Don't ever scream for Sage Rosenfels to start again.

I don't know why he wasn't given a chance in Washington or Miami. Maybe he hadn't developed enough physically yet. Maybe he needed time to develop his pocket presence and learn the game.

I do know that he's had more training camps and more NFL playing time/coaching (both games and practice) than Schaub has had to develop into what he is today... which, on this team, is VERY valuable (a guy who can be called on any day of any week to lead the team, and look comfortable doing so).

But lets not get ahead of ourselves... Sage makes plenty of miscues/gaffes even in games he's overall playing well in (and I wrote this before last week's performance). He's been steady... but its not like he's played so over-the-top well that the Texans are a laughing-stock around the league for not starting him.

 

ohhh ric this is soooooooo you, you've decided to discount overall seasons and look at individual games, you still haven't addressed schaub's wild swings, at their best its best game 119 to 116 so why can't i discount what i want?

 

why is that significant?

more relevant, meaningful circumstances: johnson didn't play in 6 of schaub's 15 starts; he missed only one of rosenfels' 6 starts.

its not an invalid point but pgabriel's argument is that rosenfels has better talent - better pocket presence, stronger arm, an ability, apparently, to win games better....

 

Slow day at work, guys?

 

It may not be - but it could suggest that Schaub was at his best when the league hadn't seen him. If he's regressing with more starts, it could be that it was flukish or a result of a lack of gameplans against him. I don't think that's the case, but it's certainly possible.

Right - but if the gameplan is not designed for you, then your performance will be worse than an equally talented person that the gameplan is designed for. So if they have some similar numbers (and overall, they do) but the gameplan is designed more for one of them, then that reflects differently on the two players. It's possible that if you went into the season with Sage as a starter and built a system most suited to the passes he likes and the plays he runs best, he'd have more 100+ QB rating games as well. Doubtful, but possible.

 

At the same time, pgabriel (or maybe you) used the argument that Sage didn't have an offense geared around his abilities since many of his starts have been in relief or last-minute like last week.

Well, then you use the argument that other teams haven't been able to gameplan for him for those same reasons (same reasoning you're considering for Schaub's early starts above). So you've gotta think those 2 come close to evening out..

 

pgabriel, i've discounted absolutely nothing. not a thing. neither player has started an "overall season" - how can you NOT look at individual games? what's left?

but if you go back through the thread, you're the one dismissing things. in fact, here's what you posted about sage's "career" with the dolphins: "so what happened in miami is neither here nor there." pretty convenient, don't you think?

yes, pgabriel, i did: there're part of the growing pains associated with grooming a young starting QB.

in his first 15 starts (with an infinitely better team, btw), romo posted 7 100+ games and 4 sub-60 games. in his first 15 starts, schaub went 5 and 2. and he played 6 of 15 games without andre johnson. number of games romo was without TO in his first 15 starts?: zero.

look, if schaub was consistently, week after week, topping out in the mid-to-high 70s, then i would be worried whenever he randomly posted a 20 or a 30. but in a 1/3 of his starts - a third! - he's posted a 100+. so i'm going to live with the occassional lows if i have that high a ceiling.

it's honestly a no-brainer, IMO.

i'm sorry but one game is not enough of a basis to draw any definitive conclusions. david carr posted a 140.2 back in '06; i guess he has greater potential than both?

granted, you're dealing with a small sample size, but it's telling that rosenfels has 1 100+ game (116.6) and his next highest is 85.6; kinda makes the one 116.6 look like the anomaly, no?

 

piggybacking on kaleidosky's excellent point, you also don't normally bring in players that don't fit your system. it's not like rosenfels is a running QB being asked to throw 70 times a game and carry the team on his arm. kubiak is very much a system coach - he prefers certain but specific types of RBs, OL and QBs.

so there's some validity to the point but its not defining.

 

I didn't watch the game yesterday, but would be happy to answer this query.

 

you know, another thing about schaub (and i'm not saying rosenfels doesn't have this), but i'm really starting to admire his tenacity. he played horribly the first two games; fans and media were screaming for his head. he promptly answered with a very nearly flawless game against jacksonville.

this week, with the colt loss still fresh, he tumbles out of the gate and could have easily sunk after those two INTs. but he battled back, kept the team in the game and delivered on the final drive.

pretty gutty. if he could stay healthy - if the team around him could stay healthy - i think he's going to be good. not two 2s, $48M good but... good.

again, pgabriel, for me, it's all about upside. he has it; rosenfels doesn't.

 

edit:

 

come on, pgabriel - he threw 64 and 27 passes those first two years while starting once.

if he finishes the year in the 70s, then you'll have a much stronger foundation for claims of regression. but not after 4 starts, one of which was the worst of his career (rating-wise).

 

What's awesome is your blatant hatred of Sage based on a four minute stretch. "Well, Sage throws less INTs than Schaub... but still too many!!! and he fumbles!!" followed by cute nicknames.. I guess that's what you're reduced to when your argument fails.

As I said before, the last four minutes of the Colts game was a fluke. I don't know whose the better QB for the Texans THIS season.. but it also isn't clear cut.

One thing I loved about Sage is he seems to realize we have a top 5 WR on our team.. I felt like Schaub ignores AJ too much sometimes (though, he did a great job going to him this last game.)

 

in his last 4 games, schaub has thrown 15, 12, 7 and 20 passes to johnson. rosenfels: 6, 11, 7, 12.

 

sorry; that should read "last 4 starts...." i used their last 4 starts.