campbell, Nolan Ryan, Warren Moon, Moses Malone were so important... names synonymous with Houston sports. ------------------ Proud Father of the Rockets' future point guard.
R95, you can't come out and say that trading wives isn't a standard practice, and then continue to refer to Elie as a member of a family. Make family analogies if you must, but you can't have it both ways. If he really was a member of the Rocket family, then what the Rockets did was crap on one of their own family members. If it's just business and a game, then what happened was no big deal and Mario shouldn't have been offended, nor should you. If you're going to continue to say "if your wife did this, or if your son did that", it's perfectly acceptable to counter that with "if your parents tried to trade you to another family, what would you do?".
Freak, you don't get what I'm saying. Have you ever heard of parents or spouses trying to trade their children or significant others away? When you use analogies, you try to find comparable events. Trading a basketball player and trading a family member are not comparable things. Lets try this: Let's say that you're married. You're struggling financially. You ask your significant other, who you love with all of your heart, to go get a job to help support the family. This happens all the time in familial relationships, just like trading players happens all the time in professional sports. So instead of going and attempting to help the family finanically, the significant other sits around, does nothing, stops taking the kids to school, stops helping out around the house as well, then decides to leave for another person who's finances do not require work. Elie, pissed off about the fact that he was almost traded, quit on the team, pouted, became a cancer to the team, and then left for the Spurs. All I have to say about this is that I'm so happy that Robert Horry doesn't have the character of Mario Elie. Think of it, Horry was actually in Detroit. He and Bullard were Pistons (Elie was never a Raptor). They flew to Detroit and passed their physicals. If Eliott hadn't of failed his physical, they may still be Pistons. But after he did fail his physical, Horry came back and played his ass off for the Rockets. He was a key player in the championship run that year and the next. He didn't pout or become a cancer to this team. Thank God he didn't.
AAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! PLeasE PleasE puhleaze stop with these strange analogies. Just state it and be done with it. Sometimes you just got to agree to disagree. Bottom line - Elie WAS important to the Rockets success. Elie WAS part of the Rockets past. NOW Elie is old and on another team. e o m . . .
The personality trait that made Elie so disenchanted after the botched trade is the same trait that made him such a great competitor when he was here (and now while he's in SA). The people who hate Elie now for this characteristic, loved it about him before he left. It's a double-edged sword -- one that the Rockets felt both sides of. But we profited a lot more from the one side than we were hurt by the other. If you want to be bitter about it forever, that's fine. I for one respect Elie for his personality. It made him a real warrior the likes of which you very rarely see in the NBA. No Rocket has ever taken the game so personally, not even Dream.
