I would honestly keep Battier. Why? Because I know what this team is capable of with him. Maybe ron will eventually click very well with the rest and take us over the hump, but there's an equal chance he won't. Ron's pulled the team out of some holes, but he's also put them in some holes as well. Battier usually has a positive effect, yes sometimes its a huge positive and lately a minor positive effect, but it's still positive. I also believe Shane brings things to the team that only come out behind close doors or in huddles, that no one else, except for maybe Deke and Barry, can bring. However, barry and deke can't transfer that to the court because thye don't play much, battier can.
I think Shane's still not completely healthy. He just seems hesitant out there. I hope that his regression is not permanent. He's still young enough to regain form.
1st qrtr 1:55 - rockets bringing ball up, battier's man sticks to him, when ball swings to ron, battier's man leaves (knowing ron will shoot, which he does) 1:30, Battier chases Crwaford through pick, defends shot, crawford, has to pass in mid air due to shane's hand in his face. 1:12 shane's man sags off of him, ball is on the side opposite shane, no need to stick to him too close, common basketball knowledge as this is done with any player who's away fromt he ball... 54.9 shane cuts inside, runs back to 3 point line, maggette chases him and turns his back on Brooks, who slips into the lane for a layup +foul. 40 sec Battier sticks to his man, even comes over to help brooks when his man shoots... 30 sec Maggette sticks to battier in the corner , balls swung to the top, he sags a bit... i'm sure the whole game was like this, but i think yyou get my point..there's more to it than just watching his man, watch why he does what he does and the results..
2nd qrtr 11:32 Maggette sticks close to battier int he corner, Landry is set up in the post on that side, landry gets an entry pass, Maggete sticks to Battier instead of turning around to double Landry, landry scores easy bucket. 11:21 maggete tries to take shane off the dribble, shane stays in front of him, maggete has to turn around and come back out to try again, goes other direction, goes up for the layup, fouled by Scola, but battier literally SWATS his attempt, so there's no chance of continuation 10:55, Maggette has ball, shane in front of him, maggette settles for long jumper, no good. 10:41, magget donw low on battier, battier sets pick for landry, then runs back out, maggete chases battier instead of sticking to landry, landry gets inside position and scores. 10:18 Jackson has ball, thinks about driving, but shane, the help defender, steps in closer to him and jackson decides to shoot instead, no good. 10:10 maggette again sticks to battier at the 3 point line as rockets shoot, but no score 10:04 GS fast break, Jackson tries lay up, battier defends it, jackson misses. 9:42, battier effectively defends GS pick and roll, but ball is kicked out to watson who drills along three 9:24 Maggete sticks to battier, then sags a bit off of him when landry gets the ball int he post on the opposite side, once landry makes a move to the rim Maggeted comes over to help. 9:10 Battier deep in the corner, maggette sticks to him, enabling brooks and landry to work pick and roll without any help defenders coming over, Landry makes jumpshot. 8:50 Maggete drives on battier, and scores on a DIFFICULT double cluth layup. Yes even the great ones gets score on sometimes, notice how this is the first score on battier in at least 7 mins and it was a tough shot.
RV6- Good work and that shows why GSW is on of the worse defenses in the league. You're suppose to play to your scouting report. Go rewatch the lakers game and tell me what kobe was doing . Shane would dump to Yao,shallow cut, Kobe wouldn't even turn his head and would go double Yao.
That's not a good example. If you watch the Lakers regularly, you know that Kobe Bryant frequently will double on players without paying much attention to his man. Wade does the same thing. They're roamers. Also, the Rockets won championships with guys standing behind the three point line while they're man doubled down on the big guy in the middle, didn't they?
I like Shane as much as the next guy, class act, but he's gotta go now. Anybody in the league in his position can do what he does-the numbers he's been putting up lately. Chuck Hayes should have been gone years ago. I don't understand why the Rockets keep holding on to this guy.
...and once again, the majority of posters on the BBS show the only thing they can grasp is total point production. This was the first game since Indiana that Shane shot below 50%. If you're evaluating Shane based on his point totals, and think he has to go if he isn't chipping in 10 ppg, I don't know what to tell you. Unlike Chuck, Shane isn't a complete joke on offense, bricking 4 footers. Despite the injury, he's still hitting 40% from the field and 39% from 3. That's better than half the rotation: McGrady, Artest, Alston, Brooks. Posters want to say he's no good on defense? Maybe he's not himself, but tell me whose been better on that end? Who? McGrady? Wafer? Artest? Battier at 70% has still been just about our best guy on D. Battier's been all over the boards lately - coming up big with key offensive boards late in several games this past week+. 7 rebounds last night, 12 against the Pacers. Don't tell me he brings nothing to the team. If this was still a roster that would put him out there with Juwan Howard, Hayes, Head and Alston...than yeah - his total lack of explosiveness on offense would be a concern. But on this team, with Yao...Scola...Landry...Artest...McGrady...Brooks...a Battier 0-fer isn't going to be the reason we lose games. McGrady, Artest, or Alston 4-17 shooting nights hurt us a LOT more than a Shane 0-3 ever will. He's a glue man, sets good screens on offense, and stretches the D with his outside shot. That's all he is. That's all he needs to be. But hey, when he's no good on X-Box or in your fantasy team, I guess that tells some of you all you care to know. Evan
Well, that big guy is not named Yao. Dream could handle double well but Yao rarely attacks double teams.
