Do we tank the last game(s) of the season or do go head on with the mavs

What nobody seems to be addressing is that Dallas is much better than Seattle. The Sonics are only seeded higher because they're a division champ, but the Mavs have the better record. The whole point of getting a higher seed is so you can play a weaker team, but in this case, there's a fluke that would result in us playing the stronger team if we get the 5th seed instead of the 6th. What's the point of being 5th then?

Also, I strongly believe that out of all the playoff teams, we matchup worse with the Mavs. We have no one that can even come close to staying with Dirk. Also, they have a lot of size to throw at Yao. It's true that we split with the Mavs this season, but Dirk was out for one of our wins. I say there's no way we can beat them in a 7 game series. I'd have a different opinion if we still had Juwan, but we don't.

For those of you who would like to take on the Mavs as a means of avoiding the Spurs until the Western Conference Finals, I say that you're putting the cart before the horse. And anyway, I still think we matchup better against the Spurs than the Mavs.

 

No. Not if it means you have to lose games on purpose. Do you understand the significance of what you are asking Rockets to do? You just don't do something like that. First of all if the idea even comes into the Rockets players head, this team is not ever going anywhere, they're gutless and they don't have what it takes to go all the way. Theres nothing macho or tough about accepting your destiny and not running from it. Its just the natural thing to do - you play to win, you don't tank, you don't play for a lower seed, and you don't walk out on the court with your tail between your legs. How can you play with your head held high knowing you lost games on purpose to get a lower seed? You can't and you won't succeed cause you won't have what it takes in the first place with that losers mentality so it won't matter whether you get the 6th seed or 5th seed becuase you have enough doubt to even think about losing to get a lower seed so just forget about the whole damn thing. and if you do take that route and win the championship then the championship is an empty goal for losers. Aside from all that, do we really want to give dallas fans, the players, and that loud mouth Cuban, the satisfaction of knowing the Rockets purposely dodged them and loss games to get a lower seed? I don't.

 

Very well put.

 

I second that. Tanking games is not acceptable.

 

You're making a big deal about it now, but come playoff time I highly doubt the players would even give it a second thought. I'm pretty sure that if the Rockets handily beat Seattle in the first round, the last thing on their minds will be the games they tanked. Their confidence will be sky high knowing they made the right decision choosing to face Seattle.

I happen to think that the players on this team are more mentally tough then you give them credit for. They are not so mentally weak that asking them to take it easy for a couple of games will completely damage their psyche. They are veteran players. They understand what playoff positioning is all about. Now if they really are that mentally weak, than they really never stood a chance of making it very far in the playoffs.

 

I don't know anything about mental toughness. But I do know whats right and whats wrong, and losing games on purpose is wrong from every angle, in every way. Theres just some things in life you don't do. And losing games on purpose to get a so called better playoff positioning is one of them. Theres just something about life and how things work out in their own particular way that if you lose games on purpose for whatever reason its going to come back and bite you in the ass. Also I think we're underestimating the type of people and just who we are talking about here. I have a feeling that if I were to suggest to one of the houston rockets players or coaches of this team that they should lose games on purpose to get better playoff positioning that they'd sock me in the mouth. I don't see any signs in the character of this team that just demolished denver that they would for a moment think about losing a game to get better playoff positioning. I really hope I'm reading this team right.

 

I think that the main thing that is wrong is that teams are put in a position where it is better to lose. How can players be expected to be sportsmen, doing the best for their team in all ways, in this cicrumstances? It just isnt possible.

That is why I think they should come up with a system which minimizes the chance that it happens. Like my suggestion that the three division winners get to choose their opponents (see http://bbs2.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?threadid=94318).

 

It's not tanking, it's called resting. Playoff teams do this every year; no wrath will come down from on high for us if we do the same.

Sit out anyone that's the least bit sore. Have Yao look to shoot some easy jumpers instead of getting beat up inside. If the Rockets win, fine, but let's not pretend that winning these games helps us in any way for the first round, because it doesn't. It will hurt us in the first round. THE NBA IS ALL ABOUT MATCHUPS.

To suggest that if the Rockets lose games in which starters don't play big minutes, their confidence will go down is a really weak argument. That shouldn't faze veteran players like ours in the least.

Thacabbage makes the only persuasive argument I've seen on the matter. If you can't beat the Spurs, put them off as long as possible. Perhaps the Spurs may suffer further injury problems and then you can win, but even if the Rockets lose, at least next year's free agents will give us more serious consideration. I can go along with that. I just cringe at the prospect of Cuban gloating at Toyota Center. Can't let that happen.

 

Well, Mcgrady has admitted he used to phone it in while in Orlando. And Van Gundy has been known to rest players when facing inferior opponents (ie. letting Yao take the game off against the Hornets). So no, I do not think it would be beneath them to tank.

I just think you're making it a much bigger deal than it really is. Teams play to avoid all the time. Why do you think Saturday's game with Denver was so important?

Because both Houston and Denver wanted to stay away from the 7th seed and avoid a first round matchup with the Spurs. The Rockets DID NOT want to face the Spurs in the first round. If you think otherwise, you're just being naive. This is pretty much the same situation.

 

I would love to see Jeff Van Gundy assemble his team and tell Bob Sura, Dikembe Mutombo and Jon Barry to please go ahead and intentionally lose the next two games. I mean, competition is honestly pretty overrated.

"Gee Tracy and Yao, I know you've worked hard all season. But fact is, I, Jeff Van Gundy, can't come up with a way to beat the almighty Dallas Mavericks. I just don't have faith in you guys enough to risk it; after all, Dirk is really good. So, let's go ahead and try to play the depleted Sonics before we roll over and lay down for the Spurs. After all, we really aren't that good."

