Roethlisberger was selected 11th overall, one slot out of being top 10. Flacco won because of his defense, he's not a franchsie QB, by the evidence of this season. Kaepernick has been figured out and is not a good QB. Romo is garbage and won't win you anything. Manning was a #1 overall QB until he injured his neck and got replaced by another #1 pick in Andrew Luck. Sure you can find a QB late, but with the GMing we've seen in the past thru either Smith or Casserly you really can't count on that with the Texans. I would much rather take my chances at the top possible talent coming out that has shown he is the #1 pick like Teddy Bridgewater has.
And guys like Sam Bradford, Alex Smith, JaMarcus Russell, David Carr, and Tim Couch were picked #1 overall. Don't pick a QB with the #1 pick, please. No one in this draft is worth it.
I respectfully disagree. You distinguish the good from the great QBs by what they do on the field, not by their coaches play calls. Both Manning and Brady have the free will to check out of a play and audible into another. It's much easier to pick apart a defense the way Brady did last year when you can manipulate your offense to attack the defenses weakness for that given play. If we get a guy that has it both between the ears and physically with a creative OC that would definitely be an optimal choice. But if we keep hiring guys that don't have the confidence to give our QBs that free will, we will forever be handcuffed by having that disadvantage on offense.
Well I can think of one prime example of a good OC (masquerading as a HC) that turned some backup into three 4,000 plus passing yrd seasons and a Probowl MVP award! Spoiler ...I'm just kidding...
Like I said, go look at the passing stats. The number of QBs with 100+ passing attempts posting QBRs over 90 is just insane. The NFL is as soft and mushy for a QB as it has ever been, thus reducing the difference between the elite and the good to great. Dudes like Nick Foles, Mike Glennon, Josh McCown, etc are torching people... no thanks for the schemes their OC is running IMO. Ironically, Brady was a very meh QB until he got synched up with an OC that new how to take advantage of this new NFL rule schema.
3 years from now, would you be more likely to guess Glennon or McCown will be good, or Andrew Luck or Aaron Rodgers? 3 years ago, the names on your list would have been Matt Cassell, Kyle Orton, and David Garrard, all with 90+ QB Ratings. If you want stability at the QB position, you need a great one. Otherwise, you're up and down every year and constantly trying to find one that can be good for a year or two.
My point is that having that "once in a generation" QB is not as important as it once was, because the NFL has evolved to create more of them. Not only that, the drop-off from the elite is not as stark as it once was. There's like 15-16 quarterbacks playing right now that I'd say you could win a Superbowl with based on how they're performing. Will they all stick around? No, of course not. But after seeing how badly Gary hamstrung this offense, even if we end up with the next Johnny Unitas, we're still going to be screwed if our OC sucks.
I don't think it has at all. The NFL has created more one year wonders that come and go and have great seasons and then flame out. But if you want any kind of stability at the position, the elite guy is still the only option. This is true regardless. If you have crappy coaching, you will suck. There's no question about that. So then it doesn't matter who you draft. But assuming you find good coaching, its still far better to have 8-10 years of stability at the QB position than have Matt Cassell or Josh McCown, even if they can put up similar numbers for a year or two.
Respectfully disagree. You are seeing guys like Brees, Manning, Rodgers and Brady make late adjustments and see and complete passes to receivers that other QB's just are not. An example is Newton. He is very physically gifted, and a very good player, but he leaves a lot of points on the field because he simply does not see the field as well as the super elite QB's do. Obviously an OC is very important, if for no other reason setting packages, etc. However the QB is the ultimate decision maker, at the line and in the pocket.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>It should be obvious to just about everyone that the Texans will use their first-round pick on a QB. Way 2 early 2 tell who he'll be.</p>— John McClain (@McClain_on_NFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/McClain_on_NFL/statuses/405030894341079040">November 25, 2013</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Great reasoning there Pancakes....... so we dont know whom the head coach will be, whom the GM will be..... but hot damn we are getting a QB in round 1! Bridgewater may be gone, Marcus Mariota may go #2.... but we will get a QB.... he may be 3rd or 4th best QB in this draft, but we are getting one in round 1!
FYI, those "late adjustments" you saw last night were Josh McDaniels. Not Tom Brady. Cam Newton was never billed as a very gifted passer, either. He's Daunte Culpepper with better wheels. Cam probably couldn't run a Brady/Brees offense if he wanted to.
Without a good OC, guys like Jay Cutler, Carson Palmer, Matt Ryan, Tony Romo, Joe Flacco, etc would be considered below average at best, IMO. Most of those guys are considered "Franchise" QBs. A lot of the guys you think are going to flame out from this rising young crop may very well end up sticking around as long as the guys I just mentioned. The flameout is becoming less common, it seems. That's my whole point. People are arguing over the draft, but I'm not going to give two s**ts about who we draft until I know who is going to be drafting them. At least when it comes to quarterbacks. There is no savior QB in this draft, so the coaching hire we make is going to be super critical.
I don't get it. When we had Schaub people here said you couldn't win a title because he wasn't elite enough. Now that we are going to get to have our pick of QBs it's "We don't need elite! A good OC can turn any QB into a productive one! Defense wins championships!" So...why don't we just go get another Schaub? I thought we wanted to finally be BETTER than that?
Nope, some of those adjustments were all Brady.... further, the decision making in the pocket was entirely Brady. He was a hell of a QB before Daniels, and would be a hell of a QB without Daniels again. Agree with you on Cam. He is a good QB, but will NEVER be in the class that Brady, Manning, Brees, Rogers and a few others because he simply does not see the field as well and he seldom makes adjustments.... no OC can cover that.
That's an awful lot of words to put in my mouth. Let me finish my lunch first, at least. Not really sure where/why/how you came up with all that, but the main takeaway is this: I'm not going to start worrying about spending a high pick on a QB (or who we draft at all) until I know who the coach is. If we get a crappy OC, I'm not giving much hope to whomever we draft, period. If we get the right OC, I'm liking our chances for winning a Superbowl even without getting that "savior" QB in the draft. Not that we shouldn't try to find him (duh), but I think the importance is overblown. There's no longer such a steep dropoff after the god-tier QBs. I think a good QB with a great OC is more dangerous than a great QB with a good OC. That's all you should read into it.
Cutler, Palmer, Ryan, Romo and Flacco have won a total of 1 superbowl. Also every player on that list has had multiple OC's and have had good seasons with different OC's. I would also argue that none of those guys are real franchise QB's. If you don't believe there is a special QB in this draft, then I can completely understand your postion. However, a real true franchise QB makes a coaching staff look a whole lot better than they probably are. Look at the Packers without AR.... they are just bad, and it doesn't matter whom the OC is.
Might wanna tell all those teams, then. The flipside of this is that the Patriots/Packers made dudes like Matt Flynn and Matt Cassel look like rockstars.