Durvasa, I expect a little more from you. Horry would cut to the hoop, catch alleys, and run the floor.Pre rockets, shane did the same minus the alleys. I'm not just looking at pt production, I'm looking at overral effectiveness. Spacing is one thing, but when ur man is crowding yao and the passing lanes that's another. Shanes inability to step up as a role player when the team needs him most is a huge reason why the team has playoff failures. How can u score 22 in a playoff game, then proceed to avg 7ppg. If he coulve just gave the team 14 ppg, the rox couldve won that series. Just think, in 95 finals, people were actually debating Horry as finals mvp. Nevermind Dream and clyde were awesome, but the fact Horry was in the conversation. That's being a role player.
Horry was the 3rd most important player on the team. That's a pretty high standard to hold all role players to. Super Mario Elie gave us 6 ppg in our first championship run and 9 in our 2nd. Shane normally gives us about 10 a game, he's not 100% right now, but will get better as the season goes. But even if he's only good for 7 a game, his offense isn't what our potential title run depends on. It will depend on Yao, Artest, and Tracy finding a way to get on the same page. Scola, Landry, Brooks, and Wafer's offense will be more important than Shane's. Shane's defense is going to be more important than other role players like Wafer or Landry.
Horry took a ton of 3-pointers in those Finals, far more than was typical in those days. Most of them came because he stayed behind the arc, open, and took advantage of double teams on Olajuwon. And the 3-point shot is used even more in today's league. Let's compare Battier to other floor-spacing role players of today. Offensively, he's similar in role to a James Posey or Bruce Bowen. Do they cut to the basket when their man doubles down? More so than Battier? By my observation, not really. But let's put it to the test. NBA Hot Spots shows us where each player takes his shots. Here's the shot chart for Battier and Posey this season: We can divide up the shots into 4 zones: Inside shots, short midrange, long midrange, and 3-pointers. If a player is merely standing outside the 3-point line too much, then we could probably surmise that too many of his shot attempts are 3-pointers and not enough come inside. I'll summarize the information from the shot charts here: Code: [B] Inside short midrange long midrange 3-pointers %shot shot/36min %shot shot/36min %shot shot/36min %shot shot/36min[/B] Battier 26.3% 1.8 7.1% 0.5 7.1% 0.5 57.7% 3.9 Posey 25.7% 2.3 6.2% 0.5 4.6% 0.4 61.9% 5.5 Shot distributions are about the same for both players, with Battier taking a slightly higher percentage of his shots inside the 3-point line. Posey generally takes and makes more shots, but particularly beyond the arc. I'm not trying to argue that Battier is a well-rounded offensive player. He is not. But he plays a certain role in our offense, a floor-spacer, and in that capacity he generally does what other players in today's league with the same role will do.
Durvasa, u know I love ur breakdowns, but ur breakdown don't show run starting shot or run breaking shots. Now do they count toughness. Posey, in a tight spot has shown he will take and make big shots. Horry was the same way. Part of being a good role player is having the nuts to grab the moment and make a play. Game 1 vs spurs in 95, horry was 0 fer. Clock was winding down,game was tight and he looked around, everyone was covered and he took and made the shot that won the game. That's what role players do. People want to bang on tracy,ron, and rafer and some of it is worthy, but next time u watch, watch how many times shane passes the ball when its under 5 secs on the shot clock. People think that's unselfish, but that chicken. Coaches will tell u not taking a shot that late and passing the responsibility is selfish and poor bbiq. A lot of forced shots from tracy and artest is because a guy like shane is scared to shoot a contested shot. That's chicken to me.
a lot of the plays i wrote involved shane on D, so the Golden State defense is irrelevant in those cases. As for when GS was on D, my point was to show that battier's man isn't always leaving him as you implied. you didn't mention a specific game you wrote "everytime". Also, the only reason sticking to shane is bad defense is because houston's post players are very capable of scoring if they have single coverage. Any team that knows anything about D would focus more on Yao, Scola, Landry, who are threats to score 60% of FG rather than a 38% 3PT shooter. I dont see how shane being only a 3pt shooter is a knock on him, its been a while since Houston has had guys who are so efficient around the rim, this means more guys ARE around the rim, so why have shane go in there? One, it's going ot be so clogged up in there he won't be able to do much, and two, i would much rather have landry, scola, or yao trying to score inside the paint than battier. I just don't understand why fans keep trying to forced Battier to become a versatile offensive player. He's never been and never will be. The team's offensive problems IS NOT the talent, they have more than enough firepower, its the ball movement that's an issue. To have ball movement you need spacing and 3point shooters provide that.
Battier has shot AND made his share of big 3 point shots. I can remember several games where Houston had a very small lead (1 to 4 pts), with only about 1-2 mins left and shane would hit a big 3 to give them room or to pull away, but big shots thart aren't game winners at the last second don't get much publicity, just like shane's game.
