You're using hindsight to support your argument... which is ridicuolous. At the time Roy (and Lance) both signed their contract, they were getting top dollar/the going rate for an ace pitcher and perenial MVP candidate. It just so happened that the year after that, salaries started skyrocketing into oblivion... where average players were getting ace money, and ace pitchers were getting ransoms. However, none of this was known or expected when Drayton signed them. Hell, several here, and in the media, criticized the length of the deal... stating that we'd be paying Roy $15 million a year when he's past his prime in 5 years. Now, it seems laughable to get a pitcher of his calibur at that rate.
Roy isn't going to get traded! Plain and simple. He is the anchor in the front of the pitching. The only and I repeat ONLY reason he gets traded is if he has arm or health problems. As it stands, Roy is going to be a Cy Young winner at some point. He just needs some motivation behind his team. He is still totaly capable of getting his ERA under 3.00.
IMHO trading Roy O in a deal greater than Santana or Bedard brought back makes great sense to me and is a real possibility to accomplish. It is one which should happen - to build a team which could reasonably contend for 5 years (while wishing it had an ace like Roy O).
No player on any team should be off limits. Not Yao, not Oswalt or Berkman, not Andre Johnson. Sports teams should always listen to offers. I have been a proponent of shopping Oswalt for 2 years, not because I don't think he is great, but I don't think we can be serious contenders without trading one of our stars and re-building our minor league with top prospects. Oswalt only pitches every 5 days. If the right offer comes along and Roy agrees with the trade, the Astros should jump on it. They won't though, because Roy is part of Drayton's good ole boy club and he will be an Astro until he retires just like Biggio and Bagwell. Blind loyalty to multi-millionaire baseball players is idiocy. Try and get a loyalty discount the next time a superstar comes up for a contract and see where it gets you.
With respect and fan-fav-dom to Lance Berkman I also think he would be an even greater asset on the market. IMHO this franchise has to rebuild to contend seriously. Seriously.
rebuild with miggy and lee after this year, not with homegrown players. also I oppose any rebuilding by trading these assets unless the deal is very very fair.
Well what do you consider fair? I would need to get back a Felix Hernandez or Cole Hamels-type pitcher in return for starters as well as a really good position player and a top prospect. Now do you really think we could get that in a deal? Someone posted what to ask the Red Sox for in jest, but I'd seriously need some of those players in order to let go of Roy. If the Red Sox needed pitching, do you think they'd give up: Jacoby Elsbury (OF) Jon Lester (SP) or Clay Buchholz (SP) Jed Lowrie (SS) Theres no way they'd do it. The Mets traded for Santana and didn't even give up their best prospect. If you traded Roy, you would never get back a "fair" return. Teams are less willing to give up young major league level talent due to escalating salaries. Its much easier to draft and develop than to continue to but free agents. Regardless of what happens this season, IMHO Roy will not get traded.
You wouldn't be able to rebuild the minor leagues by trading Roy. Roy would bring one, maybe two top level prospects. Even top level prospects sometimes do not pan out. Remember Chris Burke? He was a number 10 overall pick and was highly regarded. He went into tonight's game batting .139. You mean an offer that would bring a better return than the Twins got for Santana? Yeah...that's it. It couldn't possibly have anything to do with the fact that he sells tickets and merchandise. It isn't blind loyalty. The guy is a top flight pitcher, and Drayton makes money off of having Roy on the team.
Keep in mind on the mound Bedard < Santana but the contract situation changed that to >. Roy O has the 'favorable' contract situation, thus Roy O > Bedard > Santana as it relates to 'trade value'.
Doesn't it also speak more favorably of the organzation; that they don't just dump players right and left like other teams. Sure players are enticed by the max contracts, but that's not the only thing that factors into their decision to sign with a team. The kind of loyalty the Astros have shown over the years toward guys like Biggio and Bagwell and Oswalt and Berkman I'm sure helps to put fans in the seats, to sell merchandise, to draw other FA to the city, etc. How is this thread still going?
How about Roy for Joba, Robinson Cano, and Minor league prospects... That would be cool for the stros imo.... Roy is in his prime, and you want to get premium value before his stock drops.. Although i know how many of you guys have grown sentimentally attached to Oswalt you gotta move on
If the Astros offered Oswalt and each of their top five prospects, I still don't think that would be enough to get Chamberlain alone -- much less Oswalt by himself for Chamberlain plus one of the best second basemen in the game and prospects on top of it! Your post is one big problem with dealing Oswalt -- even Santana, who is the best pitcher in the game and miles better than Oswalt and his 5.57 ERA with constantly declining peripherals, couldn't fetch the Mets' top prospect. The PR blow of dealing Oswalt wouldn't even be remotely offset by a big haul of prospects or young talent, because the market dictates that such trades won't happen. It also wouldn't make sense from a baseball perspective if this team can compete in the short-term. Granted, the sample is small, but neither the Cubs nor the Brewers appear to be a 90 win team -- and if not, the Astros can compete.
WTF are you smoking dude? Joba has never started an MLB game and he hasn't even pitched 40 innings total in his career, plus they wouldn't even give him up for Santana. Cano is hitting .154 right now, he plays 2B, and his contract looks like this [08:$3M, 09:$6M, 10:$9M, 11:$10M, 12:$14M club option ($2M buyout), 13:$15M club] We've got Kaz at 2nd, doing a good job, and he's signed for less years and less money. Some of you don't even know what rebuilding means. Like CaseyH's idea about rebuilding around Miggy and Carlos Lee, how is that rebuilding? You keep your oldest everyday player and your most expensive one and trade away everybody else? Our biggest problem is starting pitching. Everybody needs it. The only teams trading it are the ones that can't afford to keep their studs on the cusp of Free Agency. That means they want young talent in return, which we don't have save for Pence. The only way to immediately improve it is to sign one or two via Free Agency. And since Drayton probably doesn't want the payroll to go too far north of 100 million, we'll have to trade Carlos Lee for the 09 season when he starts making $18.5 million per year. We'll probably have to eat some of the contract too. If you think finding a pitcher next year in Free Agency is completely impossible, then the other option is to trade everybody except for Pence, Towles, and Bourn. It'll take at least 3, more likely 5 years for us to be competitive again. I would rather keep adding to this team and see what happens, plus actually sign some of our draft picks, slotting system be damned.
