Coveting Players on Other Teams Erodes Team Identity.

You want to solidify a core that can't get to the second round? All teams have an identity, but only those that win have one that's respected.

 

legit thread. that's why this rocket team will take awhile before the core is ready. give it another 2 years if a new star joins. but at the moment wit hthe current people it will take the same amount of time probably, the team needs 1 borderlin star - and some really nice role players who can play D and score 1 dimensioanlly. hitting 3's is all you need. but here's the question, would you guys be happy with a team like thunder, knocked out in 2nd or conf finals but never getting a ring? it's very possible KD may never win one with the current team he is on.

 

the CORE, not the role players. right now we are lacking good role players + 1 really great player. the core to me right now is DH and Harden. Adding another star to this CORE, changes the makeup of the team. Keeping just the two players together, but changing role players or upgrading them, maintains the core, but everything else around gets better. Spurs, Thunder, Grizz, all have been together for awhile. Clips took a few years to get good, and Heat also took 2 years...

This team still is huge question mark.

 

I don't think Dwight will be a star level productive players after the next two seasons. Just a bad feeling.

 

It's also fun to play this game with other teams besides the one the OP mentioned.

TWolves core = KLove, Rubio, Pek
Kings = DeMarcus Cousins, Jason Thomson, Isiah Thomas
Bulls = Rose, Noah, Boozer, Gibson
Nuggets = Lawson, Farried, Gallinari

No, these aren't cores that have been together a decade. But they've been together long enough to create a core identity... which is mediocre.

If the Rockets strategy is "who cares about a "core" identity and team identity until we have the RIGHT core... then sign me up.

 

Yao and Tracy's injuries left the team in shambles. It could happen to any team who's main players suffered early termination. Les attempted to tread water too long signing Ariza, Dalembert, etc. Fortunately we landed Harden then Dwight. Hope isn't lost. We'll likely attract another star and ball... hopefully.

 

the only legit team there are the bulls...and rose has been dead for awhile so that team does not quite count as a fail team yet.

kings are crap. nugs are crap. nugs have somehwat of an identiy but their team is not talented enough. t wolves do not have an identity really, unless it's to be a fail team then that's their identity.

 

That has to be the most simplistic thing I've heard.

We traded Francis because a chance came up to get a guy WAY BETTER, I don't believe anyone but JVG was sick of him.

We traded Tmac because he quit on the team, screwed us outta a VC trade, and was breaking down

We traded Kmart because a BETTER option came in Harden and Kmart was pouting up a storm.

If the Heat offer LBJ for Harden and pieces, I bet Harden will be gone too. We've only traded to upgrade on each of those trades (Tmac -> Kmart was an upgrade at the time because Tmac was all but done).

Nothing to do with getting tired of any of these players.

 

Apparently you missed the point. First, I wasn't totally serious. Obviously fans don't decide what players get traded. Second, you can't deny the fact that all those players were very popular when they became Rockets but their popularity grew cold after a couple of years and fans started suggesting trading them away. Obviously it wasn't every fan more fans are open to trading Harden now than there were after the first year with him.

 

That doesn't make sense. Your core, you're identity, can't just be two guys. The core the OP talks about is almost a rotation long. You say this team needs another great player, but yet don't want to add another star because it'll change the core? They both would have major roles, so either can change or add to the identity.

 

Being able to have the "utopia team" would be nice. What a nice story it was for the Rockets to draft home town great Olajuwon. Wouldn't it be great if they could keep all of their draft picks and they just grow together and win a title? Yes that would be delightful. But these days, unlikely. Be happy that we have Howard and Harden versus the mediocrity treadmill.

 

I miss Chuck.

 

......................... we are still a team in the making.....chill out.

 

Right, that's why the Spurs shopped Tony Parker hard for a top 10 pick in 2011, and why they were set to dump him if they were able to sign Jason Kidd in 2003. Leonard was acquired by trading away a vaunted part of their young core in George Hill. Danny Green was waived by the Spurs and sent to their D-League team before being called up very late in the season. Patty Mills was playing in Australia and China before being signed mid-season.

Heck, replace the names of those last three with Parsons, Daniels and Beverley and the stories all but line up exactly.

Many other dynastic teams had a great deal of roster turnover. The Bulls swapped out Charles Oakley for Bill Cartwright before they were able to get their first 3-peat, and gambled on Rodman to replace Horace Grant, and Ron Harper and Steve Kerr to replace BJ Armstrong and John Paxson. The Shaq and Kobe Lakers traded away Eddie Jones and Nick Van Exel, two young fixtures before they had their 3-peat.

