Black. White. Asian. Whatever. Can the man play? Can we trade a stiff for him? That's all that matters.
Why not? GP is in his last year of contract and they didn't extend the contract last summer. There are news that there is a fall out between them. It is possible that we can get a good price for GP. Based on how GP is playing, he still has 4 or 5 years left. To another poster: Moochie for Boykins is great but if you are GSW coach, you are not going to do this. Actually I proposed the same trade when Boykins has only three games under his belt. Too bad my thread was locked.
"Moochie for Boykins is great but if you are GSW coach, you are not going to do this. Actually I proposed the same trade when Boykins has only three games under his belt. Too bad my thread was locked." Too bad it was locked, the deal would have been made.
I think that whoever said we need a little diversity in the starting L is correct. Mobley and Francis can destroy teams, but they do it in the same way which means both need the rock to score 4 out of 5 times (since they do spot up on occasion). Instead of trading away a big piece to our puzzle (ie Mobes), it seems to me that we should look for a starter and move Cat back to the bench where his offensive spark would be crucial. I really cant think of any trades at the moment, but if we could land a do-it-all 2 to start a lot of our problems would lessen. I really would like to see Maggette on the team. Maggette is a prototypical 2 body-wise, he hustles, plays D, is great in the open court, and doesn't look for his shot everytime down the floor. Back in the day Maggette was considered the best prospect at Duke since Hill, so there are expectations that this guy hasn't met (yet?). Anyway, y'all share that and tell me what you think.
About this MAX contract thing, you better believe Les will open that checkbook IF it means getting Brand without losing Francis or Ming. Why? Because when you have Francis, Brand and Ming, then the rest of the team can be made up of minimum contracts, MCE players, and rookies. For us, let's assume that Francis, Ming, and Brand (at some point) will make a combined 36M. Right now, the cap (I think) is around 42M. That leaves 6M under the cap. We'll have Francis and Ming's bird rights. Mobley will make 6M. So assume the cap goes up, we'll have around 8M for the rest of the players. So 2 players split the MCE, one player at the minimum, and a first round pick and a 2nd round pick. There's the whole roster. Besides, I think Les would be glad to pay SOME (very small amount) luxury tax if it meant this calibre team. Are you kidding me? A Ming/Brand combination on the inside with Francis penetrating? Ming and Brand would average 5 blocks between them easily. Best interior defense in the league, man-to-man AND help. I can see a dynasty right there, Francis and Brand are around 25 and Ming is 22.
Codell ---- So what if Jason Terry is a SG! I would take a backcourt of him and Francis over Cat and Francis any day. Terry is 2 years younger than Cat; averages more than double the assists of Cat and plays with intelligence. I can see your point about Patopenko but I would trade Cato for Drobnajk straight up right now. He's a better all around player than the one dimensional Cato and remember we are talking about a BACKUP PLAYER! Not to mention the huge difference in salary. He is also in the last year of his contract which would come in handy next year if we want to resign Possey. At least we agree on something! Well big shot it's easy to stand on the sidelines and criticize, how about stepping up and showing us what kind of a trade you can come up with. NEXT!
Why do we need to trade anyone to help us resign Posey? We have his bird rights and can sign him to whatever we think he is worth.
First: Cat is not better than Terry. Its not even close. If you would like to debate this we can pull out the stats. Second: your blind love for Cat is diturbing! Third: So what if other teams overpay their players. If you can replace Cat with a player that fits the team better at the same salary or just a little more why not do it? Barry makes barely more and Terry makes way less, even though he is in the last year of his contract.
Please explain to me how a Terry/Francis backcourt is better than a Cat/Francis backcourt. I am sure you can't so I will explain how it isn't. 1) Terry is a 6'2'' shooting guard. You trade for him and put him at the PG spot, and you have all the same problems that you have with Steve at PG. 2) With Terry being 6'2'', and an average defender at best, and Steve being 6'3'', again, an average defender at best, you have a very shot backcourt duo who will have problems guarding people on D. At least Cat has decent size and can play good D when he puts in the effort. 3) Terry is not a good shooter. Cat is a better shooter than he is. Better all around player? How? Drob is a better shooter than Cato, but Cato is a better defender, rebounder and shot blocker (which is what this team will ALWAYS need). I would not trade Cato straight up for Drobnajk. Drobnajk is a soft outside shooting center. He does not rebound welll or block shots. Then who is our backup PG? Is Maddox ready to play 10-15 mins a game? I don't feel we can afford to part with Norris without having an adequate backup in place. Until Maddox proves hes a better option than Norris, then I would keep Moochie. I am not going to come up with a trade because I would like to give this group of players time to gell and develop some consistency before we trade anyone else away. Also, as I stated in another thread, trades are not easy to make in the NBA. I trust our GM and Coach to make the right decisions for our team and am not going to try and undermine them by suggesting amateurish trades on a BBS that probably have no chance of even being conceived much less excuted. Keep up the trade suggestions though. I will be here to tell you why they won't happen or shouldn't happen.
