right...and all those nba people say the same thing. He is talented and has potential to be a good nba player...potential. im sick of potential..put up or shut up. he shut up this past year.
I don't understand the appeal of going back to Greece from a professional standpoint. Family and culture I can understand, but not winning championships in the Euroleague. If these reports are true, rather than trying to improve his game so that he deserves playing time in the NBA, he would rather play against dumbed-down competition. If I couldn't win in a pick up game with people my own age, it wouldn't make me feel any better to dominate in game against a bunch of twelve-year-old kids.
Unfortunately "people my own age" have lost to "a bunch of twelve-year-old kids" more than once, actually haven't won anything for years. Have you ever heard a story about a frog sitting on the bottom of a well?
To the extent that I think he can improve, I agree with you. But, from a personal standpoint, I know that I'm not ever going to playing pickup games at Fonde....that doesn't mean I stop playing basketball. It means I play at my level...not necessarily one at which I dominate, though. If I'm V-Span, I give it 1 more year. New coach, new system, work hard on my faults in the offseason. If playing time still isn't there, or it just isn't clicking, then I go back.
Thank you so much for this post !!!!!! Why is everyone so high on V-Span !! He sucked last year !! Just because he was good in Greece doesn't mean he can play in the most elite league in the world with this talent. I just want him for trade bait ! Until he proves he can hit a jumper then I could care less if he stays in Greece just give the Rockets the money back because we need every penny we can get for Artest
Then he did nothing vs. China's guards. Again I don't understand why we even bother with the "one guy who had the game of his life in an amateur tournament means he's an NBA badass" argument. Ed Pinckney is not an NBA HOF player for this reason.
It seems as though none of us have seen the man play. (Beyond a minute or five here and there.) None of us. Those who have seem positive. The last game of the season when Bull was ski-dazed the other team had a basketball guy (former player, can't remember???) doing color with Worrell. He had never seen Spanoulis and he was raving. I take KillBill on the judgment of the NBA personnel people until I actually see the guy in consistent action. His teammates seem to believe he should come back. Why shouldn't I?
I saw him play plenty of times. he played ~300 minutes - that is like 6 full NBA games. Not to mention lots of preseason minutes. And don't give me the "all garbage time" BS because it was not. And the results, by and large, were unempressive in most aspects. Anyway - I do trust NBA personnel - who saw far more of him in the nba than any of us, and felt he could not help the team last year. But then again, that's to be expected from most second round draft picks.
I'd like to see the guy play meaningful 15 - 20 minutes over a couple of weeks, then I'll pronounce my judgment. There was nothing from last year's 'action' that allows this seer any savanthood. There was nothing from last year's 'action' that allows you, respectfully offered, any savanthood, either, IMHO.
I understand what you're saying. If VSPAN doesn't think he's cut out for the NBA game, then he probably needs to go back to Greece. I can respect someone who recognizes his limitations. Whether or not that's what we have here, I don't know. If he merely wants to go back to Greece because it's the easier route, that's unfortunate. If I thought I had NBA-quality skills, I wouldn't being looking for guaranteed minutes or anything like that. I'd be working hard to prove it. Maybe VSPAN is doing that, but that's not the impression I get. I certainly wouldn't go back to another situation simply because it's easier and provides instant gratification. If that's what he's doing, I question his heart. Again, I don't know what's going on here. There are too many questions about what has been said, the accuracy of reports, and so on. I could be misreading what has been reported, or VSPAN may have even been misunderstood at some point, but the impression I get is that VSPAN may in some ways have a sense of entitlement. That's one thing I can't stand. "I deserve better than this because ... well ... I just do." It's surely a lot easier than earning whatever you want -- playing time, bigger contract, or whatever. Whether this is accurate or not, there have been times when I've gotten the impression that VSPAN's attitude is, "I was something over there, and that means I'm owed something over here." If so, he's wrong. You have to earn it over here just like you earned it over there. If I truly believed I had the talent to play in the top league, I'd do whatever was necessary to prove it.
His contract doesnt really matter to him at all. But for the sake of the game and for the sake of the rockets i really hope that he stays, he could really become a great PG for the rockets.
