[Debbie Downer] Forbes: Why Chris Paul and James Harden Together Isn't As Great As We All Want

Why do people think Vegas odds are support for anything? A lot of times the odds shift just because of the amount of money people are betting. For example, just because bros are putting a lot of cash on McGregor to beat Mayweather to shift Mayweather's odds down a bit doesn't necessarily mean McGregor got better or Mayweather got worse. Also, Nate Silver already mentioned that there are two big unknowns in the 538 projection for the Rockets. A lot of these sports writers suck with their hot takes.

 

bc it does mean something and money being put into a 1 on 1 matchup is a whole lot different then a league full of teams competing to win. the $ doesn't dramatically shift odds, the actual team does.

 

"To me, this feels more like a win-now desperation move to keep up the Warrior Joneses than a sound long-term investment."

Wow, this dude is a Rhodes Scholar genius. Can I write for Forbes?

But anyway - I admit that I can't see a Paul-Harden led team being any better than the Clippers teams of the last 5 years. Probably on the same level.

What matters is the ability of this pairing to lure third / fourth guys to Houston. The dust hasn't settled yet. Free agency period hasn't even started!

 

He is right. A big would have been a much better fit. It sucks that we missed out on Howard... oh wait...

Yeah it will be a challenge to figure out how to play harden and cp3 together. But when you got a chance to get the best oh of his generation and don't even have to give up much you do it. Plus other players want to play with him so he helps you to recruit other guys.

And what he is missing: sure this move doesn't put us on the same level as gsw. But it's not like we said: let's not get LeBron so we can get CP3. We did the most we could for our situation and we did more than any other team out there right now. ANd in the end: when you can get a star you do it. Especially when you don't have give up major pieces in return.

 

I think it is much better. Name the other G the clips had who could run the offense and create for others? I'll wait....... They never had a good one. Now Paul has Harden to run things at a very high level when he sits (James now has the same in Paul). The clips never had a SF worth anything and they only had 1 shooter to space the floor. We already have at least 2 or 3. This team will be built much better than those clips teams he had.

You are correct, it sounds like we are not done building out this roster and could bring in another all-star level player to be that 3rd wheel. It has to be a SF or PF player to balance things out in my opinion. Then we can fill the bench with capable role players who will fill a need. Good times!

 

author is intentionally obtuse to the fact that free agency hasn't even started and HOU has multiple avenues to add players. of course that wouldn't fit in nicely with his predetermined narrative

 

I agree with you. But the Clips also had point-forward Griffin and Redick and Crawford who could do damage in the Eric Gordon role. Outside of our big-2, we're super shallow right now. We have a lot of rounding out to do, and I'm excited to see how we do it.

 

I realize that most everyone here will dismiss what is being said in this article because it's skeptical of what just went down but the article is spot on here:

Daryl Morey has worked a lot of wonders in his time in Houston, so he has earned a lot of "In Daryl We Trust" wiggle room. But the reality is his Moneyball approach has not won titles. He hasn't taken the Rockets to the NBA Finals and has made just one conference final during his decade-long tenure. They have lost four times in the first round and missed the playoffs all together three times.

When this trade was announced yesterday I admit that I was curious as to what was Morey's ultimate objective behind such a move. Then I saw his press conference and I have to admit that it struck me as somewhat fatalistic in tone. While the trade will no doubt energized the red koolaid drinkers, it strikes me as somewhat of a hail Mary by the organization because it has no choice but to try to play "Let's Build A Superteam". The article references this:

To me, this feels more like a win-now desperation move to keep up the Warrior Joneses than a sound long-term investment. You have a foursome of Curry, Durant, Thompson and Green in their prime. It's no match. Listening to Rockets brass announce the trade, their explanation that they're simply trying to keep up in the NBA weapons race is a great sound bite but not sound roster planning.

This was a great trade as far a getting a star player goes but it comes with a ticking clock. They have just one year to see if this moves the needle enough against the GSW and SA. If not, then I fully expect to see CP3 move on (the banana boat rumor) and the Rockets will be back to square one...again. For now, I plan to temper my enthusiasm and take a long wait and see period. I just have to see how this works on the court come playoff time before I can feel comfortable with what this team is doing. It is what it is.

 

spot on? the team that has been winning titles for the last several years have a huge chunk of moreyball in their system. you still need actual talent to take that huge step into the elite category. long-term investment? oh ok lets not act like the rockets haven't been staying competitive for years in the playoffs while maintaining an immediate core only to realize the same ceiling year after year

 

Meh. I don't think anyone thinks this team is better than the Warriors as constructed, nor do I think any of us think we are going to make a move that makes us THE favorite.

 

We added one of the best players in the league in terms of overall talent on both ends of the court. We're not done moving. I don't want to hear about whether this pairing will work right now.

 

Of course it is a win-now move. You have one of the best players in the league on your team (Harden) in the middle of the best years of his career. The longer you wait to "win-now" the less likely a championship becomes.

 

Morey's not done yet.

Also, this sets up better to attract more players to come.

 

As I see it, Morey 's approach is basically the same one that has been employed since the days of Carroll Dawson but with much better results so far as the players DM's been able to snag. But the results have been basically the same as far as NBA titles go. And to be fair, if this is indeed an arms race of sorts then Morey has no choice but to try to play if he wants to change the narrative as far as his record goes. He really doesn't have any other option given his philosophy with respect to team building because this is how he's always done things.

I feel that the current environment in the NBA is actually a debate over how to put together a championship team given the whole build through the draft vs. building through free agency vs. assembling a "super team". This whole super team thing to me is simply not sustainable because of the tremendous imbalance it generates in the league as there are simply not enough stars to go around. The league is feeling the effects already - look at all of the white noise surrounding this year's playoffs as being boring and not worth watching until the Finals because no one had a chance against Cle & GS. If I'm a basketball fan living in a city without a "super team" just where is the incentive to spend my time and money on a team that is eliminated on the 1st day of the NBA season? That's why I expect to see the league make moves to get back to a more open and sustainable way of building a team. Time will tell. Meanwhile as far as DM is concerned, it's year 11 and counting.

 

regardless its going to be there for the next couple of years and thats when you have harden and cp3 still being able to compete at a high level so we're just going to have to deal with it bc nobody is going anywhere in that GS core who are all in their immediate prime of their careers.

what happens years from now down the road isn't really of a concern when you have your best playing ready to win now.

 

I'm already so tired of the "ain't gonna beat Golden State" narrative in the media....like it's some news flash that GSW is really, really good.

So should the rest of the NBA stand pat and not bother trying to improve because it "ain't gonna beat Golden State"? Do sports writers not care about competition? Do they not crave the story of David toppling Goliath?

I'm also already tired of the complaints that Paul isn't worth what we gave up. Are you freaking kidding me? We gave up one good player in this deal. ONE! All of the players we gave up have flaws in their game. The team that walks away from the trade with the better talent is normally considered the winner of the trade. I think that certainly applies here.

 

Way too long didn't read

 

Who is Tim Wood and why should I care about his opinion?

Rocket River

 

Yes, we should have stood pat and brought back the team from 2016/2017....that would have worked out great.... or better yet we should have signed Durant/Lebron and Kawhi... oh those guys aren't available?

We have a star in his prime... we can't tank... the only option is to swing for the fences.

What a dumbass article.

 

The main concern to me is both players' personality. Harden is fantastic on Offense, but he give up on defense very often. On the other hand, Paul is a great leader on the court. He will go under your skin and try to push you harder. I am not sure if Harden will take it. If he accept it, that could be the greatest thing to this team. But if he doesn't take it, this could be Dwightmare 2nd.