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[ESPN/MacMahon] "Houston Rockets owner Tilman Fertitta excited about future of the NBA franchise"

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Deuce, May 12, 2021.

  1. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    He will sell himself first.

    He really believes the shyte he peddles, no matter how contradictory.

    It's no wonder "you know who" is who he idolizes.
     
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  2. BMoney

    BMoney Contributing Member

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    Imagine carrying water for Tilman Fertitta. Jesus.
     
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  3. Mkieke

    Mkieke Member

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    Why are Bill and others ridiculing the Rockets return? Harden straight up tanked to get off the team and it killed his value. Don’t rip the Rockets over that, and don’t bring up Ben Simmons and Thybulle either - they push us out of the Top 3, most likely, and Ben’s likely gone when his contract is up. In the interim, we wouldn’t be winning anything.
     
  4. hakeemthagreat

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    We're rebuilding. It had to happen eventually, yet you guys sit here & whine about it? I have a feeling Tilman will come outta this making alot of yall looking stupid
     
  5. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Sorry but I have zero respect for his basketball takes.
     
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  6. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    so what was supposed to be Harden's value if he allowed Tilman to showcase him?
     
  7. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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  8. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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  9. DonatelloLimestone

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    Yea its true, I love it when 90 percent of our moves were cost cutting during a time of contention. If he was blowing it up then, he should've blown it up then. But If you have harden playing big games, big minutes, useage and hes coming back in January and Daniel house, teh dleague pick up is sent home for 2 months so its tax friendly on a very small contract, then next month another locker goes unreplaced in the guy you paid minimum in JAmes ennis to replace Ariza(traded for a top 55 protected pick) while in rotation, you're just not in the championship culture.

    But if what you say is true, we didn't have a shot. Then why did he publicly keep saying we went all in for this window. Its not so much all the moves people are pissed at, its that he continue to lie and deflect and blame. In this threat above I posted his contradictions. I'm not sure about you, do you see any other owners going to the press this often let alone lying abotu it. I 'm fine with moving on from MDA, but did you see where he went to the press and lied about it. You get while the nba is only 400-300 players, the agents are even less. Its a small world and the rockets reputation has gone to ass.

    This is a legacy buy, the new age guys in nba eonomics, not 1995, the revenue the player power in partnership has evolved and if you don't adjust you're going to end up with a cycle of mediocrity. Like most of our moves, you act like he is long sighted, but none of those moves helped our future cap flexiblity, none. They didnt help staff or any our players, they went to one mans pockets. This while he raised prices on fans and pointed fingers and lied, check his own quotes, don't go by what we're saying. I'm not sure if you goto games, but many are long time paying customers, season ticket holders, let alone most revenue now is generated from TV deals/Ads.

    We pay, we get lied to as we worsen the product, he's punted. Are you aware that he is the most over leveraged owner in the entire league while buying in the peak? Are you aware that he has been hit the hardest in the pandemic?Are you not considering that context all while he refuses to even take a minority owner? Have you seen his actual quotes where he lies to the face about it. Its not just hoops, did you see last march when for some reason once again he volunteers and sets up these interviews like with texas monthly, and he says this :

    TM: What would you like to see in it?

    TF: I don’t know. I really haven’t counted on the government. I’m not one of the largest companies in America and I’m not one of the smallest. When it’s all over with, you can write an article [saying] that I survived and I didn’t get any help from the government.


    Go ahead, take his own words in man. Are you defending Donald Sterling, Sarver too? Dolan is terrible, similarly his ego and meddling has hurt hte culture and trust of the knicks, but he spends which is almost the most an owner can offer in the current nba economics. The only people who lose here are fans, so I'm still trying to wrap my head around you're defense. I'm open to it because I'm fine with criticism of Morey, MDA, Harden or whoever, its reasonable and we always want to get better. but to deduce that to people blaming their problems on oneguy? This is a rockets message board and we're discussing the rockets and how the state has gotten to this, not just the rebuild, the franchise reputation, the fact that we have no vets or a steady hand even in the front office, basically cheaping out on every level. Sometime you gotta do it, it helps if you don't goto the media and lie and say he went all in and point fingers, the facts don't support that. I'm open to actual conversation with the evidence on the facts, but I don't get and I wonder if these are foreign fans or something who have the north korea, Saudi Dear Leader type of don't criticise our top guy or you're not loyal or this and that. In texas, we preach independence from blind authority. Like I said, I'm open to hear how any facts support what they say, but unfortunately for us, because we are fans and hoping the best for the rockets through and through, they don't.