Which is exactly what happened in November and December - except he only got 10 minutes per game in which he was rather consistently shooting his team in the foot - and hence he got the hook. I didn't know that guys who basically haven't shown anything ever were automatically entitled to 20 minutes per game regardless of how terrible they are playing to allow fans to make a judgment. There are legions of rookies to whom this has never applied. But anyway coaches who do this are generally ones who are on their way to the lottery such as Doc Rivers, e.g. So if you expect Adelman to play Spanoulis just for the sake of playing him, which apparently is what the fan clamor is based on, I expect you to be disappointed.
he played a lot of preseason minutes, for sure. and i remember pretty much everyone here was really excited taht we might have found an actual backup PG...with some faults, to be sure, but some qualities no other guard (T-Mac excluded) on the roster really had. He then went on the play 5 minutes in the first 10 games of the season. The Rockets went 6-4. Shot the team in the foot is a little harsh. Following those first 10 games, he played in 12 consecutive games at 6 minutes or more of PT. Overall, he had too many turnovers and shot too poorly. But his 2 big turnover games (5 and 3) were in Rocket blowout wins. And the team went 8-4 in this 12 game stretch. Plus, he seemed to understand his limitations. He had one game shooting 1-6. Otherwise, when he wasn't shooting good (albeit, most of the games), he stopped shooting. He got the hook beacuse JVG's offense, clearly, was designated for post-up (either Tracy or T-Mac), pick and roll with T-Mac, or find an open 3 point shooter. Which is to say, JVG had no real offense to speak of, and the only offensive talent that was rewarded on the team, if you're name wasn't Yao or Tracy, was shooting 3 pointers. V-Span definitely did NOT, and likely never will, be a great 3 point shooter. V-Span was taken out of the rotation, and JVG's offense still failed to get himout of the first round. JVG was let go. I'm with you here. I hope people aren't expecting Adelman to just play V-Span because the fans think he's great. That said, I do think the he fits considerably better into Adelman's system than JVG's. I think that's obvious. I understand what you're saying, but would also point out that while he's not old, he isn't exactly a rookie either. How many years does he try and improve and become a quality NBA role player before he realizes it may not happen, and he's wasted any opportunity to be a player anywhere. Like I said earlier, if I'm him, I give it one more shot... ---------------------------------------------------- In general, though, just like I don't expect him to become the next Steve Nash or Tony Parker (you're crazy if you do), I also don't understand why people can't see this from his point of view. All he knows of the NBA is what he has from his one year of experience...which is pretty horrible offense (not as bad as the Francis, Mobley dribble-fests, of course, but not exactly a thing of beauty). He sees a team where none of his strengths are utilized and all of his weaknesses are exploited. And these are strengths and weaknesses that everyone knew he had before the season started, yet he was still "promised" a role. And now he's being courted again on a "promise" of a new system, a better fit, etc., when we all know what Sam says is the most accurate - there are no promises. And he has a viable legitimate option in Greece. Something that Steve Novak, for example, doesn't have. Besides being 2 years younger, Novak wouldn't exactly be in his comfort zone if he got up and left to play in Europe. That said, if Novak continues to not get PT for the next few seasons, I certainly expect him to eventually find a league where he does fit in. V-Span had some on the court and off the court issues. He still has potential to be a solid backup point guard, or good trade bait. But he is also well within his right to just say **** it, I was having more fun in Greece anyway...
Damnit, if Vspan leaves, who's going to teach me the Greek Word of the Day? Nike means victory! Vspan: Ni-ke Hayes: Ni-ke Alston: Nike JHoward: Nike T-Mac: Nike Battier: Ni-ke Novak: Nike Deke: MEE-KAYYYY!
