How? Instead of Martin and Scola? You use Ariza and probably Battier and or Patterson and get someone real good at SF. We didnt lose anything of note in that transaction since Lee hardly gets used now and Ariza isnt with the team. So losing Ariza is basically like dealing with free money we already dont have alot of now with Lee.
Because Trevor Ariza is so good, you might be able to trade him for Courtney Lee. THAT is his trade value. Arguing anything else is ignoring reality. Ariza + Patterson would not get you anyone substantially (if at all) better than Lee + Patterson would. I have no idea what you're trying to say about the free money part. You don't need to rush to respond to people. Take your time and make a logical post with reasoning and paragraphs.
There's no way in hell we're a better team with Courtney Lee. While Lee is a good player, you can't replace Ariza's length and athleticism. If Moreys goal was to trade for Lee just to trade him again, then our fans have been bamboozled into thinking we're trying to win a championship. We're just staying mediocre and making lateral moves to appease disgruntled fans. If we don't make any significant moves by the deadline, les needs might need 2 consider a replacement for Morey
Stop attacking me and making this about me if you have no good rebuttal. Just make the point and disregard talking about me personally. If you clutchfans could for once without trying to get personal if its possible when you lose an argument its not the end of the world and no need to attack another persons character or credibility or spelling. Here is why. Battier and Ariza is worth more. Battier old an expiring contract. Worth alot paired with Ariza. Ariza, Battier and young PF Patterson drafted in the middle of the first round is worth a very good upgrade over Battier and Ariza. Patterson doesnt play so he really doesnt matter with Scola there for years to come. Battier wouldnt matter or Ariza if you got their replacement who is real good. There is Budinger there. Alot of reasons why it makes sense to not have waisted Ariza on Courtney Lee. Some of which deal with a glut at two positions. SF and SG. Balance of roster. Maximising talent in starters roles. Not end up just adding another role player which we dont need of minimal level of skill like Courtney Lee is.
but you can replace his mistakes, and his poor shooting, and his inability to successfully use said length and athleticism...hence Lee... IF Ariza had used his skill set successfully, You would be absolutely 100% correct. Problem is, Ariza did not do so, nor is he doing it this year.
If you want to get a sense of Ariza's trade value, head to Real GM. The Cleveland fans there do not want to trade JAMISON for Ariza. Antawn freaking Jamison. And you now think Ariza + Patterson = Martin or Scola? Get real. Not to mention this is not 2K, you can not trade 3 players in the high 70s and get someone in the high 80s or 90s. And as for the personal attacks? Post better. You won't see me attack leeb or Hillboy on their postings, because they're very intelligent about basketball even though I disagree with a lot of what they say.
Jamison is a starter. Courntey Lee is not and nobody is offering us Jamison for Courntey Lee. Asik either from what has been talked about. Everyone understands what I am saying but thats your jumping on point because one poster mentioned it and now thats your rallying cry against my valid posts because your stances are weaker. Thats what it is. I dont resort to falling back on technical faults or spelling of others if they have better points. Thats now how i like to talk to others. That political speak for slip up jumping. Some guy blurts out his sentence and it defeats your points but he misspelled a word then you respond back with total clarity as to what he was discussing? Then say you dont understand him? Is dishonesty. I can catch this in conversations and maybe thats why people dont like my points when I mention it so truthfully?
You still haven't explained this ludicrous "Courtney Lee is not a starter" thing, among others. Courtney Lee started on a team that went to the Finals. He is not starting because he is behind a very good shooting guard already. He is also not among the top 10 or probably top 15 shooting guards in this league. Neither is Trevor. If Trevor was on the Heat, and naturally went to the bench, would this mean he is no longer the quality of starting SF? Heck, was trading starter Rafer Alston for backup Kyle Lowry who remained a backup after the trade a bad idea? And the point is that Trevor's trade value is not this super awesome thing you're making it out to be. It's that of a role player. And your idea of combining him and Battier to get a star is something straight out of 2K. 2 or 3 role players are not the equivalent of one star, not to mention who the **** would trade Iggy or Granger for Ariza and Battier? That's completely r****ded.
Passive aggressive much guys? LOL! Thats ok. i question others intelligence with off hand remarks all the time. The fact is we are not winning games for there to be an upper hand so many conversation is kind of loaded already and slanted towards my side of the coin with Courtney Lees lack of playing time and team lack of success. Thats not to say some of you dont have some points its just that you keep trying to invalidate my points with my spelling errors doesnt exactly make your points better. Its all good. Rockets Morey has alot to do and I am not self important but a fan is not unimportant to Moreys job status. In fact a person like me who is very good at making points is not unimportant if Morey doesnt start to do his job at some point. Is that self important? Maybe. I just know my place better than others. As a fan you can talk about the jobs your organization is doing and it is not taboo if the job isnt a good one. So far Morey has an incomplete grade. Been that way for a long time though..........