    Its not just the message boards, its not just the media, its the league reputation. I'm fine with being optimistic. I like stones moves, I like our yougn guys, even if we don't hit 52 percent in the pick, we have some base to build on and thats a good thing, but if the owner continues to lie when he doesn't have to his pattern is just disconcerning. Me being optimistic and happy for Stone and silas and the young guys doesn't just shut off my objectivity and when tillman does the right actions next time around, I'll applaud it bc like him or not, if he does well then the rockets do well and thats what this is about.

    Trust me know fan, no franchise ever wants the main conversation to be about the owner. Les sucked too, had his flaws and I've called it out, les didn't make it as easy since tillman will outspokenly lie and blame people. ITs not a good look for the leader of the team and I don't get anyone except followers or subservient employees who shut up and listen, he infact has said this themselves. He wants to lead otherws want to follow, I guess it rings true
     
    #89 DonatelloLimestone, May 12, 2021
    Last edited: May 12, 2021
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  10. deb4rockets

    deb4rockets Hope is on the horizon in the NBA draft.
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    Some parents buy their sons a basketball, but maybe Tillman's sons asked him to buy them a basketball team. Next they'll be asking to run it. Oh wait....it's happening.
     
  11. Salvy

    Salvy Member

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    I'm not defending Tilman, I think he has made mistakes.... So has Morey and so did Harden and so did MDA.... They all made mistakes starting with trading Paul. I just don't think much would be different after trading Paul and Capela. Its been about salvaging a contender for the past three years and every single year we got worst and worst. This season was absolutely unavoidable.

    As long as Harden was a Rocket we had a chance, he was that good. It was expected that Houston would continue to try and compete but Harden had enough of it. Harden left and there was no choice but to blow it up.

    Who are the best owners in the league? Mark Cuban? Steve Balmer? how many chips have they won? Cuban 1 and Balmer 0.... Tilman is a new owner, he bought the team at the worst possible time and shortly after Morey absolutely destroyed our future.

    This is year 1 of the rebuild, some people already want to be back in the playoffs next year. Lets establish a good foundation and build upon that. Morey for nearly a decade traded, traded and then traded some more without ever establishing a foundation. He ran out of trading pieces and bailed, its time to do it right. In time if Tilman cant get this thing off the ground I will for sure agree he is terrible but its too damn early....
     
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  12. Juxtaposed Jolt

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    /thread.

    We could go 0-72 and Tilman would be trying to drum up interest for next season. That's just a part of the job.
     
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  13. DonatelloLimestone

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    I agree, this year was unavoidable and unsalvageable. It was also dumb at this point where tilman offered 100 million to harden while simultaneously killing his value with leaks in the media, don't you think?
    Agreed about the Paul trade. But lets look at the dominos before this, lets listen to paul himself. I'll try to make my argument with just quotes, mainly by the actors themselves thats why I don't want it to get twistedthat I have some issue with this guy or that guy. Like I said, rockets winning, or tangibly have a good plan and peopl are straight forward and we have trust in this organization, I can sit through rebuilds when needed, no problem. I'll still be going to games, having a beer, talking **** with fellow houstonians, but no. We get more BS.

    For starters, who bragged about the Paul trade, and took credit proudly?

    I was in Europe, and so I was six or seven hours ahead of them. So I’m talking at 2, 3, 4 in the morning. And we just decided to do it. They ran different statistics by me.

    My basketball ops [operations] got maybe a little weak at the end, and I just said, ‘We’re doing this. We are going to make the change. We’re going to go after it and roll the dice. We’re going to find that 5 percent.’
    - Makes you wonder :


    Alright, Chris paul has done pretty damn good right, lets take a look at what he had to say of what led rockets first domino, before he was traded:

    Former Houston Rockets guard Chris Paul was on the Knuckleheads podcast with Darius Miles and Quentin Richardson and explained the impact of the Rockets losing Ariza.

