Dwight Howard is the best center in the NBA, live with it.

Has Howard made one real post move yet this year?

 

Wow. I didnt think this could be a real debate when i saw the thread title, but 20+ pages?

Amazing.

 

Since you say it shouldn't be a debate, what is your take on it?

 

Give it up Durvasa.... You've had this exact conversation/argument with people on the boards for 2 years now. Their viewpoints will not change....

 

Howard had one HELL of a game yesterday. Just insane numbers.

 

I don't even know what you mean by this?

Yao kills Dwight in head to head matchups, and is the more efficient offensive player.

Dwight is the superior defender and far more durable.........

 

That triple double was insane. It's not every day that someone gets a triple double with blocks, rebounds and points.
I'm really leaning towards Howard on this one.
Yao has won their head to head matchups, but overall Dwight is much faster, a way better rebounder, and better defender because he isn't so slow laterally. Plus overall he is more efficient than Yao (TS).

 

Carmichael Dave doesn't live in Houston or China, so I assume he thinks Dwight Howard is the superior player.

 

Ericka Dampier will give Dwight Howard a hard time tonight. So I wonder what kind of excuse will you Dwight Howard bandwagon fans come up with. Hehehehe.............

 

The question is if you are GM which guy would you take?

I love Yao, but if I were GM, I would take Howard.....his athleticism and defense fit more into today's NBA.

Yao is great, but he has more deficiencies with his lack of quickness.

DD

 

I've said it before also and been called a hater and a fool. There isn't a exact theory or formula, but here is how I determine a players ceiling,floor and up/down/flat arrow.

The players ceiling and floor is his atheleticism. Whether the arrow is up,down or flat is the separation between his atheleticism(ceiling) and his skills. Once a players atheleticism and basketball skills are even,the player is at their peak. The higher the ceiling,the higher the skills,the better the player.

I use my formula and said last yr yao,scola,tracy,shane were peaked out and couldn't really get better. When I said yao and scola's arrow was even, I was told how its only his 2nd yr and how the guys can get better. When I use my formula, the ability to make a big leap was marginal. A guy like howard and even like amare were such great atheletes that if they had a great work ethic, their potential was so great. Now you can never tell how the athelete will work so that why you have stro swift,kwame brown and guys like that, but when you get one, he can be tremendous. That's why we see howard do things "hakeem like" on the court. That's why Shaq was so great. Shaq went from a physical freak of size,strength,and quickness who turned into a skillful pivot. Yao's biggest advantage is his shooting and size, but I never thought that he was ever strong enough in the core. His balance is bad to combine with it and when you're physically limited, you have to do a lot of other things really good.

One thing I really like about howard is he doesn't let his offensive production effect the rest of his game. You don't see many 8 pts 8 rebs 0blk games from him. If Yao would have a 8pt 15rebs 4blk game, I don't think as many people would criticize him. Not only that, he's 23 or so. People say a injury will make him useless, but shaq and amare had early career injuries and it made them better players. Look at amare before the injury and post injury. His jumper is money and yao who was deemed the better shooter can't hit a 15fter unless its a ft.

 

Leeb,

I somewhat agree with you about skills, but in Scola's case, he could produce more if asked, he has the skills to do that, and is comfortable in that role, but he is not asked in this offense.

He scores at will in International competition as the man against Howard, Bosh and anyone else the USA throws at him, but on the Rockets he is not asked.

So, while I agree, based on your criteria his level is even, he could produce more if asked to do so.

Now, getting to the meat of your post....I like the analysis, but I think one more factor should be added, and it is a hard one to quantify...BBall IQ.

All of us have played with great athletes who work hard, but just don't get the game, while you see some non athletes that get the game have more success....Larry Bird comes to mind, as does Jason Kidd, average athletes that outthink their opponents.

It is when you combine work ethic, BBall IQ and athleticism that you get superstar players like MJ, Dream, Jordan, Barkley....these guys had all 3.....

But I contend that you can be a great player with great BBall IQ and a great work ethic....and just be an average athlete.

The problem with Yao, is while he is an average athlete for his size, he is just never going to be quick, his thinking is good, and his work ethic is unmatched, but his lack of athleticism is so glaring that it stops him from ever reaching superstar status.

Dwight has atheticism and work ethic, but I have not seen the BBall IQ....so I think they are about even....with a slight edge to Howard.

DD

 

The head-to-head stuff is blown way out of proportion. Howard has only been considered widely as the better center over the last season or so. And they've only played eachother a couple times in that span. Howard may not have put up monster numbers against Yao, but the Rockets have had oneo f the best team defenses in the league and that's not all Yao. A couple games really tells us nothing.

 

DD, u know we're going to always disagree on scola, but that's ok. When I talk about the ceiling floor thing, there are some variables. The lesser the athelete, the greater the skill needed to compensate. Larry Bird and Mullin were examples of this. Bird was avg at best from a atheletic pov, but he was a great passer,shooter,very good rebounder, and a great leader. Nash,magic,stocton are also examples. I can even throw duncan in there because he's a great rebounder,defender,passer,leader and shooter. GM's take gambles in the lotto trying to find that combo of great athelete who can have great skills. Kobe,jordan,malone,barkley,fream and the list goes on. If yao was great at something not including ft shooting what is it. That's why I think its super duper critical that he works on his 15 ft jumper. With the little explosion he had is gone, he needs to be effective and a threat away from the goal to open the baseline. He needs to improve his iq which involves passing angles. He needs to get his core stronger to stay in balance. He can get better and be effective, but the thoughts of him being a great player vanished after yr 4 for me.

That mid range jumper and iq is really critical for him and the team. At the high post, no one is worried about him driving past them, but knocking down that shot forces the big man to stay close, which opens the baseline. Improving his iq allows passes to cutters on that baseline. Get stronger allows him to absorb and still be fresh for 37 mins a night.

 

You are right on with this post, and he can make that shot, or he could....but now he seems hesitant to make it.

I agree about him making it forcing the defense to be honest and opening up the cutting angles from the baseline to the FT line.

Backdoor cuts are fantastic, even if the defense reacts and closes it down on the cut, it leaves someone else open for a wide open shot as the defense scrambles to rotate and right itself.

DD

 

So Yao owned Ericka Dampier and Diop at the same time. Dwight Howard tonight can't even crack 20 points on Ericka Dampier and shot 6-14 FG. Therefore, Erika Dampier kept Dwight Howard in check and Yao >>>>>> Dwight Howard.

Wussup now Dwight Howard bandwagoner fans!??? HAHAHA!

 

Who could argue with that? We all know the results of one game or twelve games determine who's the best layer at any given position. Case closed.

 

I guess you forgot Yao got owned by Kendrick Perkins in the boston game eh?

 

We're not talking about Boston game, we're talking about Dwight Howard's inability to own Ericka Dampier and Diop tonight!

Nice try, NOT!

 

HAHAHA! Amare is playing like crap tonight! YES! HAHAHAHA! YES YES YES!