Let's pull out the stats: Career - PPG Terry 16.0 Mobley 17.4 Edge - Mobley APG Terry 5.3 Mobley 2.6 Edge - Terry RPG Terry 3.0 Mobley 3.9 Edge - Mobley FG% Terry 41% Mobley 43% Edge - Mobley FT% Terry 84% Mobley 84% Edge - even 3P% Terry 36% Mobley 36% Edge - even Steals PG Terry 1.4 Mobley 1.2 Edge - even Blocks PG Terry .2 Mobley .4 Edge - even TOs PG Terry 2.5 Mobley 2.2 Edge - even So lets see, Mobley wins 3-1 with 5 other categories being basically even. Conclusion: At best they are about the same quality player. In reality, Mobley is slightly better. Not even close eh??????????
codell, I just spent the last several minutes researching the stats and was just abuot to post the exact post you just did. We accomplish nothing by trading for Terry. BTW, I think my dog knows that a Rockets game is on tonight, she is keeping her distance from me!
Contraire Mofrair, Ok so put him at the SG. Problem solved. You said it yourself “At least Cat can play good D when he puts in the effort.” When exactly is that? On nationally televised games and that’s about it. When he does put forth a good effort his offensive game suffers. If your best argument is our backcourt defense wont be good then I guess you haven’t watched many Rockets games lately. Cats defense wasn’t to good against Terry the last time we played Atlanta. Terry went off for 33 on 13 of 24 while Cat went 5 of 11 for 11pts. Oh yeh Mobley had 1 assist, terry had 6. To answer your next post here’s what they are doing this year according to NBA.COM. Terry Ranks #8 in the NBA in Assists Per Game(7.2) Ranks #6 in the NBA in Free-Throw Percentage(0.88) Ranks #14 in the NBA in Steals Per Game(1.71) Ranks #17 in the NBA in Minutes Played(1606.0) Ranks #5 in the NBA in Three-Point Field Goals Made(85.0) Ranks #2 in the NBA in Three-Point Field Goal Attempts(253.0) Ranks #5 in the NBA in Assists(302.0) Ranks #10 in the NBA in Steals(72.0) Ranks #15 in the NBA in Three-Point Field Goals Per 48 Minutes(2.54) Ranks #12 in the NBA in Assists Per 48 Minutes(9.0) Ranks #11 in the NBA in Total Turnovers(134.0) Ranks #12 in the NBA in Turnovers Per Game(3.19) Cat Ranks #10 in the NBA in Free-Throw Percentage(0.873) Ranks #3 in the NBA in Minutes Per Game(42.0) I wouldn’t call Cat a good shooter. More like a streaky shooter. I would rather have a player(Terry or Barry) that knows how to get his shots in the flow of the game. I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one. I’m not sure which trade you are talking about??? Kenny Anderson maybe? If you’re scared say you’re scared!!!!! Did you not read the opening thread? I don’t think we need a trade either but that doesn’t mean I’m going to be narrow minded and not play with the idea of one. I enjoy discussing trades, that doesn’t mean I’m trying to undermine the coaches or GM. You need to lighten up man!
Terry for Mobley, in any form? Why waste time on something neither team would consider. Cat is sticking. Terry is being packaged wherever the Hawks can dump the most garbage and get some asset back. The Hawks are stupid, but not dumb. And the Rox? Even if Terry were an upgrade (dubious), he is an unsigned upgrade.
Well, Cat did put up 29 points while hitting 50% of his shots against the Lakers and he played pretty good D against Kobe that night.
