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Cut Carlos Gomez.

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by underrated015, Aug 8, 2016.

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Who is most responsible for Gomez debacle?

Poll closed Oct 29, 2016.
  1. 5

    18.5%
  2. Luhnow

    3.7%
  3. Hinch

    7.4%
  4. Hitting Coach

    44.4%
  5. Moneyball aggregate offense approach

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. Hell if I know but what a disaster

    44.4%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Houstunna

    Houstunna Mr Graphix
    Supporting Member

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    Another poster mentioned a nice angle I never thought of....

    "we could've given those (trash) prospects for someone else"

    Not arguing, just asking for clarification....

    You think Gomez' couple weeks of inactivity allowed his full health?

    If that's the case, shame on our medical staff.
     
  2. Nick

    Nick Member

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    Of course... in pure hindsight land. The team was targeting CF help last year. Hell, they're still in need of CF help. At the time, the trade was very well received given that it presumably filled a need and they didn't part with any of their truly elite prospects.

    The point is, everybody should rightly be pissed that Gomez didn't work out... but the Astros didn't give up all that much.
     
  3. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    Are there really people who in 2016 would consider a team with a +33 run differential to be "so far beneath" a team with a +11? Are people just incapable to looking at anything outside of record?
     
  4. ThaShark316_28

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    I guess, man. But, I hold this theory that if they took them for a joke, they'd never beat them like they do. I think that since they know they CAN be good, they stay on our asses to make sure things don't change. On the field, in the front office, you name it.

    "If we don't stay on them, they'll kill us" is a mentality you have to keep when you're the top dog.
     
  5. Nick

    Nick Member

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    When the H-2-H is as lopsided as it is... it allows for normal metrics (like run differential) to no longer make sense.

    Can anybody tell me what the run differential was in the H-2-H games? That's really all that matters right now.
     
  6. PokeJ

    PokeJ Member

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    Record is all that counts. Rangers just know how to win. Astros still figuring it out

    I hope that run differential helps you sleep at night
     
  7. SWTsig

    SWTsig Member

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    haha this has to be the most preposterous assertion I've ever seen. How about you let us know when they ditch W/L in favor of run differential as the chief metric in determining post season admittance. Who gives a **** about run differential when we're 10-28 against them over the last two years???

    Put down your Astros bong.
     
  8. SWTsig

    SWTsig Member

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    +50 rangers since last year, +22 rangers this year.
     
  9. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    Run differential is a measure of your true talent, record is about luck and variance when you have a small sample size like 1 season.....is that not common sense?
     
  10. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    An entire season. "small sample size" Common sense. Yep.
     
  11. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    Dear God....
     
  12. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

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    Alright, ill explain more fully what I meant.

    Firstly, I meant it sort of tongue and cheek. Not completely seriously. But I do wonder seriously if he gave up at some point. Sabotaged himself in the sense that not only did he give up on himself, but felt the team had given up on him. I dont see the entire season in this light, moreover the final weeks or couple months. He is obviously an emotional player and his emotional state probably plays a noticeable part in his play.

    As far as his value for new contract, I feel he can mitigate much of the damage if he continues to play well for Texas and especially so if they have a deep playoff run and he an important part of it.
     
  13. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Member

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    They're a good team that's been very lucky. Why is that such a difficult pill to swallow?
     
  14. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Member

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    Beltran was 27 when he hit free agency and posted a 6.8 WAR his free agent year. Gomez's WAR, as good as he's been with the Rangers, is .1 this year. He's not making Beltran money. Or, if he does, it'll be one of the worst contracts in the history of Major League Baseball. Here's hoping it's given out by the Rangers.
     
    BigM likes this.
  15. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Member

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    Certainly possible - although, again, the sample size, in terms of him being back to normal, is still relatively small. It also might've been cumulative, in that he was progressively getting healthier and the time off was the final nail, so to speak. Also possible: any lingering injury issues here were as much mental as physical and he got his head right during the time off. Who knows?

    I'm 100% speculating on the injury - but there's a ton of corroborating evidence, namely he failed the Mets' physical. *Something* was wrong and, given his performance here, it's hard to argue otherwise.
     
    #2095 Hey Now!, Sep 30, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2016
  16. Nick

    Nick Member

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    There's enough out there regarding the Mets failed physical that it was largely more of a financial issue than it was a physical issue... namely initially including Lagares (and his pending extension), and then in the next iteration of the trade, the brewers refusing to send their comp pick.

    Gomez did have an MRI done weeks before showing an abductor issue. Pretty sure the Astros had access to these records as well. Both the Astros and Brewers staff found little evidence of an actual debilitating or regression-prone injury (and we all have to credit that the Astros medical staff does make pretty big decisions based on MRI findings). In fact, Gomez did seem to steadily improve with the Astros last year as the season went on... prior to his over-swinging injury.

    TL;DR... Gomez was unlikely injured his entire time here. At times he looked like he had never played baseball before. Probably one of the worst mental slumps affecting physical play that I've ever witnessed. Getting fired and realizing that you're on the verge of losing millions may have been just enough for him to snap out of it... small sample size still pending.
     
    BigM likes this.
  17. kaleidosky

    kaleidosky Your Tweety Bird dance just cost us a run

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    Gogo, Knoblauch, Ankiel..
     
  18. SWTsig

    SWTsig Member

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    can't wait til Run Differential Banner night at MMP next year!!!
     
    PokeJ, BigM and MadMax like this.
  19. BigM

    BigM Member

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    I see where Astrorule is coming from. The Rangers have been the better team and obviously destroy us head to head but I think his point is that the separation of the two franchises isn't all that vast. Against the rest of the league the past two seasons it's probably fairly even. They have a legit shot to make the World Series and we're going home, but we have a strong nucleus to build on going forward. Also isn't the percentage of World Series winners who missed the playoffs the previous year fairly high? That's something.
     
  20. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    The Astros are 10-28 against Texas the last two seasons. That's not luck.
     

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