Ball hogs are only a problem if they aren't efficient. "Oh no, he shoots it and passes it a lot more than others on his team. Get this, he does it efficiently as well while the rest of his sucks ass offensively. The nerve." The Rockets biggest need is a guy that will try to force his will onto the game, and then a guy that does it well gets criticized for doing it too well. Also, Garland was almost as much a ball hog before Mitchell showed up took the ball away from him because Mitchell was flat out better.
People said the same thing about not taking the ball away from Harden. The thing is, when you have one single player dominating the ball with the whole team deferring to him, you get stuck when defense forces the ball away from that guy in the playoffs. We've seen that happened to the Rockets during the Harden days. It would be harder to defend if the team always plays a secondary scheme with the guy contributing off ball. Mitchell's career usage is 31.5. Garland's highest usage (the season before playing with Mitchell) was 27.8. I'd say Mitchell is more ball dominant, but agreed that he is a better scorer.
Can Ime get him to actually buy in and play defense? He should be a much better defensive player than he is. Similar physical traits to Ant, who is amazing on that end. If he can change the way he plays on the defensive end, that's the only way I'm interested in paying a premium haul of trade assets for him at this stage.
Houston's problem wasn't Harden. It was Golden State. If the bar is Golden State, not trading for Mitchell doesn't meet that bar either.
Well he was part of some top defenses in Utah. And skimming some of his old on/off court numbers seems like he was not a sieve even when Gobert was off the court. This looks to be more of him not caring more than an inability to play defense. One advantage on the Rockets is that he at least don't have to play next to a small guard, since the rest of the Rockets roster is pretty massive. Unless of course they don't trade FVV but rather extend him, which would be interesting in a different way.
I suppose it's possible it's just a coaching fit issue and/or he's simply unhappy being in Cleveland. I do wonder if he would view Houston as enough of an upgrade to really buy in and want to stay here, and also I wonder how he'd mesh with Ime and whether Ime's coaching style will be as effective with an established star in his late 20s. I'm still extremely skeptical about the fit but I've warmed up to the idea a little bit. I still don't like the timeline thing though. We'd be banking pretty hard on the young core developing quickly enough to fit Mitchell's window, and I'm not sure that they will.
There are really people in this thread saying they wouldn't want Mitchell. lmao. This website outsmarts itself sometimes
I guess we can agree to disagree about Harden's style and impact. I know this is a point of contention among Rockets fans. Anyway, if Mitchell had Harden's playmaking and efficiency, I'd feel more confident having him as our best player. My point is, if your game is highly ball dominant, you'd better be able to carry a team all by yourself. (To be fair, Harden's usage at his peak was way above Mitchell's.)
You might not have to pay a premium for him. Think back to Jimmy Butler being traded from Chicago to Minnesota with two years left on his contract. The Wolves gave up Kris Dunn, Zach LaVine and Lauri Markkanen. A year later, when Butler wouldn't sign an extension, they were forced to trade him for salary filler and two second-round picks just to get something back. It's hard to see a team giving up a ton of picks for a player that will be a free agent in a year. The Cavaliers are in win-now mode. They were close this year. We need to offer some win-now players for them. Jalen and Adams with seconds or a protected FRP could get it done.
What makes you think he’s not good defensively? Genuinely curious. He’s 89th percentile in Defensive EPM last year. 1.2 in DBPM. If this is what uninterested defense looks like I’d like to buy low.
Reputation and eye test mainly. His effort level always looks really poor to me when I watch him play. I'm also little skeptical about the defensive statistics that say he's good given that he plays with two good rim protectors a lot of the time he's on the court.
Honestly this is all just offseason we have nothing else to talk about stuff, because I think the odds that Mitchell wants to come to Houston is near zero. Houston is more of a NBA destination city than most people would think, but it looks like he has suitors from LA and NY if he's available. So I don't think you need to worry about it either way. If the Rockets are trading for a star, I think the deadline is the much more likely time.
You are way overestimating the likelihood of any young player needing to get paid. The Thunder had 3 young max players and a 4th player in Ibaka who made like 80% of the max. And they could've paid all of them without having to pay the luxury tax had they just gotten rid of a role player in Perkins. If the Rockets has that kind of talent on their roster, you should at least wait till they get their ass kicked in the finals before wondering who they can pay.
You really want Mitchell and FVV as your starting guards? I don’t. If they will take #3, FVV, and the 26 nets pick protected top 5, I might consider it. Then we would be trading one rental for another and throwing in a crap pick this year and a long shot pick in 26. If Mitchell got us to the playoffs as our new PG, he would consider coming back. If it doesn’t work we still have our core and a bunch of cap space plus our 25 Net’s pick.
Let's take a look at the same stats for guards / wings that play with terrific rim protectors. Darius Garland Same as DM, played with Allen and Mobley D-EPM 51th percentile, DBPM -1.2 Based on what I've heard on the forum DM has if not worse, similar defense reputation as DG. But DG is significantly worse. Desmond Bane Played with JJJ whole year D-EPM 56th percentile, DBPM -0.3 Collin Sexton Played with Walker Kessler D-EPM 16th percentile, DBPM -1.9 Damian Lilard Played with Brook Lopez D-EPM 81th Percentile, DBPM -1.3 EPM may have inflated his d-impact somewhat, but if you use the ensemble, his defensive impact, or lack thereof, gets exposed Devin Vassell Played with Wemby D-EPM 72th Percentile, DBPM -0.9 Austin Reaves Played with AD D-EPM 10th Percentile, DBPM -0.4 Tyrese Maxey Played with Embiid D-EPM 40th Percentile, DBPM -1.0 I get the reservation about advanced defense stats, it may be misleading in a vacuum without context (team build, style etc), but it's still very useful when doing relative analysis. The fact that he played with terrific rim protectors might be inflating the stats and skewing the impacts, but it cannot skew it so that they ALL look like he's an elite level defender. He's good in all D-LEBRON, D-BPM, D-EPM metrics. It's not only team setup. My point is not that he's some defensive stud, he's not. But guys here think he's Austin Reaves / Darius Garland / Colin Sexton level terrible, and he's absolutely not that bad. He's actually quite good in recent years. (In case it gets lost in the shuffle, here is Mitchell's stats: D-EPM 89th Percentile, DBPM 1.2)
