Dallas May Make History, Not that there's anything wrong with that

I don't understand what's so hard about it. You create laws to protect gays from discrimination. Then you enforce the law. I'm not trying to be rude or obtuse, maybe you could give me an example of how it's difficult. I understand you're saying gayness is identified through behavior rather than physical markers of skin color or gender... but how does that really make protection harder?

Let's take, just for example, lawsuits brought against companies claiming that they fired someone because of race, gender, or sexual preference. Examples are commonplace in all three. A big burden lies on the accuser to prove that his/her employer used discriminatory practice in firing them. And that's pretty tough to do, unless they found emails from the boss saying "I won't have ni**ers and fags working in this firm."

Now, in any case where a person claims he was discriminated against because of his sexual preference, does the court ever say "prove it! How do we know you're gay? It's just a behavior." It is given that the person is gay. Protection in this case doesn't seem any harder than in cases invovling race or gender discrimination.

Yes, you could conceal it. In fact, nothing could be more common, which is terrible. I imagine you have gay friends and/or acquaintences(sp). Ask them what it was like when they tried to pretend to be straight. Many of them believed what many in this country say- that homosexuality is sick, that it's immoral, that it's a perversion, a disease. Imagine truly believing with all your heart that your truest inner desires for love are sick and wrong. Imagine trying and fighting to change that, this perverted sickness inside you, and you can't.
Or let's say you're smart enough not to have bought that bull**it, or matured and saw the light. You still have to conceal your sexuality for fear of what will happen to you. You can't predict how people will react. If you work in a salon in New York, probably no big deal. If you're a construction contractor in Arkansas...

People stress how gays can hide their orientation and blacks can't hide blackness. This insinuates that their lives are easier, that it's easier to escape discrimination. That may be true. But I would proffer that you greatly, greatly underestimate the suffering that is being in the closet. To live in shame and fear. To hide what you are when there is no reason to be afraid or ashamed. Or worse, to actually believe that you are sick and wrong inside; trying with every fiber of your being to change and you can't, wondering if you're doomed with no chance for salvation.

Again, the prevalence and level of discrimination may be worse against blacks- but injustice is still injustice.

And this doesn't even touch on what it's like for them coming out to their families and friends, sometimes being disowned and alienated from their families for life.

And people think that they choose this.

I respect you and the tone of your posts a lot. I hope my tone is acceptable.

 

or whats the highest rated African American sitcom versus Will & Grace?

 

i don't think i can discuss this without being misunderstood. and i'm not suggesting that's anyone else's fault. i just have a hard time communicating it.

so treat everyone the way you wish to be treated. the end.

 

I think being not allowed to marry is kind of a biggie.

But in a sense you are right. It is not nearly as bad as it once was HERE IN AMERICA (lets not dare talk about prejudices in general). And I think a lot of that is due to the black civil rights opening up people's eyes to that (all over the world). That's why many people say it is ultimately it is the same issue. There is no "separate but equal".

 

Nolen, I've never met a gay person who seemed afraid of their sexuality, and I've worked with many struggling actors and musicians. Maybe its cuz I live in NYC

As for the salvation thing, yes it's a sin, but so is lying, and I know we all do that. A gay guy has just as much of a chance at salvation as any other hetereosexual, if they have been taught anything different, they should find another Church.

 

I always thought the civil rights movement was really more specific for America because of its diversity. shrug

 

Only a small percentage of the gayboys I work with are in the closet still, and plenty are super flamboyant. But that's because they're opera singers in New York. To think that I have met so many men who are living still lies even when they live in a culture that is very accepting of gays- that only goes to show how hard it is to overcome the programming of shame.

To me the real question is not how well-adjusted these guys are now that they are artists in NYC. You have to wonder what they went through to become who they are, accepting themselves, unashamed. Ask them. You'll get interesting answers. Some will have had it easier- maybe they grew up in a more liberal, accepting place, and had open-minded families. But plenty will not have had it easy. At all. It shouldn't be this way.

Whoooooaaaahhh there son. What, exactly, is a sin?

If you are born gay, and you can't change it, and it's a sin... then what exaclty should they do?

 

not that you know of.

 

What gay comedies were on tv in the '70s when The Jefferson were #3?

(Personally I would rather watch Sister Sister with those Scottie Pippen twins before Will & Grace)

 

1. Yes it's because you are in New York.

2. You wouldn't know because a homosexual who is afraid of their sexuality is probably in the closet.

 

I normally don't ask people about their the specifics of their sexuality cuz frankly it's not real important to me. I did once try asking this guy I was pretty cool with at work (he was from Utah or Kansas I think), and he annoyingly asked me why everyone always asked him that question.

Sin is anything that separates us from God. We're all born sinners, gay or straight. If you're born gay, do what every other sinner does to get saved, goto Jesus

 

wouldn't it be fair to say that the Jeffersons got a healthy boost from All in the Family?

 

Homosexual?

 

Are we really going to debate The Jeffersons and Happy Days in the same thread?

 

Dude, there are many lawsuits brought by teachers who were fired by their schools because they are gay. And those are only brought by those willing to go through a huge fight, have their name totally dragged through the mud, and have everyone in the state know that they are a homo.

For crying out loud, why does this have to be a victimhood olympics? Yaaay! Blacks win!

This is a civil rights issue. Although I don't know if you contend this point as much as pgab does.

 

that's sad. i think any form of discrimination at a workplace other than your job performance is stupid. there's no debate for me on that issue.

 

What makes you say that?

Oh, so they have to fear being disowned/alienated by their loved ones. And here I was thinking life was hard for them.

Then why do you spend your entire post detailing just that?

As has already been pointed out to you earlier (you may not have read it yet) there is no federal protection for gays in this country. Read that over a few times. If there was any federal protection for them you can bet the religious right would call for bloody revolution to have it struck down. Only individual states, cities, and corporations. have done so. Outside of them, the only legal recourse a gay person when discriminated against is a groundbreaking civil suit which challenges constitutionality of the practice.
This is a civil rights issue.
This is a civil rights issue.
This is a civil rights issue.



You know what one of the biggest problems is with racism in this country? A lot of white people think racism isn't that big a problem anymore. They'll point to the backlash against the "nappy headed ho" incident as proof. Or that to be a racist you have to put on a white hood and kill black people.

The first step is to admit there's a problem.

 

Born Gay?
A Whole other Kettle of Fish

Rocket River