Which she already knew about, irresponsible to go on live TV and say things like that with limited data and new strains popping up because then you get people looking at it as proof down the road that these people (CDC, leading scientist) are liars, frauds etc There were people in march testing positive for Covid despite being fully vaccinated
She was referring to CDC data that showed a few breakthrough infection. You can’t have that type of mismatch and inaccuracies in public communication from the CDC. Good thing the CDC walked back on that comment the very next day on 4/1, saying she spoke broadly. Broadly, it’s still the case. Vaccinated people are protected. Unvaccinated are not. With Delta at an estimate R of 6, and if that hold, literally everyone will be exposed. It’s your choice to be extremely likely safe or risk your life. Except for kids 11 and under. Hopefully people that refuse vaccination can think of protecting kids but it’s probably already too late.
And... I believe they were saying herd immunity would require 70% of the population being vaccinated. Here in Texas, we are at about 50%. I think all trump states are well below 70%. So guess what...
I've been seeing numbers that say that 90%+ of new infections are on non-vaccinated. That would make sense as both the Pfizer and Moderna are over 90% effective and most vaccinated people in the US have those vaccines. The vaccines have never been claimed to be 100% effective thus there is still a very small number of vaccinated who still get infected.
I just look at vaccines as similar to updating the software you use on your computer. Most software updates are to patch up security vulnerabilities that could be exploited leading to harm to your computer. Also typically an infected computer acts as an additional host to help spread the method of intrusion that attacked it to other vulnerable computers. No rational person would deliberately leave their computer exposed citing constitutional rights as justification, yet that seems to be the primary argument to express resistance to the overwhelming benefits of vaccination compared to remaining unvaccinated. I suppose if you didn't trust the software developers to check their updates themselves to see if it patches what it intends to while causing no other issues with your computer, you could exercise caution. That's typically what Non-Production servers are for as a means to test software updates in an environment that doesn't affect live servers that customers use. But then again that's basically what vaccine clinical trials were and then you have the large sample data of people who have already been vaccinated and have overwhelmingly ended up fine with a greater resistance to new variants and hospitalizing symptoms. At this point to deliberately spread misinformation to support anti-vaxx movements, you're really just enabling con artists like your Andrew Wakefields of the world, similar to how deliberately leaving your computer exposed to things like malware only benefits criminal actors. So when it comes down to it, the question is whose bottom line do you support? Do you support your own health and well being as well as the well being of your community? Or do you support unethical people who profit from other people's pain and death? You'd think it would be an easy answer and choice to make yet here we are.
70% is probably too low with Delta. Probably 85-95%. I think it's going to have to run through its course until nearly everyone is infected or immunized.
I posted a personal anecdote in the hangout topic, but Texas prob gonna see some Delta+ variant that affects kids more. Not sure how quickly the rest gonna follow as it's unscientific, but more kids getting symptomatic covid is gonna suck. They think it don't exist. Lies by the meedeeuhhh to control your trailer or retirement home.
