Give it a rest, DrewDog. Guys that took 1200 posts to stop posting "HEY lOOk aaT mE I MAM DARUNK" topics aren't in much position to comment on newbies.
Gotta get some of this... Drewdog don't you have an Andre Miller update to give us so we can base his entire career on whatever game? Anyways, to the points. "He's the best shooter on the team." - Well he's not the best shooter and he's not even scraping 44% which I believe is about the league average. Not much to brag on really. "He was the MVP of the team last season." I don't know if being the MVP of the 5th worst team in the league means much of anything concerning trades. Shareef was certainly the MVP of Grizzle land for quite a while and he got dealt. "Superstar backcourt." - I can't even handle this comment. Mobley is a superstar in the minds of Rocket homers only. "Mobley's value and all-star play." - Interestingly enough JayZ made a point in another thread about KT getting his points but being a hindrance to the team concept in the process. This is no different from Mobley at all. Mobley sets up nobody and helps nobody to score. He gets his points and that's it. And the "he's a shooting guard" argument that is so warm to Drewdog's heart is terribly weak. Sixth men shoot without passing or creating for others, not "all-star" guards. Also it's disturbing to me how concerned people are with Mobley getting his points and Francis getting his way over the Rockets becoming champions. If Mobley and Francis are running this franchise then we're doomed to continue trading first round picks for second round players and signing fat guys with achilles problems because they play nintendo well with the team... I mean... have good chemistry.
Unfortunately in order to be a contenders in today's NBA you will have to be at or near the cap. You will have to sacrafice cap space to get the players that will put the Rockets over the top as far as being legit contenders. Take the Mavs for instance, they added players with big contracts, and even overpaid some of their own players in order to get them where they want to go. It got them to the 2nd round, and they are also very young and will only get better. Even though they are over the cap they are talking about going after Olowakandi. They may have to overpay to get him but he could be the peice that puts them over the top and helps them get the title they want. Maggette may have a suspect shot but that can be worked on, and improved during the summer. Both Maggette and Odom may command high priced contracts but I doubt any team will be willing to give either of them the max. They may think they can get the max but they will be sadly mistaken. Even if the Rockets have to overpay for them they would help give the Rockets a very stout lineup, and a very young improving lineup. The center position will have to be addressed though. PG - Francis SG - Maggette SF - Odom PF - Griffin C - Cato The Rockets could do some serious damage in the West with that lineup. As for how to get other players to "take one for the team" if Cat is traded. You guys should know very well that winning will take care of that, and players will give up quite a bit to play on a contending team. Again I point to the Mavs. Nick VanExel could have created a big time mess in Dallas by refusing to be a backup to Nash. The Mavs had just signed Hardaway to a lower contract than he would have gotten somewhere else with the promise of going deep in the playoffs. Well Hardaway was traded mid season. This alone would have been enough to cause Nick to not trust the Mavs. The fact that the Mavs are winning pushed all of Nick's worries out the window, and he's very happy to be Nash's backup because now he has the chance again to compete for a title. You guys would be able to sign other free agents (simply because you're winning) that you may not have been able to sign in the past.
YOUR LINE UP: PG - Francis SG - Maggette SF - Odom PF - Griffin C - Cato MY LINE UP: PG - Francis SG - Mobely SF - Griffin PF - Cato C - Ming I'll put mine against yours. . . . I think I could win a best of 7 honestly . .i feel it could maybe win in 5 As for the Nick at Nite reference. .. his contract is signed He was traded for. . . if he had come in the off season and sign below his market value . .. your comparison would hold. Nick gets paid either way . . .. Trust me . .. the Hardaway thing. . . may come back to bite them. They can only OVER PAY so long . . .or continue to hit luxury tax Look at their team. . . . They have YOUNG TALENT that came together. Rockets *are* working the same model . . they just make some mistakes [See Taylor and Cato] the idea WAS the same. Rocket River
I feel the same way about my lineup. Not to mention my lineup is much more athletic. True he get's paid either way but he was still getting paid in Denver and still caused a ton of trouble. He could have caused some real headaches in Dallas but swallowed his pride because the team was winning. I agree that it could still come back to bite them but I seriously doubt it will as long as they are contenders. Of coarse there will still be players that will not want to come to the Mavs because of the Tim Bug situation but my bet is that there will be many more players that look past that for a shot a getting a ring. I agree that the Rockets are working on the same model which only stresses my point about trading with the Clipps. Both Odom and Maggette are under 25, and they are more prepared to help the Rockets win now as oppose to 2 or 3 years down the road. Plus as I stated earlier they are also more athletic than Yao. Don't forget in my scenario you guys also get the #8 pick to go along with the other first rounder you guys already have. Don't worry about the mistakes, every team makes them even the really good ones (see resigning of Bradley, and knee jerk reaction siging of Evan Eschmeyer).
I guess I didnt get the memo that cc.net was enforcing a PUI (Posting Under the Influence) law. Nothing wrong with giving fellow posters a laugh at my expense. You should losen up and try it sometime.
Houston drafts Ming and perhaps a SG at #15... 1 Francis 2 Mobley 3 Griffin 4 Taylor 5 Ming Bench: 1 Norris 2 Kareem Rush (draft) 2/3 Rice 3 Morris 4 KThomas 4/5 Cato 5 Collier IR: Brown Torres Not bad. Houston should stick with what they have. Moving Mobley would be a bad bball decision. Also would disrupt chemistry.
TexasD's lineup would win. Easily. The fact that Mobley is considered an MVP is why this team is in the lottery. Some of his shots are idiotic. He NEVER sets up other people - yes, much like KT. These guys are major reason's why our offense is soooooo bad.