I would LOVE to see that. The team would laugh right in his face. We don't have a team full of wimps and p*****s. We have a tough team that rises to challenges. It's not like this current Mavs team is some battle-tested, playoff-hardened machine. What has Jason Terry ever won? If you're afraid to play somebody in the playoffs, that just means you weren't meant to be there in the first place. Period.

 

A possibility would be to sit our guys and rest them for playoffs. But no. We are going to win every game from now on.."ced" called it!!!!!

 

We got f'd in the goat a' by the 3 division realignment this season.

If the old lineups were in place you'd have...

1. Phoenix
2. San Antonio
3. Dallas
4. Seattle
5. Houston
6. Sacramento
7. Denver
8. Memphis

We'd be playing Seattle in the 1st round like we should be based on our record.

 

As for Denver, the Rockets NEEDED to beat them last night. Prior to last night, the 7th seed was a probable outcome if they didn't take care of business. The 5th seed is not great, but the 7th seed is much worse. Because of that, the Rockets still need one win, and they probably need to take care of business against the Clips. If they could know that Denver was going to lose against Phoenix, the Rox could consider "resting", but the Rox play first, so they can't. Looks like because of this, this whole discussion is moot for the next game at least - the Rockets need to win #50 tomorrow. We'd all like to see that milestone reached anyway...

EDIT: Just saw that Rashard came back strong today against Minnesota and Allen shot well today. If the Sonics play well these last few games, getting the 5th seed won't feel so bad. (The Grizzlies are so lucky the pressure's off them. That had epic collapse written all over it.)

 

If you don't see the difference in the two situations where in one situation a team plays a game to win to get a better seed and where in another situation a team purposely loses to get a better seed, then you don't understand the difference of what it means to do things the right way and what it means to do things the wrong way. If its the same situation, the two paths they can take go in complete opposite directions. one path is where you do things the right way and face what destiny lies before you and the other path is where you try to carve out more favorable circumstances and weasel your way to the top. Thats not what type of team this is. I don't think you put enough thought into what type of dudes makeup this team.

 

Um no. TMac gave up because he wasn't getting any help, and this was after 3 years of frustration. He didn't lose on purpose like a little loser.

 

when people say tank, what do they mean. tank as in purposely miss shots and not try to win or are they including resting guys and possibly not even playing them. if you're are talking about the former, then no i don't want to tank. if the latter, then every damn team does this. all "the whole nba will laugh at us" crap is hilarious. we didn't play francis and mobley the last two games of the season last year. anyone who thinks people really give a rat's ass about what you do in the last 2 games in terms of not playing the stars is mistaken. something tells me duncan, ginobili, and parker will barely see the court in their last two games. and i bet nash, shaq, wade, amare, dirk, ray, iverson, etc will all sit or barely play. we would be wise to do the same if our seeding can't be affected.

as someone already pointed out, referencing the 95 rockets as a team that had momentum is kinda ridiculous considering they had none. i say we try to win with the guys on the court but don't put tmac and yao out there for any more than 30 minutes in either game and sit both the last game if it doesn't mean anything.

and putting lots of exclamation points and saying "we're not scared" doesn't do anything to change the fact dallas is far better than seattle and far worse for us to match up with. and if your goal is to win a title, minimizing tough opponents should be your goal. you know kinda how teams play all year to get to match up with the 8th seed and to have homecourt throughout. or maybe that's just because they're scared.

 

Bravo to Apostolic3 for that post. Good find.

I hate stupid misinformation leading to misinformed opinions.

I am against tanking, and I only wanted to play the Sonics if the Rocks could have had home court, but not now. People here are underestimating a healthy Sonics team.

Keys to winning in the playoffs (my opinions):

1) Play good basketball
2) Matchups
3) Home court advantage
4) Momentum

To me, momentum changes on a dime and means crap.

NIKEstrad dude, that isn't momentum, that's kicking every teams collective asses for half a year. That's just domination.

The Rockets are playing good ball. They've been doing so since January. How they play these final 2 games SHOULD NOT effect how they play in the playoffs. GOOD TEAMS DON'T GET LIKE THAT, and I believe the Rockets are a good team.

In my opinion, the Rockets are only slightly better matched up against a healthy Sonics team, so even though finishing number 5 is a hit against priorty 2, priority 1 is still paramount, which is playing good bball.

I say don't overplay T-Mac. That's it. Don't tank, but don't let T-Mac get hurt.

 

maybe I'm missing something, or joined the thread late enough that I couldn't read every word of every post, but....

Seattle won today... right? So they now have 52 wins on the season, which we cannot attain at 49-31 with two games left.

Ok. That said, we are tied with Sac, and one game ahead of Denver, both of those teams have two games to play like we do.

So, if we hold tiebreakers on Denver and Sac, then all we have to do to stay where we are is .... NOT tank. right? Wouldn't winning these two games solve everything? not tanking, momentum, 6th spot (playing Seattle) etc?

I am the first to state I may have something wrong, but is this all not correct?

 

ugh 5th spot. sorry. haven't "contributed" and wouldn't let me edit.

 

I agree with the contention that in order to be the best you have to beat the best, as others have mentioned before. And what's more, I don't want to have anyone discount the post-season success the Rockets are on schedule for by saying we had an "easy" 1st round matchup against the Sonics, should we decide to tank these last couple games. We've heard too much of that nonsense in Houston with the back-to-back championships with people saying we only won because M.J. was on hiatus or that the Sonics lost in the 1st round that year. IF we go deep into June I'd rather do so by beating Dallas so it'll quiet all the discreditors.