"I’m unvaccinated. It’s not what you think": https://www.washingtonpost.com/heal...37475a-df3e-11eb-9f54-7eee10b5fcd2_story.html excerpt: By Michelle Fiordaliso July 17, 2021| Updated July 17, 2021 at 8:34 a.m. EDT *** I’m not anti-vaccine. An unexplained stroke when I was 27 left me feeling cautious about the coronavirus vaccines. My doctor thought the vaccine might be contraindicated. As a 40-something, self-employed writer, I didn’t become eligible until late March. Like others, I was hoping to put covid-19 behind me. But two weeks later, when clotting risks presented themselves with the Johnson & Johnson shot, I felt relieved I’d waited. There are good medical reasons people might not get vaccinated, including allergies, having recently had covid-19, certain autoimmune disorders, an adverse reaction to the first shot and clotting issues like mine. Most days, I feel clear about my reasoning. Coronavirus vaccines are approved for emergency use, and we are learning more all the time about them — recently, the Food and Drug Administration added a warning about the rare but real risk of heart inflammation from myocarditis and pericarditis associated with the mRNA vaccines. Still, when my unvaccinated status becomes known, it evokes responses ranging from rude to empathic. Online, where people tend to be brazen, blanket statements are made about “the unvaccinated” as if we’re one entity. But we are not. Statistics show that less educated people are more likely to be unvaccinated. I graduated with a master’s degree, summa c*m laude. “It’s Republicans who are skipping the jab,” I hear and read, yet I voted for President Biden. Discussing my medical history with friends, colleagues and strangers was never required, but now I’m confronted daily with the question of whether I’m vaccinated, and then why I’m not. Even when swiping on the dating app Tinder, the intended aphrodisiac of advertising that one is vaxed, double-vaxed, or vax’d, means I’ll have to face an awkward conversation and possible rejection. My profile doesn’t bear the graphic sticker of a Band-Aid with the words “vaccinated.” How will it go when I share the news with a match? Do I need to tell someone I haven’t met that a blood clot years ago briefly robbed me of speech and control of my right side? Or that I recovered? In person, I’m met more readily with understanding. Other than one friend who spent time trying to convince me to vaccinate despite my history, most have been accepting. I wear a mask in public spaces and tell people before seeing them so they can decide whether they feel safe around me and under what conditions. My commitment is to protect myself and others. You see, those who have been vaccinated and those of us who haven’t been for medical reasons are not so different: We want the very same thing — to be healthy, to see children and grandchildren grow up, to return to normal lives. Yet many of us have had to isolate because of not only the risk of the virus but also the collective message of shame fueled by the assumptions of who the unvaccinated are. QAnon. Conspiracy theorist. Defector. These assumptions can create contempt for anyone who isn’t vaccinated, whatever the reason. I even overheard someone suggest that if a person doesn’t get vaccinated, they deserve to die of covid-19. But what about people who can’t get vaccinated? What could’ve been an opportunity for a global conversation about how to keep us all healthy has instead become reason to criticize and condemn. In the early 1990s, I was a social worker on the front line of the AIDS crisis at St. Vincent’s Hospital in New York. While doctors and researchers toiled, lives were lost because mistakes were made and discoveries weren’t found quickly enough. It feels as if we’re in the same boat now. As infectious-disease expert Anthony S. Fauci recently said on the podcast Sway, “You can be wrong if you’re dealing with information that is evolving.” The data about covid-19 and the vaccines seems to change nearly every day; for those of us with potentially confounding conditions, we carefully monitor that changing and updating data. I admit being unvaccinated was easier when I was living in a remote place where I saw few people. But in a metropolis, I’m faced with these uncomfortable conversations much more. While people are willing to meet me outdoors in summer, understandably they may feel differently about meeting indoors next winter. I love dancing but my favorite classes are closed to anyone without proof of vaccination — attending with a mask is no longer an option. Do I have to rule out the activities that for me make life so joyful? I put all of these things on a scale — the risk of getting covid-19 in a crowded city, wanting to join humanity in a collective attempt to defeat this horrible pandemic by getting vaccinated, the desire to participate fully with my community, and my questions about the risks of the vaccine with my specific medical history. Like a balance itself, I haven’t found a resting point yet that feels right. In the moments when I tire of talking about this subject or feel unbearable social pressure, I consider defying the medical advice I received and walking two avenues to the nearest pharmacy where coronavirus shots are readily available. I know many doctors who would say that it’s fine, that the benefit outweighs any possible risks, and that you can also get clots if you get sick with covid-19. Some people say it’s my civic