Apparently you missed the horrendous Janet Jackson boob incident. You also must not have been around for Blowjobgate. There are certainly American's that are not repressed (America probably produces and consumes more p*rnography than any country in the world, though perhaps not per capita), but they do not represent the mainstream, especially in comparison to Europe.
1. sex carries with it a bit more power than passing gas or taking a dump. if you're saying it doesn't, then i'm guessing you haven't had sex. 2. sex is a two person thing (unless you're Fatty, and then it might be 3 if you can convince her). by definition, it has social implications. it involves feelings/emotions/etc. it's about relationship..to whatever degree. it requires consent or we call it rape. i'm convinced that my six year old doesn't understand those dynamics. i have no intention of sharing them with him yet. when it comes time to talk to him about it, i will. and i won't wait for a magic age...i'll base it on who he is and where he is, personally. but if you're suggesting we start uniformly talking to kindgergarten age kids about sex, i'm suggesting you haven't been around enough kids that age yet. 3. what is the fascination with europe on every topic? this isn't just for you SM. but how many times in my life have i heard, "you know the people in europe are just laughing at us?" am i supposed to care about that?
I wouldn't trust anything StupidMoniker says....he sees nothing wrong with bestiality and called the murder of an Iraqi civilian doing the right thing and a brave act
Neither of those activities are animal "rape," because the end-goals for either are mating/breeding, which could serve practical non-gratificatory* purposes. I shouldn't have asserted that lack of choice, for animals, was a sole criteria when defining animal "rape;" which I would probably have more accurately referred to as "exploitation," and which I still think is legitimately illegal in an animal rights context. I'll probably play the "public health issue" card again too, even though I don't have a lick of data to prove it. I read that Kinsey calculated something like 40% of farmers were humping their livestock, and I guess if he didn't report any related health problems, then I dunno. *-possibly made up word
So in other words you don't address the issue but the person. Saddly that attitude is fairly widespread here.
Interesting discussion here. I think I agree with StupidMoniker and Master Baiter's point here and think that with all of the dangers involved with STD's unplanned pregnancies and sexual abuse that we should be preparing our children early. While it would be nice to say that children shouldn't be exposed to sex until they're much older its a hard thing to avoid in our society. I agree though that 5 year olds might not be able to comprehend and I have no good answer regarding when children should be educated about sex. I do think that its a huge mistake to not have sex education in general and the argument that many parents make that sex education leads to having sex so it should be disallowed IMO is just parents putting their heads in the sand. Like it or not we're sexual beings and its better we confront that head on and early than leaving it up to children to form their own ideas.
1. I am not saying it isn't. 2. Any kind of intimate contact is a two person thing and has social implications. You can be charged for kissing someone that doesn't want you to do so. We also expect kids to learn about other things at an early age that have social and legal ramifications, things like not hitting people, sharing, etc. I think that some of your positions are colored by the fact that children are not being exposed to sexuality at an early age. Of course they have no way of understanding it if it has not be explained to them. On the other hand, if children learned about sexuality at an early age when they are learning about everything else, they would have a better grasp of what is going on. (I wonder if kids that grow up on farms and see animals mating have a different understanding than cityfolk.) Since I have no children, I am not claiming to be some sort of expert on how to raise them. I am just tossing out ideas here. I don't think it is neccessarily true that having children would provide much insight on the effects of things you have never tried though. 3. I only mentioned Europe in response to tigermission's claim that the US was not sexually repressed. I think that relative to many other first-world countries we are. Now, we are not as repressed as oh, i dunno, Iran (<- that one was for you CF) but we are not exactly the most liberal country when it comes to sex/nudity. I agree with you that we do not need to take our cues from Europe and con decide for ourselves what course our country should follow. I did no such thing. I said that a soldier following established procedures in order to protect himself and his comrades was doing the right thing and there was nothing wrong with being proud of him. That it resulted in the death of an Iraqi civilian does not make it murder. The ends are not the be-all and end-all in judging an action. (GOING WAY OFF TOPIC HERE - IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT, TURN BACK NOW) I like these discussion threads where people can and do reply directly to one another's posts. Does anyone else ever wonder if there posts are even being read in things like the Mock Draft or All Decade team threads? Almost all the posts in those type of threads are totally independent of each other.
