Actually no, you are just either ignorant or choose not to realize it. Here is a test: have you EVER shopped at Wal-Mart? Have you EVER bought a pair of shoes? You may not realize it or even care to, which is fine. I am just trying to expose the self-righteous hypocrites around here.
You still wear them. Again, you think it's ok if you don't see it. But believe me, you are reaping the benefits of slavery more than anyone in Dubai. Those who work in Dubai are living a better life than they were living before. No one cane deny this, and the exception won't change the rule.
The point is the following: 1) She didn't know the laws of the country. They smelled money and they bent over for it. 2) No one is buying that this woman has to live in a Range freaking Rover. I've discussed it with several expatriates in Dubai, and now I sure as hell don't believe that the husband is in jail with a brain tumor, that his lawyer didn't translate for him at his trial and that they didn't know about "not being able to leave if you're in debt" law. Nevermind the article's fudge up of saying she has to say 9 months for a 6-month sentence which started a month ago. 3) Everyone in Dubai lives in concrete. Virtually all structures, all villas, all residences in the United Arab Emirates are made of concrete. All compounds contain identical villas, buildings, appartments. This is the nature of the construction industry in Dubai. It's ugly as hell, but it's not different for anyone except the super rich elite in Dubai. Also, as of 1 year ago, Dubai passed a law barring laborers working more than two hours of overtime unless by choice. Working above certain temperatures is also not allowed. This is all great for the writer and you guys I suppose. I picked up a telephone, made some calls, and am now assured by several people that this article is ridiculously exaggerated. That's all it takes for you too. I sure as hell don't expect you to trust what I say, but I would expect that if you seriously give a damn, you try to find things out for yourselves. Pick up a phone, get on a forum, do something. The 3 people I spoke to, all of whom are expats, also all knew the same thing. The writer of the article has personal reasons to bash Dubai at every opportunity. How ironic that this is from "The Independent". lol
Grats on not answering the arguments above? The argument is whether those labor laws are good, not whether the woman should have known they existed. (which she probably should have) Secondly, you're anecdotal stories about talking to expats don't mean anything. I can cite equal stories from relatives in Dubai who will say the opposite (namely criticisms of the labor situation in Dubai). Not to mention my relatives are Indian and have a closer connection to the labor situation there being that it is primarily Indian/Pakistani. And you're concrete argument? What is that supposed to mean? So because all structures are built out of concrete the suffering of migrant workers is ok? You missed the point entirely. It's not about how the structure is built, it's about the conditions of those structures. It's deplorable and the Dubai government has barely enforced its own labor laws when it comes to construction. I mean there's an economic incentive not to enforce its laws but Dubai hasn't. And your arguement about new laws is irrelevant considering Dubai barely enforces existing labor laws. And you know what about your last point. I have made a phone call. In fact two months ago I was with 4 people who were visiting from Dubai and they painted a far different picture from what you suggest. And it's not one of some capitalist paradise. Less hyperbole and anecdotes please, and more argument. At least justify why their system is good as opposed to bankruptcy protection.
Maybe. Still not seeing a point here. It seems quite plausible to me. So when I talk about slave workers living in concrete bunkers covered in feces, you respond to the 'concrete' part? Interesting... I talked to my friend who frequents Dubai, and he said you're wrong. And those reasons would be...?
Guys, Mathlooms government will not let him respond to any criticism, in fact, he may even be employed by them to spread propaganda. Who knows? When you are not free to speak your mind, what you say is always in question. DD
Right on. As long as there is income disparity and trade, there is "exploitation". It sucks for the poor laborers but without this "exploitation", their situations may be far worse.
Mathloon is just being careful... "A new draft media law would make it a crime to damage the country’s reputation or economy, punishable by fines of up to 1 million dirhams (about $272,000). Some say it is already having a chilling effect on reporting about the crisis." http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/12/world/middleeast/12dubai.html?hp
I'm pretty damn sure Mr. Andrews wont be leaving Dubai anytime soon. He's probably figured out the cost of medical care in his home country would effectively render him slave labor for the rest of his life. He would be free in name only. Dont waste your breath Mathloom. If it doesnt resemble suburbia, its hell, a slave labor camp and nothing good can ever come of it. Never mind that the "victims" enjoyed living in this same "hell hole" for years.