    “People don’t realize, that’s the biggest thing that we missed. That was tough when we lost [Ariza] because he sorta was like the glue. He was that glue for our team.”


    Ok, basketball is not an exact science, you have personalities so forth. You need cohesion to be successful. Remember history would be different in Paxon didn't hit that shot, Likewise if Kerr rimmed out of his game winning finals shot. The 1995 great Clutch city would be different without KEnny Smith hitting the clutch shot, MArio elie's kiss of death, Horry for numerous damn team. Raptors weren't guaranteed a thing, but they took a shot bc the margins of winning the in the playoffs are small. You cited balmer or cuban, you can't guarantee a title, you can put all the money, all hands on deck and give yourself a shot bc its that close to winning or losing, injuries happen, as we see buzzer beaters happen. Likewise, raptors overpaid Gasol 50 million at 34/35, Leonard's ball bounces the right way, history is made. Cavs overpaid Klove, Jr Smith, Tristan...none worth their contracts, but they won the chip. And thats nba economics, the par is raising bc the revenue generated especially with the new tv deals are growing and thats just what it takes. If you play it like the pacers, run it like restaurant margins, you will be prepetually mediocre. That is why now its exclusively a billionaires game, nba has even limited minority owners, there is enough demand as its legacy buy, a show case buy with a 30 limit of an elite group. You don't get into the league to make the best yearly profit, its like a 5th avenue real estate, you get in there to make a mark and you're cap rate is going to be smaller. Time and time again, non headling signings and role players have made a difference even when not worth their contracts.

    Its not just Harden. Harden by all accounts was totally invested in Houston. He had an active foundation, he didn't rent, he bought homes here, moved his family here, he was invested in the local soccer team, he had just opened up a rockets red themed restaurant with his name in it. Not exactly common sense signs of a guy itching to leave. But notice, LEbron likewise after 7 years left to go play with hall of famers. MJ even demanded help after mvp seasons and dominating the league individually. Kobe, lakers legend, demanded help or a trade from his team why? Are they all not loyal? no bc sooner or later you realize the cohesion matters, you need talent aroudn you to get the chip. Theres very few who do it themselves and we were blessed with the DReam. but as I mentioned above, we had role players hit the clutch shots. And now with the current NBA economics, thats just not possible, not probable.

    So you're harden, you see in 2018 we're one game from the finals and chris paul is injured. Its at least a championship window. I'm proud we took on the warriors when the whole league stood aside for them, Houston went for it big, texas style and made em sweat. Now what do we do that offseason. We had Trade exceptions of over 10 million, ignored. We had the MLE, ignored. We had bird rights to ariza,ignored. I'm fine like I said with the argument that we could do better, I know its a tough business its not a kumbaya type of thing. He was a one year cost, that means no future flexiblity issues, let alone a trade deadline expiring contract. We let him go, and he was traded that deadline for KElly Oubre. But more so lets focus on who the rockets replaced him with. JAmes ennis on an NBA minimum contract. He actually played in MDA's frustrating short rotation(Like i said, happy to spread the blame- I'm not trying to attack one person but looking at the facts), he was traded that very season for.... a top 55 protected 2nd round pick...no player in return. Furthermore, in January the month before we cut the other wing in our rotation, dleague pick up Daniel house and just sent him home, no replacement again, until it was cap friendly. Imagine you're harden, who in an age of "load management" seeing stars sit out, Harden played heavy games ,at the heaviest useage, and heavy minutes...he's coming back trying to do historic things and seeing two lockers empty while the onus falls on him. Do you not think he lost some faith in our ownership? And you are blaming morey. LEts take a look at hte facts, not only did we ignore the assets that morey accumulated above and bragged about ways to add to a team at the cap, but the moves above don't give him ANY future cap flexiblity what so ever, they don't help coach or the players, in fact they don't even help fans who had prices raised on them. Those are soley cost cutting moves going into the owners pockets. I'm fine with him doing that now, i mean who cares now. But during harden years and then to try to pretend like that doesn't make harden want to leave? Remember, this is the culmination for harden's career and life work, its a small window and nba careers are short and judged on rings. His prime window is short and hes watching it wasted away, like i showed above, almost all the great stars wanted out bc they realize it takes a team despite what ESPN/TMZ sells as some sort of 1-1 game.

