It's in the upwards of 8.6 trillion in loans and future commitments (chart inside). The government should get most of it back...I think.
That's not that the right comparison. The better comparison is Lebron James and Steve Francis. Like Steve Francis, many of those workers haven't kept up with the times, acquired new skills or otherwise progressed to the level such that their performance is not in the bottom x%. Like Steve Francis, they are viewed as expendable. Yes that is a generalization, but no more so than Wall Streeters are being generalized. So yes, those that lost their jobs for the most part, "screwed up" Yao Ming is more along the lines of a Chinese engineer hit with the glass ceiling. No matter how screwed, he's still very much drawing salary and paying taxes. Francis however, is not only taking a roster spot, he's also taking the Rockets' money and salary cap (like those not gainfully employed taking welfare. His spot should have gone to Deke. And speaking of Deke, he should be pissed the NBA doesn't have an ADEA.
Now we know where your angry profane thoughts come from....POOR YELLOW MAN, so oppressed that he has to smite on the interwebs...smite away like Romance of the Three Kingdoms-style!
LMFAO - right, only the world's largest insurance company collapsing due to a portfolio of super senior secured CDS and requiring 100 billion + in taxpayer funds to bail them out to keep the world economy from collapsing....among other things. But really there haven't been too many problems with credit default swaps
Steve Francis is more like property flipping yuppie who was hit by crumbling housing market. My previous analogy was appropriate. We are talking about many upstanding, working-class individuals who don't have the luxury of a system in their favor. Again using Yao as the example, he can be screwed in multiple ways that are beyond his own control. Besides the ref problem, he won't thrive in a run-and-gun offense insisted by his head coach. Further, unlike LBJ who controls the ball, Yao would be rendered ineffective if his teammates don't pass the ball to him as needed when he gets into position. One can easily find real life examples that mimic the limited options Yao faces in working-class people than typical Wall Street fat cats.
I only used Chinese engineer insofar that Yao is Chinese. It's the same way that I would use you when referencing the r****ded... I mean, the mentally challenged. Once again, you are missing the point. Yao is like someone who despite what the system dished at him, did not let his competency drop to the level such that he is a drain on public resources and may thrive if the world is "fair." And for that my hats off to him. Someone who lost his job is not the case, hence Steve Francis. Think about it. They may have at one point be like a post draft Francis with a whole life ahead of them. Only a high school education (Note: generalization, it is easier to make examples with one), but that's OK, they assumed they'll gain experience, seniority and of course the good ole job for life style loyalty they expected from their employers. But Steve Francis never developed a reliable jump shot, defense skills, passing, leadership, maturity, etc. Likewise, many of those laid off now never went to night classes or otherwise make themselves indispensable to their organizations, so now they are just high school grads who just happen to be older. And anyhow like I said you missed the point. Whether it's those failed banks who got bailed out or those employees who got welfare/aid, they nationalized/socialized the cost. Whether or not it is due to whatever circumstances hardly matters in regards to whether they nationalized the cost.
No I didn't miss the point, it's just that we were arguing different points. But I hope the way Yao has been playing lately doesn't undermine my assertion that he's always been a hard worker. Maybe he needs a Lady Macbeth type of wife to unleash the beast within.