So when the nation itself has a debt that is 110% of GDP, as the article points out, is the king going to imprison himself? Thought not... Guess that chump should have thought twice before getting a brain tumor, what a fool!
Uhh, did you read the article? Tax free income and for all intensive purposes a fleet of servants at your disposal all while enjoying the same lattes and shopping malls you find anywhere else in the world...sounds like Dubai is getting more than its fair share of exploitation. And secondly, 14 hours a day of unpaid labor in extreme conditions are somehow better than whatever they had before? You know this how exactly?
Most of the laborers in Dubai (and Saudi, Kuwait, etc) come from India and Bangladesh where they were living below the poverty line on paltry wages. By working hard overseas in in the Middle East they made good wages and can support their extended families back home by sending money every month. Are the work conditions ideal? No, but these people are much better off than they were before. And if they didn't take the job, there are thousands of people ready to jump at the chance to take their places.
Like I said I wouldn't blame this guy, but when you buy a benz making 30k I have a problem with that.
oh ok, so since their lives used to be sh!tty we can still treat them like ****? they came from areas that are predominantly poor, to areas that have GDP of first world nations, yet treat their laborers horribly. also the notion that they make 'good wages' is ridiculous. they take a year or two to pay off the debt to go there for god sakes. their passports are taken away and they have no way to leave. this is called indentured servitude. you know that thing we got rid of a century ago? yes but as nations claiming to be somewhat civilized and part of global village, the GCC should institute decent labor rights. they can afford it, and they should. otherwise there's no reason they should get any favorable trade agreements, or allow to be in the WTO or other similar things.
It takes time for a nation to grow into a 'civilized' society. These people became rich overnight, it was about 30-40 years ago they were all living in mud houses. The UAE didn't earn this wealth, like spoilt children it fell in their laps, once they go through some adversity they'll learn..... Every country has growing pains, the U.S treated black people as second class citizens about 60 - 70 years ago. Things changed OVER TIME.... Punishing a country for being behind in the learning curve is not beneficial to anyone (usually the only people that get hurt are the poor). Plus your 'global village' still has some super powers (China & India) with child labour issues.....point being......every country has issues!! On a side note, from what I know, most of the executive level teams of companies in Dubai are foreign educated (expats), what responsibility do they hold?
1) It's really none of our business if the labor laws are good/bad. Labor laws are far worse in other places. If you're asking if I like them, I absolutely like them. Obviously, I don't like the abuse of those laws, but I see the laws being fair. 2) Ofcourse they don't mean anything to you, which is why I said to find out for yourself. Also, if the people you are calling are so appaulled, ask them why they stay? For my curiosity. 3) The concrete argument was pointing to the writer using the word to make it seem like they are in jail cells. The conditions in some of these camps may be bad, but the exaggeration is unnecessary. There are tons of lies in this article and that's what I find funny. 4) Here's my argument: There are people who prefer their system amd there are people who prefer the bankruptcy protection. The world won't have one law and as long as you can move in and out (assuming you owe no money) then it's just a matter of choice. But this has no effect on the only part of the article which disturbs me: that conditions for laborers are bad in one labor camp out of thousands. Again, it is not a democracy over there. It is, for all intents and purposes, a kingdom. We all know what comes with the territory. The laws are known. You don't have to go. So whether we like the law or not is unimportant - Dubai has one of the highest population growth rates in the world. For your last point, hypothetical argument means squat to me honestly. I enjoy it, but when finding the truth, I'll go to the source. I have been to Dubai several times, and I have seen with my eyes the laborers and the labor camps. I have seen where my father's employees live. Understand that I don't care if that is of any value to you. I care that we all find something reliable and base our judgement on THAT.