    Further more, here is a ringer article on some of the rockets moves:
    ", the Rockets barely went over the luxury tax (just $3.65 million over) in their one season (2015-16) as a taxpayer. The Warriors spent $49.63 million in penalties over the last five seasons, while even the small-market Thunder spent $33.73 million. There was no excuse for Houston to not open up the checkbook. This is a franchise located in the fourth-biggest metro area in the U.S. that has had a superstar in the prime of his career.

    This refusal to spend money became farcical once Alexander sold the team to Tilman Fertitta in 2017. Fertitta spent so much money ($2.2 billion) to purchase the Rockets that he may not have had the liquidity to go into the red to build a title contender. Houston was a laughingstock around the league for the amount of juggling it had to do to stay under the tax. The best example came at the trade deadline last season, when Morey used a future first-round pick to shed the salaries of Brandon Knight and Marquese Chriss. There was no basketball reason for the move. It was just done to cut costs. It’s not that Knight and Chriss would have helped the Rockets. But there were certainly a lot of better things that Morey could have used that pick for.

    Houston also spent that season in a bizarre staring contest with Danuel House Jr. House is the kind of diamond in the rough that Morey routinely uncovered in Houston, an undrafted free agent on a two-way contract who would become a starting-caliber wing. The problem was that players on those deals can spend only 45 days with the NBA team during the season before their contracts have to be converted. Money in Houston was so tight that Morey had to send House back to the G League when he wouldn’t sign a below-market long-term deal. He replaced House with two players he signed off the street (Gerald Green and Kenneth Faried) before bringing him back right before the playoffs. It’s not like House was asking for the world. He signed a three-year, $11 million contract in the offseason. But even that was more than Morey could offer at the time."
     
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  14. DonatelloLimestone

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    Furthermore, I get the issues with MDA. I'm fine with moving on from this, but tell me any owner whose done it like this:

    "
    "I think his agent did me a favor, OK," Fertitta said at the media availability, explaining that he now had an easy out if the Rockets had a disappointing year and decided to move on from D'Antoni.

    That's typically not the kind of comment made out loud, much less to the media, by an owner who is attempting to defuse drama. Of course, it's also an unusual approach to point out a coach's age and publicly wonder whether he wanted to continue working beyond next season, as Fertitta did when asked by the Houston Chronicle weeks earlier about a potential extension. That prompted the 68-year-old D'Antoni to make it clear that he planned to coach "at a high level for at least another three years."

    Nor is it normal NBA business practice to spill the specifics of an offer that wasn't accepted. Fertitta volunteered that the "great extension offer" he made D'Antoni included a $5 million base salary -- below market value for a coach of his stature -- and $1 million in incentives for each playoff round won.
    Fertitta failed to mention the buyout language that guaranteed D'Antoni only half of his base salary if the Rockets fired him before the extension began. That was the primary sticking point for D'Antoni, who hoped for a commitment of two more seasons beyond this contract and never seriously considered a half-hearted offer of one more year."

    Remember we have to deal with these agents often and it is a relationship business. Don't forget we did this to JEff Bzdelik, he was the associate head coach in charge of the best defense we had too. A nother non headlining move. So our CEO, Our GM, our assistant gms, our coach associate coach ran away. Warriors owners are actually poorer 'in value' then houston was, they continue to build like a silicon valley, focusing on brand, reputation, quality, updating facilities, cultures, making it a destination from what used to be a laughing stock by investing all around and focusing on profits later. Remember this is not a mom and pop, this is a billions game.



    ""He cited not just Morey or Rockets owner Leslie Alexander, but he described Rockets president Tad Brown as "kind of a father."
    "
    "He helps me get through every single day with struggles that I have," Harden said. "Any questions about anything, he's there for me.