Why would you look at career stats to decide if one player is better now than another? I think you need to look at this years stats per 48 min. PPG per 48 min Edge - Terry +1 APG per 48 min Edge - Terry +2 RPG per 48 min Edge – don’t feel like doing the math. So close I’d have to say even Steals PG per 48 min Edge – Terry +3 Blocks PG per 48 min Edge – don’t feel like doing the math. So close I’d have to say even TOs PG per 48 min Edge – Mobley +1 And % stats. FG% Edge – Mobley +2 3P% Edge – Terry +4 FT% Edge – Terry +5 Throw in the fact that Terry is 2 years younger and has 1 year less experience. Terry wins 5-2 with 2 even. Conclusion: Terry is already better than Cat and has more potential.
With the espn articles on potential moves of players I thought I would string together a few scenarios that might be fun. Mind you they might not benefit one team or the other but it shakes things up. The game is not just a game of numbers and stats, good chemistry is far greater. With that said: Knicks's Sprewell for Sonic's Anderson and 2nd round pick Kincks get pg, Sprewell and Glove can be a great veteran backcourt Heat's Grant and Bulter for Maverick's Finley Dallas gets youth to continue great franchise. They get a solid rebounder. They can take up the slack of scoring with all thier weapons. Butler will potentially be just as good. Heat's get a great veteran 2 guard that can compliment Jones. Wolve's Szczerbiak for Cav's Miles and Hill Wolves get veteran post player and Cav's have a pure shooter. Offense will be more smooth with Wally shooting and letting Davis slash. Again nothing magor but chemistry. Miles and Garnett would be awesome to watch! Heat's Jones for Bull's Rose Interesting trade. Rose can show Butler the ropes. Celtics's Walker for Bucks's Allen and Mason Bucks work off Walker, Celtic's have great shooter and frontcourt help. Rockets Taylor and Nachbar for Hawks Abdur-Rahim Hawks need a 4 not so demanding of ball and back up for Big Dog. Chemistry wise lets Terry and Glen take more shots and Taylor will fit in well. Rahim might be our answer for four. Buck's Cassell for Magic's Miller Magic's need a man to run the show. Buck's would have Miller and Walker and good shooter and now a low post threat. They need the scoring from the post not the point guard. Cassel and T-mac will be nice tandem. Sixer's Iverson for Grizzlie's Gasol, Battier Sixer's with good team now have Battier and Gasol that will pick Iverson's points but add rebounds and defense. Iverson and J Will would be awesome to watch. Net's Mutombo and Jefferson for Warrior's Jamison and Richardson Net's get a good four and an awesome 2 to compliment Kidd. Now Fortson and dominate the boards with Mutombo and Jefferson and Arenas will be good scoring dou. Rocket's Cato, Taylor, Morris for Grizzlie's Gasol, Brevin Knight Cato is an upgrade for anything they have right now. Cato/Swift/Battier/J-will/ Taylor is looking nice. Taylor will be the four with Morris backing up Swift. Gasol is just great, need I say more. To help us get the rebounds with lack of Cato we need to: Cav's Diop and Hill for Rocket's Rice and Moochie Rice will not demand the ball like Miles. Will compliment Wally with nice shooting. Will backup Davis. They need a pg in a bad way and Moochie is a good pg. With Davis, Wagner, Norris, Wally, Illgauskas look like a good team that can actually play together. Rice will be nice three point threat. Rocks get Diop as potential good back up and Hill for the present backup to Ming. Ming,Posey,Gasol,Francis,Mobley isn't shabby with Griffen/Hill/Maddox/Diop/Knight/Hawkins/Collier is a nice bench. Some trades were tied together, some not. Give me some feed back and not just flat out criticism. Some of these would make some teams fun to watch and others greater.
Mo Taylor for Marcus Camby. When contract expires at end of year, use money to go after Elton Brand. PG: Steve Francis SG: Cat Mobley SF: James Posey PF: Elton Brand C: Yao Ming Not a bad lineup!!
OKAY. I'm sorry. BUT I HAVE DECIDED WE ARE IN DIRE NEED OF A POINT GUARD. We don't need a star. We just need a role player. I want to keep Francis, Mobley, Posey, and Yao. We should get somebody like Kenny Anderson, Eric Snow, or Chucky Atkins. Or we need to send Francis to the NBDL for a while. Or we need an offensive coach to support Rudy.
