I'd like to note, I didn't make this thread to compare CP3 to Dwight, I just posted because in all the other CP3 threads at least 1/2 of the people posting were stating: It's better to have Lin, Asik, Harden, Parsons and Dwight rather than Paul, Harden, Dwight, Parsons, and WHOEVER. People's reasons were mostly that CP3 is overrated: Not clutch, can't win in the playoffs, mean so he'll ruin chemistry. So that is what I was trying to dispute. I'm also stating for multiple reasons getting 3 superstars is better, and CP3 alone is EASILY worth Lin and Asik.
Fantastic post OP. Hard to argue with those numbers. But how do you explain his lack of success in the playoffs?
You're right in that Howard and Asik doesn't fit the Rockets 12-13 system. Just as Howard and Gasol together didn't fit D'Antoni's system last year. You have to adjust your system to fit your players. If McHale runs last year's system with Howard & Asik, Howard's going to be just as p!ssed with the Rockets as he is with the Lakers.What you'll probably see with a Howard & Asik system is less points scored and given up, but a 50-55 win season. I do share your concern about sending the 2 of them to the foul line though. However, Asik proved up to the task when OKC tried that in the playoffs. He can probably mentor Howard in that department.
Success in playoffs is determined by teams as much as anything. I think Tmac was very good too, but never had a solid supporting cast. CP3's best teammate was either David West or Blake Griffin, neither of which I consider a star, let alone superstar. They are solid players, an occassional all-star level year, but that's really about it.
If Chris Paul is so great, why couldn't he carry the Clippers (or his previous team) to better result in post season? Clippers have better talent in every position except SG.
You are INSANE. Memphis has the best team D in the league. 1) Gasol and Randolph are WAY BETTER than any 2 man front court Clippers could come up with. 2) SF is a little better for Clippers, but Tayshaun's help D is really solid, and helps the whole team D. 3) Tony Allen played GREAT the whole series. For a D 1st player, his offense was really good too. Pretty much, Griffin needed to completely outplay Randolph in order to compensate for the rest of the Clipper's frontcourt, and he ended up getting owned by Randolph. So Clippers stood very little chance if CP3 had to play out of his mind every game for them to have a chance. Clippers are what Lebron's cavs teams were. Supporting cast is a bit better, but not a whole lot. They look good because CP3 is there, ESPN gushes how there is actually a team there, then the superstar leaves and the team loses 25+ games in the standings and everyone realizes how completely worthless those players really are.
Cp3 is great..... But for this team, it would benefit us more to get a superstar PF ( than a superstar PG) harden can do what he does people want the "right now" big names, instead of what's best for the team. But like I said..... Cp3 is a great bball player, but this team doesn't need him. We have bigger holes to fill to be a complete team.
Paul is absolutely the better player than Howard BUT Howard can anchor a team's defense - something that Paul cannot do despite being a superb <s>flopper</s> defender himself. Offensively Howard is so far behind Paul it is not even funny BUT Take a look at the offense that the Rockets/Morey want to run -- Free throws, Layups and 3s. Howard will get fouled quite a bit putting himself (and his terrible FT%) on the line a lot - but this also means guys like Lin, Parsons, Beverley and even Harden (!) will be getting to a line a lot more since teams being in the penality early. Next despite his unrefined back to the basket game - Howard is one of the few big men who prefer to play back to the basket which will cause a lot of teams to sag down defensively and help - this will open up the 3 point shooters for better looks. If there is no help defensive - Howard is strong enough and certainly athletic enough to score at a very high rate down on the block still. So Howard fits perfectly with the team's philosophy of scoring. Now Paul - is a genius with the basketball - he can break down defenses off the dribble better than anyone in the league (and I love how he always keeps his dribble alive) - but that sort of offense does not fully play in with what the Rockets want to do. You can better 3 point looks, layups and FT through Paul but it wont be as easy. Also Paul dominates the ball so much - and he is one of the few players you don't mind doing that since he is so smart with it - but it is not how this team plays when it plays well. There is a reason why Paul's teams haven't advanced past the second round -- Paul as great as he is once you clamp down on him - its much harder to get the others involved since he dominates the ball so much. Howard since he doesnt handle the ball as much - his game is much more suited for a 'share the ball around' type offense. Paul has a huge advantage down the stretch - he is probably one of the best players in late game situations in making the right play. Howard is a liability on offense in a close game late (unless he brings his FT% up to a respectable 65%) BUT we have Harden already who isn't too bad himself in late games (he had some terrible gaffs in the playoffs though) but Harden is learning as he becomes more accustomed to his larger role. So this isnt underrating Paul at all -- if I had a blank team to start from scratch I would pick Paul 10/10 times but there is a team here already and a style of play all of which are much more suited for Howard's game which makes its an easy choice to go after Howard 1000%. This of course if you had to choose just one player to go after - given the situation it seems near impossible to land both (its hard enough to land one), but if you can land both you absolutely must. There is no such thing as having too many superstars on your team. Even if Miami loses the Finals this year- making the Finals 3 years in a row is a huge accomplishment that not many teams can say they did - and they did also win one of those years. I would be more than happy with something like that for the Rockets.
The problem is that I don't think a max PG and max SG gets you a championship. Anyone else think a one-two punch is a recipe for a championship?
Any superstar who is not interested in being flashy will generally be underrated. Paul is one of those guys. He's a top 5 player, and the deeper you look into his stats, the more that becomes apparent.
Adding CP3 takes some away from Harden, whereas adding Howard would actually add to Harden's effectiveness. And for that reason, adding Howard adds more than adding CP3.
J Lin is better than CP3 in the long run, fact. Will a least the most explosive basketball player according to Rocket GM. Plus CP3 is short, and flops too much with his defense. http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=50144426n <embed src="http://cnettv.cnet.com/av/video/cbsnews/atlantis2/cbsnews_player_embed.swf" scale="noscale" salign="lt" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" background="#333333" width="425" height="279" allowFullScreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" FlashVars="si=254&&contentValue=50144426&shareUrl=http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=50144426n" />
I don't disagree with any of these points. But the fact remains that Grizz team wasn't an all-timer by any standard. They don't get out of the 2nd round without the Westbrook injury and they eventually got swept by the Spurs. Chris Paul is an elite player. But I don't like how everyone just hands the mantle of "best PG/3rd best player" to him. I don't disagree with anything you have posted, but at the end of the day the Chris Paul Clippers got bounced by a fringe contender in the 1st round. If he really was the best PG/no. 3 player in the league, don't you think he at least makes it out of the 1st round?
Two things. 1. I'm sure many of the people who are downplaying CP3 are probably a bit biased towards a certain PG on this roster. 2. Morey's opinion is all that matters when it comes to talent judgement. And he seems to think CP3 is arguably the best PG eva. 3. In the end though, it does seam like CP3 has very little desire, if any, to come to Houston without Howard. So Howard has to be the first to get on board.