    "It's more than I ever could have ever imagined - the city, the fans, my teammates, these guys right here - Mr. Alexander, Tad, Daryl, even Rafael (Stone, the Rockets' general counsel) in the back. There's constant communication. I talk to these people more than my mom, more than my family and friends. It's a family. I'm not exaggerating.

    "I think it's definitely unique. I know how special it is to feel welcome, to feel loved.""

    "I don't want to go anywhere. I don't want to deal with free agency. I know where home is. I know where I want to be. I know where I want to retire ultimately. And I know where I want to win a championship. Everything is going to happen in Houston."

    Harden spoke of the way he had been entrusted to help build the team around him, a partnership Rockets general manager Daryl Morey described as "the modern way" to empower a franchise star and improve a roster. The relationship, however, had grown deeper than a way to influence free agents to join him."

    All those guys are gone, except stone. I'm optimistic about stone, to be honest I've been with the rockets since before Dream was drafted...so yea I'm not never giving up on em. Rockets were not about Les, HArden, MDA, morey or any of that to me, its always this city and franchise above all. Likewise its not about tilman. So I critisize objectively my man, I tried to include actual facts rather than narratives and hopefully you can see that.

    I was ecstatic when Tillman purchased the team. A local, season ticket holder big wig right when we are the cusp from the title and we get rid of NYc florida guy les? Could it get better? I worried we'd get a foreign owner like NEts or some out of towner who doesnt love this city. But as seen above, not only have I been disappointed by the moves, the owner just outright won't heed his own advice and hsut up and listen. I'm fine if he wants to be a celeb and take the mike, but he both cheaped out, took the mike, demanded more with a less product, then pointed fingers and continues to do so.

    I don't know who you work for, but I'd hire you in a second. I need this blind loyalty and defense in my life. and I'm optimistic about the rockets, I'll never, ever give up my tickets. All my god damn nephews and nieces will continue to get rockets gear or their birthdays and christmas and I will continue to use my Rockets Coffee mug...every...damn. day. I'll continue to buy all the stupid **** like rockets beer cup bc its just been a special part of my life. Just like KNicks fans who love and grew up with the team, they may protest and shout sell the team to dolan, but dolan doesnt =knicks to them. Likewise here. I've critisized MDA for his lack of adjustments/rotations, Likewise with Morey and his communication and asset building ways, likewise with harden's isos or lack of defense, we all threw the remote at westbrook in the playoffs, but I'll also give credit due when he did well from december on and to all the above. I'm happy and I wish I were singing praises of tilman's antics on tv saying 'oh hes just being a personality' and hes doing best for the rockets, but itsin't the case. I don't get why people are demanding some dear leader Saudi, CCP type of stuff. We should be objective while also wanting the best for the team. I'm not delusional, doesn't take away how much I love the rockets, love our young guys, want the best for Silas and Stone...and yes, also hopes and wish Tilman has some Landry's 's humble pie and owns up and does the right thing in our next window. I hope I eat crow, bc as you can see above, I ain't going no where for the rockets, but here he is continuing to spread blame that morey went all in and that he supported it. The facts don't support that, I've provided the facts above.

    @Salvy None of this is personal bro, didn't mean to go long winded but there are a lot of 'narrative's taking shape, I know we all want the best for the rockets thats why we're here, but it doesn't hurt to be objective. Doesn't mean we don't want whats best, especially as we sit here at the bottom of the nba. We're all hoping that 52 percent hits Jun 22nd.
     
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  15. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    That’s an ideal little fairytale storybook type plot but it’s not going to work out like that. Never does. Not with this state of the rockets and this continuing nightmare
     
  16. DonatelloLimestone

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    Lastly, I agree. We gotta do this rebuild right. What does that mean, investing in staff, a player development system. Spurs are a small market, they were one fo the first to bring in dedicated shooting coaches, brought in a Utexas nutritionist to plan each players meals, did things that don't make headlines.
    Likewise warriors ahve invested in staff, they did the same thing Balmer did. Pay Jerry west to oversee the builds while he gets millions to golf half the time. This ain't child's play money, but thats the nba for you. They also gave Steve Nash a pretty penny to somtiems fly up and work with the players and be a consultant. These little details just make all the difference in the culture, let alone new practice facilities, equipment. You know where morey went? philadelphia built a new practice facility with a new dining hall so they can 1)have better nutrition 2) get the team together and eat and keep things in house so more development is encouraged.