I wasn't attacking, just giving you suggestions. Your post are hard to decipher. How am I supposed to agree/disagree with you when I can't even understand what you're trying to say? I still have no idea what 'free money' was about, but let's move past that. You keep telling people that they're getting personal with you because they lost the argument; you're on an island with that one. You aren't making any strong arguments and yet keep assuming that you're coming out on top of each debate. Newsflash: you're not winning the 'debate' by repeating the same thing over and over. Example: 1. You said Ariza's trade value was much higher than Courtney Lee's, despite them being traded for one another (the ONLY measuring stick for trade value). 2. I said that wasn't true and that you were overvaluing Ariza's trade value; Lee would probably hold just as much weight in trade discussions as Ariza would. 3. You asked how you were overvaluing his value, then proceeded to talk about an Ariza/Battier/Patterson trade hypothetical to get X small forward. 4. What you failed to counter with is why a Lee/Battier/Patterson offer couldn't get you the same player. I explained to you how you ignored that question (a key part of the debate -- it IS Lee vs. Ariza after all). 5. Your response? "Here is why. Battier and Ariza is worth more." Very in-depth; I have no comeback to the "Ariza is worth more" argument! You've offered no evidence (rumors, speculation, etc) to show that Ariza holds more weight in trade discussions than Lee does; yet you assume that when people disagree with you, it's because you've made the perfect argument. I just don't think you have a very good understanding of how NBA trades operate. You can't just go, "Battier (SF) + Ariza (SF) + Patterson (rookie 1st rounder) = upgrade at SF over Ariza/Battier!" That's not how trades work -- this isn't NBA 2k11. Which SF are we talking about? What are the needs of the team who has them? Do they want to re-build or are they looking to win now? What's their financial situation like? Courtney Lee, for example, would be more attractive to the Bulls than Trevor Ariza. Since you keep touting your own intelligence and ability to make points, I'll end with this: You are not very good at making points. I'm sorry your parents/teachers lied to you.
Yet here you are finally debating my points??? After mostly three pages of personal putdowns first. I may not be the great debater but i sure get a reaction for my aweful points dont I? Nobody told me to be this way. I tout my own intelligence but you are putting it down and not touting yours? I see. More of that reverse debate you have going on there. Nice games you keep playing with spelling errors and intelligence questioning. Then acting like I am making myself out to be a genius in the same paragraph. You have to Republican with that type of political smearing campaign. At least a politician.
Over valuing Battier,is an art form on the board. If Dwight was offered for him and others in a package,there wouldn't be a single GM in the league who wouldn't go for it. His days are going to be up in a couple of years,while Howard will be entering his prime. If you want to live in mediocrity,be my guest.
Your not only crazy because Lee isnt as good as Ariza but also insane. Lee is not a starter and Ariza is. Lee is not a 36 minute a night guy and Ariza is. Lee is not champion and Ariza is. Lee is not on a winning team for two years and Ariza is winning every year or around 500. There is no angle around the debate. There is no winning. There is no minutes. There is no trade talk for Lee. There is no starting. There is no impact with meaningful minutes for Lee. You have zero argument. Thats evident from the moment you mentioned my spelling errors. Now you understand perfectly. This is not a plea to return Ariza. Its a bad trade by Morey example. This is not winning basketball or stats on your side. This is not fantasy league stats. This is reality.. I am your reality of the Rockets. You can accept me as a fan or ignore me and allow me to post to others unchecked with the lurkers and thousands of other fans who read my posts and perhaps begin to side with my points of view. Without you there to see it and oppose my views. Thats fine with me too. That last part is to the ones who cant see me now after they put me on the ignore list. What a shame I get to make my points without them there to say anything now about it.
This is supposed to persuade people to your point of view? You have to be kidding. And by the way... politics are supposed to stay out of the GARM, unless it's the politics of the NBA.
I am not touting anything. People dont like it when they have no rebuttal back about a subject so they resort to intelligence talks about one another. I dont need to ever resort to this. People can figure out why I never need to lower myself to these kind of attacks for themselves and why that is.
The Rockets could sure use a bailout right about now. I'm not going to go back and forth with you anymore; you've come full-circle and are now repeating some of the same terrible arguments you started with. You've lost this argument -- Thanks for playing.
You lost a long time ago. I just keep commenting towards you because you keep making it personal with you emotionally responding to calling out my intelligence on every post because you lost. With that i should just stop posting to you for posting this way constantly and i will be the better man. Good night. Have better things to do than comment further on your silly rebuttals to why this sub 500 team is better with a back for starter trade.