duty to take that risk for the greater good. I consider all this but having friends who’ve experienced side effects from the vaccines, a few of them severe, gives me pause again. I need more time. When I had my stroke, I had to reconcile myself to the fact that the human body is amazing but imperfect and sometimes things just happen. And science, along with the fearless humans who work in it, is equally amazing and imperfect. What’s correct today will likely morph tomorrow. Everything is evolving. For some people like me, waiting to see how things evolve doesn’t make us stupid or selfish or conspiracy theorists, just prudent and pragmatic. Many people would like to get the vaccine but cannot. Until that changes, I hope we can have open and compassionate conversations about how to protect one another. more at the link
The example cited above is all the more reason people without health complications should get vaccinated. Am I to assume the tens of millions of Americans who have still avoided vaccination are all in the same boat as the author above? If so, that speaks volumes to how poor overall American health is that a vaccination is more life altering than a virus which has killed over 600,000 and growing. More people getting vaccinated only increases the goal of achieving herd immunity which only protects people like the author above from complications with both vaccination and contracting the virus. When my immune compromised friends were still alive, I got the flu vaccine every single year, not to because I feared the virus, but because I feared what it could do to them if they contracted the virus through me. I'd have been incredibly guilt ridden in such a scenario so for my own peace of mind and the health of people I care about, I just got the jab. It cost me money even unlike the Covid vaccine. I could have made up some bullshit reasons like citing egg allergies or religious reasons but I didn't. It's only a shot afterall. Also comparing the AIDS epidemic to Covid is a poor comparison though to justify remaining unvaccinated. One epidemic was politicized and took years before it was taken seriously as it was thought to only affect the "degenerates" of society until it no longer only affected them. There isn't even a single AIDS vaccine at present day. There are multiple Covid vaccines free of charge. I'm sure if there were multiple AIDS vaccines though, the overwhelming majority of people both with and without AIDS would probably get them right? In terms of healthcare costs, which do you think would be more cost effective? Expensive cocktail of medications to keep your immune system healthy that you're forced to take only after contracting the virus. Or a theoretical free jab that prevents contracting AIDS entirely and limits spread only to those already affected? Gee, I wonder which one makes most sense for personal health and community health. Bravo for finding those outliers that no reasonable person takes issue with. It doesn't therefore make the people who remain unvaccinated out of sheer stubbornness any less willful to the overwhelming benefits of vaccinations.
Just to add to the above post in response to Washington Post Op-Ed from the person claiming they don't want to get vaccinated because they had a stroke and the evolving risk of vaccines. Yes there is a risk to vaccines that risk though has to be weighed against of risk of getting COVID-19. The problem I see with most of the arguments of those who don't get vaccinated is they only look at the risk from one side while ignoring are downplaying the risk of the other side. That is why you keep on saying things like that op-ed saying about how there is a chance of blood clots or other very rare complications that we've seen from the vaccine. There have 28 cases of blood clots from about 8.7 million people vaccinated with the J&J vaccine. That is a 0.0006% chance of developing complications of blood clots from taking the J&J vaccine. On the other hand the chances of becoming symptomatic from COVID-19 is about 17% with the chance of death about 1%. These difference in level of risk is in the 1,000 times greater from getting COVID-19 than it from taking any of the vaccines. For people like the writer of that Op-ed with pre-existing conditions they should be far far more concerned about the danger off COVID-19 than the very rare chance of a complication of the vaccine. This is just another example of the problem with how information is disseminated and digested in this culture. Things that are marginal get magnified out of salaciousness, culture or ideology. People don't understand risks which is why we're seeing something that can actually be contained and dealt with isn't.
Great point. The fact that the vaccine is freely available (for the U.S. and a Europe only) diminishes its incredible achievement in modern healthcare. If each jab cost 150 bucks OOP, no one would be braying about choice and freedom. The same entitled folk would consider the exclusion a status symbol and openly wonder why "the culture of the unvaccinated" is so disappointingly haphazard, irresponsible, and/or lazy. "If it were me, I wouldn't put a price on health and do all I could, "do my duty" and responsibly pay the $150! Don't need a handout, just skip the coffeeshop!" It's sick yet mindnumbingly consistent how these issues (healthcare in particular) are politically underpinned not by "choice" or "freedom" but rather "exclusion" or "inclusion."