Don't put words in our mouths, NOBODY called Mobley and MVP, but he is a key part of this team, a guy who gets along with the franchise player, drops 20 ppg, and is a fearless go-to guy. And it isn't Mobley's job to set up KT, it's Francis job. And as much as we like KT, he isn't a go-to guy and sometimes can be a scary offensive option. But if you think people like Mobley is the reason the Rockets are in the lottery you're fooling yourself. The reason the Rockets are in the lottery is because of injuries and lack of support up front. And TexasG's line-up is not going to happen because the Clipper DO NOT need Cuttino Mobley. We need Mobley though. No way do the Clippers give us Maggette for Mobley. Why would they do that!? But for the people who think Mobley has "excellent trade value", name a team that would trade for him and significantly improve the team? The Clippers are on record saying they will do whatever they can to re-sign Maggette when his contract is up. Why would they take Mobley when they're happy with Maggette!?
Obviously he/the team were not bad 2 years ago when they had 45 wins. Mobley was easily our most consistent offensive weapon in 01-02 period.
One word .. economics. Have you forgot who owns the Clipps? Stearling has been saying that he has changed, and like you said has made resigning Maggette a priority. The only problem I see with that is the fact that Stearling is going to have to give max contracts to Brand, Q-Rich, and maybe even Miles. Plus has to worry about resigning Kandi, and getting a proven PG to run the team. Maggette will cost them too much to resign. As I stated earlier, the Rockets may have to slightly over pay for Maggette but with his size, athletisism, and defensive potential he'd be worth it. Also realize that it's a package deal not Mobley for Maggette straight up, otherwise it would be smart to keep Mobley for economic reasons. You would lose nothing in scoring, and gain in rebounding, and defensive capabilities by obtaining Maggette.
Has it run through anyone else's mind how much the Nets would die for Cuttino Mobley? I have been watching them and thinking how sick they would be if Kidd could send the rock Mobley's way for those open jumpers and having Mobley fill driving the lanes instead of freaken Kerry Kitten and Lucious Harris trying to do those things. How about knocking down open looks Duncan creates for the Spurs and giving them a 2nd option when Duncan rests or just to mix it up? You saw what DA did for them last he and he isn't the shooter or instictive scorer Mobley is. Some of ya'll have no idea of how much difference CM would make to quite a few very good teams. TexasG, IMO you still way underestimate the value of this #1 pick. Nobody on the Clips is worth consideration as the principal for a trade involving that pick except Brand. Everyone else has too many questions (Kandi--age and undeveloped offense, Odom hasn't got much better than his first year and has a suspension) to be worth of the #1 of this year's outstanding draft or hasn't done crap in the league yet (Miles, Magette). It would take Brand plus more (#8, Odom, Kandi, Magette OR Miles) for like the #1 and KT plus filler if they really want Ming or JW--probably the two best (and media attention grabbing--Sterling does care about this) draft prospects since Tim Duncan. Unless the trade includes a Brand quality player OR we only have to move down a couple of slots in the draft (still draft #2-#5) while getting a solid but less outstanding player/prospect (Jamison, Battier, Swift, Kandi, Odom, Miles, etc.) we can hold out for a better deal that what you propose, or we just take Ming.
Since Cat doesn't get much in return maybe we should use Francis as trade bait. See if Memphis gives you Gasol and #4 for Steve and KT. Then take Jay Wil at #1 and take Dunleavy or Woods at #4. Jay Wil, Mobley, Woods/Dunleavy, Gasol, and Cato doesn't sound bad at all.
After reading everyone’s posts, I've came to a conclusion that the veterans to this website are right! Trading Cuttino Mobley is a bad idea! I hope I didn’t make anyone mad. .....Ps I really meant to say that I’m NOT trying to bash! This is THE BEST WEBSITE EVER!
TexasG YOUR LINE UP: PG - Francis SG - Maggette SF - Odom PF - Griffin C - Cato MY LINE UP: PG - Francis SG - Mobely SF - Griffin PF - Cato C - Ming Let's look at it on a step by step Basis. PC all Equal SG - Cuttino's Step back Jump eats Maggete alive. His height may bother Cat. . but it's not like the lack of height has hurt him. This is Basically Bowen vs Kobe [I'll give you closer than that] but Defense vs Offense. Cuttino has superior Offense.. . I'll give you Maggete's defense even though his PT is skimpy ADV: Me SF - ODOM vs Griffen - Hard one. Griffin's outside game vs Odoms all around game. Griff better 3 ptrs . . Odom's ball handling skill DRAW PF Griffen vs Cato: See inverse of Cat Maggete ADV: YOU C- Cato vs Ming: Defensively a draw mainly because cato has no O. Ming has O. ADV Me The Front court on my team is a shot blocking/altering/rebounding monster. Defensively weaker in the backcourt BUT Maggete has to get his points coming to the paint. and unless I'm mistake he is not an assist machine. Where three nigh 7 ftrs are waiting. Odom likewise is not a superior outside shooter. So him diving to the basket is likewise gonna run into some trouble. . he is an Assit man so he would be more successful. However dish outside to Magette or Cato is not a sure thing. limiting his options. You may make more steals than My team On Offense I have 4 out of 5 players with 3 pt range Two are able to drive and dish. I feel Francis is superior Dish man to Odom . . but i *am* biased ;-) Not to mention 2nd chance points. Rocket River
not as good as Francis, Cuttino,Griffin, Cato and Ming Amazes me how people underestimate a player's personal feelings Should the be proffessionals. . .yes are they . . . alot of times. . NO Cuttino took less money to play with his homies and before giving them a REAL chance to work toward something folx ready to undercut them and seperate them This is not Kindergarten I two guys are building ya Deck together. . . . You don't break them up after the lay the 1st nail rocket River