This begs the question of whether an adult who has a loving and platonic relationship with a child is considered a pedophile. All fears and concerns are still there. Exploitation is still possible. It's all hypothetical. Who can rely on the word of another, especially if it's a pedophile. There's a twist that in today's society where people like teachers, who are afraid of being accused of sexual crimes, cut children off from touch and signs of affection, like a pat on the back or well-intentioned a hug. Maybe this makes kids more succeptable to pedophiles, or maybe it emboldens a self-determined pedophile.
Why are we talking about this when there is serious stuff going on in the Congo? Why didn't the super concerned person who started this thread start a thread about the Congo instead? What is the point of this Dutch bashing?
SM -- i hear what you're saying. what i'm saying to you is that i know my child. i know the mind of 6 year olds. my kid is pretty sharp, and i'm telling you he wouldn't have the maturity to sit through a conversation about that. if that's what you're suggesting, i just disagree. in everything, there is a season. i have no problem with sex education. we had sex education in my elementary school -- in the 5th grade. great. good time, in my mind.
Americans are obsessed with sex in an unnatural, almost sickness sort of way. Sex is commercialized here, it's used in the most unnatural ways for companies/corporations to brainwash people into buying their products. Sex in American is manufactured, THAT'S the problem, not that Americans are 'sexually repressed', they're sexually obsessed, and it's an unnatural obsession that is slowly but surely destroying the very fabric of our society. I have a question for you: are Scandinavians as 'obsessed' with sex as Americans are? I remember Elisha Cutherburt (sp?) on one of the late night talk shows talking about that once. When she was asked about her homeland Australia, she said something to the effect of, "You know, America has this unnatural obsession with sex, in Australia it's not the same way, people there don't think about sex in the same way, it's just something." So yes, I disagree that America is 'sexually repressed'.
That's because the colonial rulers of the Congo were Belgians not Dutch. Geez Hayes don't you know geography and World History.
But might not what you see as sexual obsession be due to sexual repression? That American cultuer has a schizophrenic personality when it comes to sex so on one hand we have a puritanical attitude regarding public nudity and displaying sex. Australia has legal prostitution, topless beaches and also shows nudity on TV. I don't know if the Scandanavian countries have legalized prostitution but they do show quite a bit of nudity on TV. By limiting exposure (double entendre intended) to sex Americans have developed a juvenile attitude towards sex which might be what you are considering as a obsessive sick attitude. For instance when I was 20 I visited Bali and then the beaches there were topless, I remember going to the beach and for the first half hour I kept on thinking "boobies, boobies look at all the boobies" but after awhile it was no big deal and no different than if the women were wearing bikinis.
You make a good argument, but I still wouldn't call the lack of public nudity and soft p*rn on network television to mean that Americans are 'repressed'. I think Americans (at least the older generation, probably not the youngsters) generally have a conservative attitude towards sex, meaning that they place restrictions on sex, but that absolutely doesn't mean that they're "repressed", for all we know they're having sex day and night behind their closed doors, so I think it's an inaccurate description to label Americans as "sexually repressed". They certainly might have traditionalist views regarding sex, but I am not sure that means they're somehow denied sexual pleasure, they just might believe that there are more appropriate 'venues' to express your sexuality. DISCLAIMER: Deckard did in fact miss the memo!
I wish the United States was as enlightened as the Netherlands. Have you ever spent any extended time there, tiger, or are you going by this absurd stunt, by a tiny minority of Dutch individuals? It is a wonderful country... progressive, highly educated, and free. It is a democracy, so everyone, even tiny groups like this one, have their platform to speak out, if they desire it. That is how democracies work, true democracies, not theocratic shams, and autocratic family enterprises, both masquerading as democratic states, and far too prevalent. I would love to have the ability to retire there. Six months of the year in the Netherlands, and six months in the United States, would suit my wife and I very well. Keep D&D Civil.