And the unstated implication here is that the Rockets would have gone 10-0 with him? Or that they were a decent team without him. I hope for you sake it is the latter. And he was much worse than advertised on defense and had trouble staying with NBA guards as far as speed and quickness goes. And he showed little potential to correct his historical problems iwth turnovers and poor shooting - a liability of any team. The overall point though is that his presence on the court was hurting the team. Not really - he got the hook because he performed poorly no matter what the offense was. When a player runs into the middle, jumps, and has no idea what to do with the ball so he tosses it into the front row - that has nothing to do with the offense. Likewise when a player gets the ball stolen from him by Kyle Korver, then crossed over and taken to the rack, by Kyle Korver, that again has nothing to do with the offense. LOL, it's a little more than just "lack of greatness", it's more the fact that his three point shooting, for a guard, is downright awful to the point where he's basically a liability any time he is not moving with the ball - a huge problem given that two far better players are going to demand the ball more often than not. Again with the implications - as if one had anythimg to do with the other. I don't see a player of his level of mediocrity fitting into any NBA system. I
I don't see a player of his level of mediocrity fitting into any NBA system. I[/QUOTE] I'm glad I'm not the only one that thinks the same way.
no point, only that you later mentioned he "shot the Rockets in the foot", which, regardless of schedule or injuries, simply isn't true - though is a good pun! disagree. he was average on defense. no worse than Rafer. considering he was never advertised to be Bruce Bowen, it was to be expected. He played a pesky brand of defense that was interesting, but at other times got beat too often. I think I went to 5 of the 6 home games in that stretch. nothing about his defensive play during that stretch didn't make me think he can't be an effective (average at worst, but potentially even above average) permiter defender, especially against quicker PG's. well his per minute turnover rate was down considerably from his preseason averages, from about 0.2 to 0.1 per minute. Of course, still too high. And his shooting was horrible. But where did I argue JVG should have played him? He didn't fit in JVG's system at all. He might moreso in another system, is all I'm arguing. this can't possibly be true, because, as mentioned, JVG had no offense. Implying that there was more than one type of offense run is a laugh, though. Or are we just picking out plays where player A did something stupid. Because there are certainly plenty of those moments for everyone on the team. see above. again, i'm not saying V-Span is great. I do think he has the potential to become a solid backup PG, and that said potential would never be realized in JVG's offensive system, or lack thereof. Yao didn't score a point in his first NBA game, was useless for basically a month, and almost broke an ankle falling down against Marbury his rookie year. Everyone has horrible plays. V-Span needs to work hard to get better as Yao has and continues to do, and learn to adjust his play to the NBA game and limit his weaknesses. Tony Parker and Dwayne Wade used to be horrid 3 point shooters, also. Steve Nash only played 8 games his first 2 season and had a horrible 3 poitn percentage also. No, Sam, don't twist the above statement to say JayZ is implying V-Span is as talented as Parker and/or Wade. It is a statement. If you want to know what my implication is, it's that you don't have to be a great 3 point shooter to be a decent NBA player. I am moreover implying that we don't know where V-Span fits, because the bigger problem was that the offense JVG forgot to install had absolutely no movement by anyone, including Yao and Tracy. The entire team drifted around the 3 point line, or waited for Yao or Tracy to score. Nobody moved without the ball. The offense sucked. Could V-Span be an okay offensive player in an NBA offense with actual movement of any kind. I don't know. Going off history, I'd say no. But that logic would have had Nash playing in Europe, too. I'm stating fact, you're creating implication. V-Span was taken out of the rotation = Fact JVG's offense still failed to get him out of the first round = Fact the implication intended is it didn't matter who he played, JVG's offense was extremely limited. there is no implication that V-Span sucked only because of JVGs offense. but could it have been a factor....um, yes, undeniably. DaDakota gets a lot of heat around here, rightfully so. But I thought the same thing abotu Nachbar 3 years ago. And there are plenty of other examples across the league of players who through some combination of hard work, the right fit, etc. improve considerably. Just thinking of one recently. Kevin Martin shot 38.5% and 20% from 3 pointer his rookie year, and, for a SG/SF, had a rather high number of TO/minute. HIs stats were all up this year to the point where he is probably Sacramento's #1 untradeable. Without a doubt, V-Span has the ability to fit in the NBA. But of course he has to work for it and earn it. If he decides to stay in Greece, that means he doesn't want to...more power to him.