1.22 Millon on Office Former Merrill CEO Thain resigns from BofA Executive under fire for spending $1.22 million on an office remodel Video Former Merrill CEO resigns from BOA Jan. 23: Former Merrill Lynch CEO John Thain has been forced to resign from his new job with Bank of America after some stunning spending habits were revealed. Today show NEW YORK - John Thain resigned under pressure from Bank of America on Thursday after reports he rushed out billions of dollars in bonuses to Merrill Lynch employees in his final days as CEO there, while the brokerage was suffering huge losses and just before Bank of America took it over. The bonuses were paid before Bank of America’s acquisition of Merrill became final on Jan. 1, and while Bank of America was privately telling the government that Merrill was losing so much money that the deal might fall through unless it could get more federal bailout money. Bank of America later received an additional $20 billion from the government, in part to offset the unexpected Merrill losses. The brokerage lost $15 billion in the fourth quarter and more than $27 billion for the year. The bonuses, typically paid in January, were instead given in December and totaled $3 billion to $4 billion, the Financial Times reported Thursday. Bank of America would not confirm the size of the bonuses. Scott Silvestri, a Bank of America spokesman, noted that Merrill was still operating as an independent company at the time the bonuses were paid. Had Thain not acted early, it would have been up to Bank of America to pay or reduce the bonuses later. Bank of America CEO Kenneth Lewis flew to New York on Thursday to meet with Thain, and within hours the spokesman issued a terse statement saying the two had “mutually agreed that his situation was not working out and he would resign.” The government helped orchestrate the acquisition of Merrill by Bank of America over the same weekend in September that another investment bank, Lehman Brothers, went under, setting off the most intense period of the financial crisis. The government also promised last week to guarantee about $97 billion in losses on Bank of America’s troubled assets, most of it coming from Merrill Lynch. Thain himself did not accept a bonus last year. Nor did four other top executives at Merrill: its president and chief operating officer, its president of global wealth management, its chief financial officer and its general counsel. Thain, 53, is a former head of the New York Stock Exchange and a former chief operating officer of investment bank Goldman Sachs. He had been named head of a wealth management division of the merged businesses of Merrill and Bank of America. In 2007, Thain topped the list of highest-paid CEOs in American business, with a compensation package valued at $83 million, according to an Associated Press analysis. That included a signing bonus and other enticements that helped lure him from the NYSE to lead Merrill. CNBC said Thursday that Thain spent $1.22 million redesigning his office — including $35,115 for a “commode on legs” and $1,405 on a parchment waste can — when he became CEO of Merrill Lynch a year ago. Thain also paid his driver $230,000 for one year's work, which included the driver's $85,000 salary and bonus of $18,000, and another $128,000 in over-time pay, documents show. Drivers of top executives are often paid about half that amount. New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo has opened an investigation into the bonuses, a person familiar with the probe told The Associated Press on Thursday. The person spoke on condition of anonymity because the investigation is ongoing. Silvestri said Lewis was aware of Thain’s decision to grant the bonuses, and some analysts said the disclosure also increases pressure on Lewis. Bank of America stock, which was already tumbling Thursday, fell further after reports of Thain’s departure but later regained ground. It closed down 97 cents, or more than 14 percent, at $5.71. Bank of America stock has been among the hardest hit in the financial sector. It has lost almost 60 percent of its value since the Merrill deal went through. The stock is down 85 percent from one year ago. “From a shareholder standpoint, board standpoint, you would really have to question his judgment,” said Jason O’Donnell, a bank analyst with Boenning & Scattergood Inc. $1.22 million to revamp office When John Thain became Merrill Lynch’s CEO in early 2008, he hired Michael S. Smith Design to revamp his office suite, spending approximately $1.22 million according to documents. The following is a list of the items in his suite: — Area Rug: $87,784 — Mahogany Pedestal Table: $25,713 — 19th Century Credenza: $68,179 — Pendant Light Furniture: $19,751 — 4 Pairs of Curtains: $28,091 — Pair of Guest Chairs: $87,784 — George IV Chair: $18,468 — 6 Wall Sconces: $2,741 — Parchment Waste Can: $1,405 — Roman Shade Fabric: $10,967 — Roman Shades: $7,315 — Coffee Table: $5,852 — Commode on Legs: $35,115 Source: CNBC.com It is unclear who would replace Lewis as Bank of America CEO if he were ousted by the board of directors. Thain was rumored to be most likely to be Lewis’ eventual successor, O’Donnell said. “Clearly Lewis made a bad deal. Thain did a very good job in selling him on the prospects of Merrill,” he said. “He needs to take responsibility for that transaction.” At the very least, the payment of bonuses indicates Thain was “completely tone-deaf to the culture of B of A,” said Tony Plath, finance professor at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte. “My surprise is the board gave him an opportunity to resign and didn’t just fire him,” he added. A spokesman for Rep. Barney Frank, the Massachusetts Democrat who chairs the House Financial Services Committee, said Frank was “very disappointed to learn this news, and these banks are the toughest people in the world to try to help.” Sens. Johnny Isakson, R-Ga., and Kent Conrad, D-N.D., said at the Capitol that they were not familiar with the details of the situation but that it would be an outrage to award bonuses in advance while the brokerage firm was suffering big losses. “If it’s found to be true that people were taking huge bonuses while accepting government assistance or taking bonuses while their shareholders were taking huge losses, it’s unconscionable in my judgment,” Isakson said. Some analysts expected Thain to leave soon anyway. When two huge companies link up, one of the CEOs from the standalone companies usually departs. Bank of America named its general counsel, Brian Moynihan, to replace Thain. Bank of America has come under criticism for acquiring Merrill and its huge losses, and Lewis has spoken out in the past about his dislike of the investment banking business. In October 2007, after Bank of America posted a 32 percent drop in third quarter profits, hurt heavily by investment banking results, Lewis said: “I’ve had all of the fun I can stand in investment banking at the moment. So to get bigger in it is not something I really want to do.”