    None of this guarantees a title, likewise with balmer and cuban. You really can only incrementally increase your chances to get a title, there are a lot of buzzer beaters, injurites yearly, there are no guarantees. The margins of wins are very close in the league, but you put all hands on deck when you can get your hand on generation talent and go for it.

    Has tilman done any of that? I love stone, but our entire staff, coaches, players are all young, or no one with the clout to challenge and grow on things. They are not only cheaper, but don't have leverage to challenge tilman. Thats not a winning mentality. He talked about facilities in 2017, its been chirps since then. He bragged about buying a new jet for the, anyone who pays attention knows under the last set of tax cuts you can write off jets entirely under the new code so many corporations got to enjoy that, jet sales also soared. Thats cool, its smart business, anyone with a lot of moeny knows accounting is more of an 'art' rather than a set of rules. But I don't get why he didn't pony up for a facility too. Why not use the opportunity zones also given and get and upgrade facilities while 'developing' parts near downtown and getting the write off. He just has seen over his head and then points fingers elsewhere and takes credit if he feels good. its not the marker of a good leader, let alone is that we're talkign about him always going to the press. ACtion first. I'll be happy to eat crow and cheer him on in years if he gets it right, i want/need him to, but I'm not going to blind to it. like you said, a lot of the guys made mistakes, I'm a believer in calling them out and its not some millineal safespace thing where we have to be 'positive' or we're not loyal. been around the rockets a lot longer than him or any of the staff. H-town runs in the blood, I'm indoctrining my kids with it, win or lose;)

    At this point he's is more outspoken and tries to be the face more than Balmer, Cuban, and Dolan or whoever. Yet hes the only one who openly lies and deflects from the facts. Dolan at least spends to balance his ego and meddling personality, we right now have the dollar value dolan and its made the rockets the laughing stock. The nba works in cycles, like you said we have optimism in this young roster, but the way we did it and the amount hes lied has just been a slap in our paying fan's faces, its been disappointing to say the least
     
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  17. thekad

    thekad Member

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    Congratulations, you’ve just made the dumbest post on this forum.

    “Long-sighted owner” who traded multiple picks to downgrade at PG.

    “No free agents wanted to come to Houston” besides the #1 free agents in 2013 and 2017.

    Imagine how delusional you have to be to believe dollar store Dolan turned the Rockets franchise around for the better as they went from 65 wins to 15 lmao.
     
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  18. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    for 3 years and counting, I've called the owner a dumbass and idiot. Just destroying this franchise year after year. He has yet to disappoint. For those same 3 years and counting, the bootlickers on cf's have tried to say every year, you'll see and all the he's going to make yall look like fools posts. Yall are still gonna be bootlickers and still say the same garbage for a long time because yall are that naïve and clueless. Nah, he's still the same dumbass and idiot this entire time. And I'm going to continue to say it every year over and over and over and over because it isn't getting better anytime soon.
     
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  19. Salvy

    Salvy Member

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    Possibly the dumbest response I've gotten ever on this forum, waste of a notification....

    LMAO #1 free agents, Howard? and who was the top free agent in 2017? Chris Paul was traded here. You are delusional to even mention Howard, a past his prime center in a quickly changing league with the Warriors changing the way basketball is played.

    Oh yeah, 65-16 was totally Houston competing for an elimination round in the playoffs and not a rebuild year. Have you never seen a team rebuild? Teams do it all the time. Might want to do some research on it.

    Stay delusional, Houston was the best team ever and all the stars wanted to come here.. We had so many stars omg!!! 2013,2014,2015,2016,2017 then Tilman came along and we haven't landed top free agent ever since!!!!
     
  20. BigBum

    BigBum Member

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    1,346
    The future is between 2022 and 2026.

    Acquire two proven young stars in offseason is absolutely required.

    Luka and Zion, Tier one

    Acquire Tier 2 stars
     

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