Thank you. There seems to be some sort of sportwriting cabal that plots to disrespect Houston at every opportunity. I still refuse to subscribe to Sports Illustrated because they would not initially put the Rockets on the cover after the 94? 95? championship. The cover went to soccer players (?), but they finally did a Rockets cover (for the Houston area only) after some complaints. Most of these rags aren't fit to wrap fish in... [/gripe]
Didn't say anything about Max. Thought he was an overrated defender to begin with. Not in the same class defensively as a Nate McMillan or Derek Harper. I aknowledged this; based on matchups, I think Drexler wouldn't be ridiculously outproduced by Jordan, though he would be outplayed. If 30 points is a bad game for Jordan, he had an entire playoffs of bad games in 96. Reread my post. The PPG comparison is 95, the year the Rockets could have beaten the Bulls IMO, and 96, the year Chicago went 72-10. In 96 Scottie averaged 16.9ppg, 8.5apg, 5.9apg in the playoffs. In 95 Drexler averaged 20.5ppg, 7.0rpg, 5.0apg. You don't think the Bulls role players like Horace Grant, John Paxson, and Steve Kerr aren't overglorified? And Kukoc; he actually scored 18ppg, on one of the worst teams of all time. In 95 Horry averaged 13ppg, 7rpg, 3.5apg to Toni's 10ppg, 4rpg, 3.9apg in 96. The entire point of my post was that, while the Bulls get recognition in 96 as being one of the greatest championship teams of all time, the Rockets team of the 95 playoffs would have beaten them, in the hypothetical situation of the teams meeting in the Finals.
The Suns and Sonics both had high scoring PG's and PF's. Our strong points during the championship years (especially defensively) were at C and SG. The Suns took us to 7 because KJ was putting up 40 and 10 every other night, and our PG's were bad defenders (not to mention our system allowed them to get torched). Once again, matchups are everything. Chicago just did not match up well with us. As one poster already noted, those Bulls teams struggled to get past Knick teams led by nut-up Ewing and role players. I have no doubt that if you replace nut-up Ewing with Dream, then the Bulls would lose. "They matched up well" is defining actual players/positions, not coaches. They had a HOF center that could go toe to toe with Hakeem. Chicago did not. The Bulls championship teams struggled to beat teams with centers (Knicks, Magic and Pacers). They beat those teams because MJ could step up higher than anyone on the other teams, but it was not a walk in the park. Hakeem was better than any of the centers they faced, and his offensive production could match Jordans (another poster already listed the stats). Considering that his numbers rivaled MJ's when he was facing HOF centers (that he had to expend offensive energy guarding on the defensive end), I don't think he would be less effective going against Cartwright and other scrub Chicago centers. So a team can't win in the Finals during it's first trip (ala Chicago, Magic's lakers, Spurs, Shaq's Lakers, Pistons)?? You also forget that Dream had Finals experience, against an arguably better team. Ewing was a nut-up, and that is why they never got past MJ's Bulls. Because they matched up well with Chicago, the games and series were close. Yet, at crucial moment, Ewing (their superstar) blew it (either by not taking shots in the Charles Smith fiasco, missing lay-ups at the buzzer, etc). I don't believe Hakeem blows it in those situations. His career has shown us that he is one of the best big-game players of all time. DavidS: As far as your following post (I will summarize), your argument is that the Bulls win because we only had 1 HOF'er compared to their 2?? Yeah, that worked well for the Lakers this year, or the year that SA beat them. You didn't need a team of HOF's players to win in the 90's. A 1 star team can win a title (rare, but it can happen) if they are leading the right TEAM. Yes, the Bulls had MJ and Pip, but we are even...actually win every other position. No one is saying Max can stop MJ, but I think Max can make him work, especially with a roaming Olajuwon that doesn't have to worry about holding anyone.
DavidS, save your breath. Homerism is rampant here. I went through a 94/95 Houston - Chicago dreamcast session a year ago and let me tell you, don't bother.
Pippen should answer questions about his romantic gay relationship while he was in college and in his early playing years. FIND THAT ARTICLE.
Oppps. Sorry. I thought you were talking about the 94 season. Yes, the 95 season could have been our best chance. But I'm don't think the 95 Rox could have beaten the 96 Bulls. That's two different categories teams. I was taking about a hypothetical 1995 Bulls team with Jordan. Not the Jordan/Pippen/Rodman/Kucko/Harper team of 96. That 72 win team achived that record for a reason! Our 95 team was possibly a "60 win team" IMO (if Drexler would have been with us the whole year). But still not good enough. Sorry. I just don't buy it. But a 95 Bulls team, maybe. Yes.