Think of all the profits that went to midsize business in that office remodel. The movers and warehouse guys, the craftsmen and artist that got paid. Thain paid sales taxes the suppliers will pay income taxes. It's not wretched excess, it's economic stimulation. Who else is going to buy that expensive crap? If Thain didn't make it move it would just be stagnant assets. (what do you think the mark-up is on a $87,000 rug? Especially if the dealer wasn't having a "Going Out Of Business" sale.)
My god, can they at least get the story straight? John Thain wasn't forced to resign because his office decorations. John Thain was forced to resign because he and Ken Lewis wasn't seeing eye to eye. In fact, the rumour coming down the grapevine is that Thain pulled a fast one on Lewis, leading him to believe Merrill was in much better financial shape than it was and that Lewis tried (and failed) last second to get the regulators to halt the deal. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't be surprised if a certain BoA faction let this leak on purpose.
Btw, if there was one Wall Street CEO who "deserved" his bonus in 2008, it was Thain. People pointing fingers at him probably don't know his reputation as a rescuer. He was brought on to save a sinking ship. The amount needed to lure him, he was also being compensated for putting his reputation and job on the line at Merrill. If he didn't pull the BoA deal, where do people think the Merrill stock would be at right now?
If he spent 200,000, movers, designers, etc would have still gotten paid. The remaining 1 million could have been used in other ways that would still benefit the economy. How about a salary increase for some employees leading to increased spending or income taxes... No matter how you put it 1.2 million decorating an office is excessive.
This may be true. Pay them a decent wage that is not dependent on them falsifying alleged profits or engaging in senseless risk that misleads stockholders and cause capital to be misallocated in society. It reminds me of a job I had many years ago paying not much more than minimum wage. My boss taught me how to steal so that I would not have to quit and he would have the hassle of thaving to train someone else. The whole compensation system on Wall Street needs to be changed.
People outside the industry find it hard to under the banking and finance industry I talked to people who blame the whole financial system meltdown on greed, which is a fairpoint, but finance is about money its about greed so in that context I dont think banks did anything thats outside of the realms of what they are built to do.
I highly doubt the compensation system is going to change much, well if its offiically changed, companies will still find ways of compensating the superstars some of the people in finance are the brightest and most hardworking in the world, they rake in millions every year. The only way to keep them is paying them to be that superstar just like we pay Nba players NBA players make millions for the franchise just like those finance guys. its the same thing
It looks like some firms are changing the compensation to base it on multi-year performance with claw backs. They may lose talent to other banks with higher immediate short term bonuses. The talent at those other companies will still sell out the companies future for a 1 year bump in profitablity. Those companies could end up failing again. It looks like UBS is adding a claw-back to get money back, if performance deteriorates. Morgan Stanley has changed their compensation also. http://dealbook.blogs.nytimes.com/2...cutives-forego-bonuses-as-program-is-changed/
