1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Donaghy: 2005 Rockets/Mavs Series Tainted

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by DieHard Rocket, Dec 8, 2009.

Tags:
  1. Angkor Wat

    Angkor Wat Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2007
    Messages:
    13,150
    Likes Received:
    997
    The JVG Rockets were considered to be one of the most boring teams to watch. Also the fact that JVG made those infamous statement could be another reason why they didn't want the Rockets to win. They were making a statement. Question the officals publicly and you'll regret you ever did.
     
  2. DieHard Rocket

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2000
    Messages:
    9,413
    Likes Received:
    1,161
    He's not saying that the NBA is "fixed". He's saying referees have their own personal favorites and enemies that they may call for or against, and that partiality is rampant.

    To say that the NBA is completely rigged and they choose their own champion every year would be ludicrous. But to say that there is a dark cloud over the officiating and they obviously are not ethically and morally sound (and neither is the league) is quite justifiable.
     
  3. DCkid

    DCkid Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2001
    Messages:
    9,661
    Likes Received:
    2,706
    [​IMG]

    I agree that's the type of call (no-call in this case) that makes you go hmmm.

    But still the only logical reason I can see the refs giving favorable calls to the Mavs is to force it to seven games. Unless I'm mistaken the series was tied 2-2 at that time, so once again what's the motivation?
     
  4. DCkid

    DCkid Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2001
    Messages:
    9,661
    Likes Received:
    2,706
    But once again talking about this particular series, which referee's had good relationships with Mark Cuban? The guy has berated them far more than JVG ever did, and probably more than any other owner, coach, player in the entire league.
     
  5. larsv8

    larsv8 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2007
    Messages:
    21,663
    Likes Received:
    13,916
    People seem to think the allegation is that Stern had TD fixing games to favor a teams advancement. Or that Stern wants big market teams to win because its more fans and what not.

    TD was gambling based on what he recognized as biases by certain refs towards certain players. When he was caught he spilled some of the little things the NBA did that seemed like they might be true. He was not fixing games he was betting on.

    No where is it alleged that Stern instructs the refs to make big market teams win championships. What it says is...favorable ref treatment is given on occasion to push series further.

    Evidence here can be seen in Lakers/Kings series and the Mavs/Rockets series, heck even the Heat/Mavs finals. It appeared that the Mavs(in finals), Rockets and Kings had the advantage and would win thier series in less than 7 games. Questionable officiating pushed all those series further than they might of gone had it been officiated normally. Unfortunatley in these specific cases, the team which recieved the favorable treatment ended up being the victor in the deciding game despite perhaps not being the better team.

    Thus when people say well then how come big market team A didnt win here or how come little market team B had so much success, its not a contradiction to TD's claims.
     
  6. Angkor Wat

    Angkor Wat Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2007
    Messages:
    13,150
    Likes Received:
    997
    Did anyone who hear the entire interview catch this part:

    Somebody on another forum mentioned this part and I didn't see it mentioned here. Very interesting if he said that.
     
  7. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    35,057
    Likes Received:
    15,230
    Donaghy has said elsewhere that the Lakers got some benefit on calls because they were good about being a pain-in-the-ass about sending in complaints to the league about mistakes. Cuban's complaints could annoy the refs and make them want to punish him, or they could cow the refs and make them call things in Dallas' favor so they don't have to hear Cuban complaining. I think Cuban was aiming for the latter when he made his complaints, and I think it worked. Not just with the moving pick violations, but with officiating, generally.
     
  8. J.Will.Xu

    J.Will.Xu Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,715
    Likes Received:
    7
    This no-call happened in Game 7 if I remember correctly. We were about to go on a run to pull us within reachable deficit to compete for a win in that situation. Momentum changes quickly after that obvious action by Finley, completely and abso-****ing-lutely out of bounds and stripped the ball away from Jon Barry. :mad: Me and my homeys were cut up with that officiating back in taht day, but life moved on and it's all brought up like 4 years later? Well, already get over it.
     
  9. Kojirou

    Kojirou Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2009
    Messages:
    6,180
    Likes Received:
    281
    What I'm reading here is "certain refs didn't like certain players and were nasty towards them." But that isn't corruption, or heck even anything that's even remotely fixable. Refs in general are going to have biases towards one player or another, as it's simply human nature, and to claim that a ref being possibly biased towards one guy or another is a sign of corruption is ridiculous - at worst it's a sign that that is just not a good ref, and if the Tim Donaghy story is to spout "The NBA has bad refs", than we're wasting our time talking about this.
     
  10. GlenRice

    GlenRice Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    3,990
    Likes Received:
    239
    your wrong, this happend in game 5 where rockets lost by three points.
     
  11. GlenRice

    GlenRice Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    3,990
    Likes Received:
    239
    podcast or something for those who missed it.
     
  12. J.Will.Xu

    J.Will.Xu Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,715
    Likes Received:
    7
    If he did say that in his interview, then screw him! :mad:

    That was T-mac's prime year I may say, he just screwed up that series, which was supposed to be highly likely the first time since 94-95 Rockets advanced to the 2nd round of the playoffs, also would have been T-Mac's first time.
     
  13. J.Will.Xu

    J.Will.Xu Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,715
    Likes Received:
    7
    :( that just feels like a twinge, won't bear it anytime it's brought up.

    Thanks for correction.
     
  14. rhino17

    rhino17 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2006
    Messages:
    18,028
    Likes Received:
    4,440
    How long into the interview does he say that?
     
  15. jev5555

    jev5555 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2002
    Messages:
    4,354
    Likes Received:
    2,015
    [​IMG]
    Vindicated
     
  16. AggieRocketsFan

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2009
    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes Received:
    82
    I assumed that was a joke about his book.
     
  17. DCkid

    DCkid Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2001
    Messages:
    9,661
    Likes Received:
    2,706
    If your conjecture is true, then this isn't even news. It's the same reason coaches sometimes decide to get the themselves thrown out of games in order to make a point. They know complaining can sometimes work or else they wouldn't do it. Happens in every single sport at every single level. That's just part of the game and if that is the case, then kudos to the Lakers and Mavs for doing it so well.

    Every time I've tried to refute a point in this thread a new explanation is brought up for why the refs might have favored the Mavs over the Rockets. A lot of these points seem to contradict each other. I think this is what we have so far....

    1.) The NBA fixes the games so big market teams win...but wait the Mavs aren't a bigger market/draw than the Rockets

    2.) They want the series to go to seven games...but wait the game that was the most blatantly poorly officiated of the series was game 5 when the series was tied 2-2.

    3.) Refs don't fix games but call games favorable for guys they like and have good relationships with. Wait, refs hate Mark Cuban. There's not a figure in the league who has been more critical of them the past decade.

    4.) And finally, refs don't fix games for guys they have good relationships with, they only call games favorably for the assholes that give them a hard time about their officiating.

    Did I leave anything out? There's a whole lot of circular logic going on here that I just can't compete with.
     
  18. jev5555

    jev5555 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2002
    Messages:
    4,354
    Likes Received:
    2,015
    Actually the Metroplex is a larger market than Houston 6.3 million to 5.7 million.
     
  19. ItsMyFault

    ItsMyFault Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2009
    Messages:
    15,646
    Likes Received:
    978
    Isn't that only because Fort Worth is combined with it?
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now