And bringing it all back around, when the Spurs were winning championships, they had constant roster churn, letting Derek Anderson, Antonio Daniels, Stephen Jackson, and Hedo Turkoglu leave; they made ill fated free agent signings in Rasho Nesterovic, Malik Rose and Richard Jefferson.

You can't compare this team to any of those teams. If you want to talk about the 2011 Mavericks, 2003 Pistons, or 1979 Supersonics, I'd be willing to listen about how chemistry was key to them winning. But for all the other championships, you'd better have overwhelming talent in the form of a top 20 all timer and a hot coach.

 

Funny you say that but I wouldn't waste a tear if we traded any players outside of Harden/Howard to get that last missing player we need to complete a whole team. What's the point of trying to keep a core that doesn't yield any success in the playoffs? That's what we're all trying to win right? The championship??

 

Under Morey this will never happen, your organisation needs an identity and ours right now is that of a train station. People stop once, enjoy the view and get sent on their way (back).

Even with Howard and Harden, a championship is far away because it takes at least a year to three to build a solid team. You need an owner and GM who lets the coach do what he does, not tell him to run and gun or whatever, you need a coach who is strong, has been in the game for long and knows what he's doing.

Then you need players who are ready to do everything for one another and have good chemistry. You need veterans, hard workers and good locker room guys. Morey is working on that but you need a coach with a solid system first. You can't just sign or trade for guys without knowing exactly what their role is and how they will fit.

Look at the Spurs, they have players that thrive in Pop's system but they are easily replacable and the players who leave are not that succesful elsewhere. This is of course rare, but you want to strive towards that.

Let's hope Leslie & Morey understand this and work it out. First step should have been firing McHale because even if he did well in people's eyes, he's not going to stay long. They gave him the job to work with youngsters and develop them, not to work with veterans and a championship team.

 

Our identity is Milk Hair.

With him at the helm, championships will sure come flooding in.

 

I think you tinker less and less as each deadline passes.

For example, now that we stuck with Jones at PF I think we have to watch him develop. He went from no playing time in his first season, to defending Lamarcus Aldridge in the playoffs. He didn't do well, but that experience is priceless. I believe Jones can be this team's starting PF now that he's experienced what it feels like to be the starting PF on a western playoff team. I think Dwight's presence helps him. I believe this coaching staff is suited to developing big men. He's shown that he can turn potential into productivity.

On the other hand, I can't say the same about Jeremy Lin. That's not someone you let hang around just to forge an identity. This team does not suit him and he does not suit this team. This is the most extreme case of fitting a square peg into a round hole. Everything he does great, we don't need him to do. Everything he is not great at, we need him to do. So he spends all his time working on those weaknesses but it clearly doesn't come to him naturally. He doesn't get to exercise his strengths, so his confidence takes a hit, and then his productivity declines. Not a good situation, plus his contract is less than desirable on the market with each passing day.

Parsons is about to enter the most financially critical season of his life. In reality he should focus more on defense and rebounding. His passing has been stellar, as has his scoring. But we need him to be a more all-round player and, critically, if he starts next to Harden then he needs to be ready to defend the best swingman every night. I don't know that Parsons is going to be thinking that way given where he is in his career. Can you forge a TEAM identity when a key guy is not thinking about the team? I hope we can, but I think Morey needs to assure Parsons that defense will net him just as much money as offense. Unfortunately I'm not sure if other teams value both things the same.

Asik is a strange piece of the puzzle. He's nice to have, but a luxury if we can get a less expensive defensive big man. We could use someone who is a more traditional bruiser, someone who's willing to play dirty and get a flagrant foul once in a while.

What I'm saying here is: there are too many moving pieces to try to forge an identity but I think whatever we do before the next deadline will remain largely intact for a few years.

 

Even Miami and San Antonio made changes this offseason and added new players to their rosters.

Our core is still in the process of being built. Morey himself said that he didn't think we had a third best player for a championship team. At the time that he said it, it seemed like an insult to some of the players that we do have, but after being eliminated in the first 6 games of the playoffs that assessment seems to be more than fair.

And as long as our team is still under construction, Morey will look for that last final piece for the puzzle. While he is looking, we as fans will dream about what that third piece should be. Whether Love or Rondo or Carmelo or some other player that we haven't even thought of. For the third piece, even if it isn't a max superstar kind of guy, but we still need to find whatever that piece will be.

Once we have that last piece, hopefully Morey will stop focusing on stars and instead on building depth. Then, at that point, we would be able to focus on building an identity and building around our core and those kinds of things.

 

U wont win a ring playing no defense