All you did was give an excuse of why we went 7 games vs the Suns (It was KJ)! You can always make an excuse like that. But you didn't address your original statement which was that the *only* reason that we went 7 games against the Knicks was because they had a center that could matchup with Hakeem. Right? You said that. But then you change your story when I brought up the Suns. I mean, you can make this statement for every team that gave us trouble (Soncis; that year and beyond!)...."They trapped, or our they had better PG, or they had a PF that we couldn't stop...etc, etc..." I mean, you were takling about the CENTER position, right? Yet, with the Suns it was the PG postion. With the Sonics it would be the PF postion...on and on we'd go.... My point was, that it wasn't JUST about Ewing (the center-matchp). So, you can forget about that excuse; as the Suns proved. Great players can't be stopped. They can only be limited and DOUBLE-teamed. And the better talent one has, the better chance of winning. Maxwell was a good defender. That's it. Jordan still lights him up! In fact, Maxwell's performance would have suffered for guarding Jordan as each game went on. What's funny is that you use KJ (our PG guard defense) as a 7-game excuse. Yet you wont put the same limitations on Maxwell against Jordan because...nooooooo....Maxwell is a Rocket and have a bias in his favor. The only way I could prove that Jordan would dominate Maxwell is if we played in the Finals. Then you would say, "The only reason we lost was because Maxwell was guarding Jordan....but if we had Drexler....etc..." Another changed story.... And that would fit right in with my point. We NEEDED DREXLER!!!! As far as your last sentence. (Hakeem on the Knicks). You might be on to something there. That is a whole other discussion. Interesting thought... The Bulls game plan would have been to mix up the defensive assignments. Sometimes you double down on Hakeem, sometimes not. So, "scubs centers" to me doesn't mean they have zero effect. Cartwright was NOT a scrub. He was very capable defender (pointy elbows and all; just ask Ewing, Laimbeer, and Kareem). He's not going to "stop" Hakeem, but he'll be a an effective body just like you said about Maxwell on Jordan. Although, Drexler would have had a GREATER effect on Jordan (if we had him). I mean, how can you say that Maxwell would have been "effective" against Jordan ("make him work" you said). Yet, you wont give Carwright the same respect against Hakeem? You imply Hakeem would have free reign? You're not being fair. Give Cartwright *more* credit than just "scrub." Also, this idea that Maxwell would guard Jordan in single coverage is just as silly as saying that Hakeem would have been guarded in single coverage with Cartwright. Nope. Both players would have been doubled. And at least Jordan had Pippen he could go-to; his 2nd option. Hakeem didn't have that luxury. He has to rely more on his role players. The Bulls just had more ammunition. No, I'm not saying that it's impossible. What I'm pointing out was the past chokes of Houston's sport teams. This would have been just another factor against us. And Dream's past foray into the Finals were with *other* teammates and against another opponents (Lakers; apples and oranges). Hakeem 90's team was not the same players (they didn't have that same experience. Not like the WHOLE Bulls team did). So lets stick with the 90's for second (it's not 1986)...Now remember the Bulls were defending champs. The heart of a champion does have some value, right? Chemestry and unity. Don't ya think? The Bulls had this. They were coming off their 3rd ring in a row. And as long as the core group was held together the team would not have had any growing pains. They would have just continued on with their orginal chemistry and confidence. This is a huge factor in winning over the long serise. The Knicks didn't have this confidence or experience. Which was good for us. I mean, I bet they were saying, "Man! I'm glad it Jordan was gone!" We'll never know, will we? -> Hakeem on the Knicks. You said that MY argument is that "we had 1 HOF'er compared to their 2??" That's not all.... It's not *just* HOFer (x2) only. Although that's a major reason...but there are many reasons. It was the fact that the Bulls played as a unit, scored high from all five positions, ran pick-and-roles, unitized the fast-break (one of the best), shot the 3 (like us), played a Soncic's style trapping defense (which a Drexlerless team struggled against), had the best player in NBA history on their team, had the best-all-around player (2 x HOFer), at the time, in Pippen (people hate to admit this here), added a future *sixth man of the year* in Toni Kukco and had best 3 point shooter in the NBA in Kerr. And in my opinion Grant was a little better PF than Thrope because of his outside shot. Whose game I always hated (I was glad we traded him for Drexler). The Bulls were just an all-around dominating team. Those are the reasons. Again, regular season means very little to me (just ask the Magic, Spurs, Suns and Jazz in 1995). Winning in the play-off/finals is about your collective talent, individual talent, chemistry, execution, offense, defense, and what you do on the court. Talking is cheap. Wouda-coulda-shoulda. It's only a pipe dream and wishful thinking to say that we would have beaten the Bulls just based on the regular season match-ups. Yep. The Bulls had MJ and Pip. We had *only* Hakeem. But if you think that Maxwell makes "Jordan" work, then you need to give Cartwright the same credit when guarding Hakeem. Anyways.... Icehouse. You are one of the few dreaming homers that still exist from the past. There aren't many left. Not like 2002!
