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Counting the cost: Bin Laden blamed

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by ScreamingRocketJet, Oct 14, 2002.

  1. ScreamingRocketJet

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    Counting the cost: Bin Laden blamed
    By Don Greenlees, staff writers and wires
    October 15, 2002
    AUSTRALIA'S losses in the Bali nightclub bombing look set to exceed 100 lives, marking the October 12 terrorist attack as the nation's single blackest day since World War II.

    As of this morning, the official Australian death toll from the Bali bomb blasts had reached 20.
    "We're currently working on a list of 20 Australian names," Australia's Deputy Ambassador to Indonesia Neil Mules told Channel Nine's Today Show.
    "I should emphasise that a number of those have been identified only by documents or credit cards that are with the body, but that's our working list at the moment."
    Another 160 Australians were believed to have been in the area at the time of the bombings and were still missing, Mr Mules said.
    "We're now working on a list ... of around 160 Australians who we have reason to believe may have been in the area, so we are bringing the list down now to the people of more real concern to us."
    Australia and America today joined Indonesia in linking the al-Qaeda terror network to the blasts.
    Foreign Minister Alexander Downer said: "We have had some information, particularly from the Indonesians that there are links to al-Qaeda in this terrorist attack, but we look forward to talking with the Indonesians about this whole question of who is responsible."
    "We want the Indonesians to bring to justice the people who are responsible for this outrage."
    In the United States, President George W. Bush said there was "a pattern of attack" by al-Qaeda terrorists in Kuwait, Indonesia and Yemen, raising concerns that Osama bin Laden's troops are on the move again and could strike the United States.
    Earlier the Indonesian Government gave its firmest acknowledgement yet of the likely culpability of al-Qaeda.
    "We are sure al-Qaeda is here," Defence Minister Matori Abdul Djalil said after a cabinet meeting in Jakarta.
    "The Bali bomb blast is related to al-Qaeda with the co-operation of local terrorists."
    This was the first time a top government official had directly implicated al-Qaeda in Saturday's bombings. Police investigators have been saying they had few clues and no suspects.
    Yesterday families and friends greeted Australians who had fled Bali just hours after the bombing, many seriously injured. But dozens more searched the morgues of Kuta looking for friends and relatives, as dozens of bodies were burnt beyond recognition.
    Body parts and charred remains were still being recovered yesterday from the bomb site at Kuta, where Balinese and foreign tourists laid wreaths of flowers and burning incense in memory of the victims.
    In Canberra, a sombre Prime Minister announced a national day of mourning for Sunday, and a sweeping review of national security measures, amid calls for policing activity to be upgraded across Australia.
    Among the injured and missing are members of the Australian Defence Force contingent in East Timor and three Australian Federal Police officers, players from sports clubs and dozens of young backpackers.
    Indonesian authorities said the total death toll was 181, and included victims from Indonesia, Britain, Germany, the United States and Ecuador.
    The Islamic extremist group Jemaah Islamiah, which has known links to al-Qaeda, has firmed as the prime suspect in the bombings. Foreign Minister Alexander Downer identified JI as the likely perpetrator, although no group has yet claimed responsibility.
    Indonesian authorities said a jeep packed with C4 explosives caused the blast.
    With many foreigners deciding to evacuate Indonesia on the advice of their embassies, security forces stepped up security around embassies and other diplomatic facilities.
    The US has ordered evacuation of all dependants and non-essential staff, and urged its other citizens to depart.
    Australia has advised against all non-essential travel to Indonesia, and has told tourists in Bali to remain indoors and bring their departure plans forward. The Australian Schools in Jakarta and Bali were closed yesterday.
    A team of 15 agents from the Australian Federal Police and domestic spy agency the Australian Security Intelligence Organisation are already in Bali co-operating with Indonesian police.
    Another 25 specialists in victim identification are flying in. They also have been joined by agents from the US Federal Bureau of Investigation.
    Investigation sources said they were considering the possible role of a number of known terrorist groups, including Jemaah Islamiah, which allegedly drew up plans to bomb the US and Australian missions in Singapore. Singapore's Intelligence Security Department has made two mass arrests of Jemaah Islamiah members.
    A number of governments, including the US, have named an Indonesian cleric, Abu Bakar Bashir, as the spiritual leader of the organisation.
    But Mr Bashir denied this yesterday. "All the allegations against me are groundless. I challenge them to prove anything. I suspect that the bombing was engineered by the US and its allies to justify allegations that Indonesia is a base for terrorists," he told the Associated Press from Solo, in central Java.
    A meeting of the Australian government National Security Committee had earlier agreed to send Mr Downer, Justice Minister Chris Ellison, AFP chief Mick Keelty and ASIO boss Denis Richardson to Jakarta as envoys for the government.
    After speaking to US President George W. Bush and British Prime Minister Tony Blair by telephone, John Howard said all three governments wanted to help the Indonesians with the investigation.
     
  2. ScreamingRocketJet

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    This bloke used to play Rugby League for Australia. A tough guys sport, like your NFL.

    I have met him and he is one of the toughest blokes you could ever meet...but soft inside. On the field, he used to play with a wrecked leg that caused him immense pain every game...but never backed away.

    120 kilogram tough guy...and here he is in tears and having to identify his wife's burnt remains.

    You couldn't get a person further away from the conflicts going on, and yet he is a victim now also. It's all so surreal.

    League star devastated by death
    By Rebecca Glenn
    October 15, 2002
    FORMER Australian rugby league Test player Craig Salvatori is struggling to cope with the death of his wife Kathy in the Bali bomb blasts, his mother has said.

    Mr Salvatori discovered his wife's body in a Bali morgue just a few hours after putting his two young daughters on a plane back to Australia yesterday afternoon.
    Kathy Salvatori would have turned 38 yesterday, a birthday she shared with her mother-in-law, Dianne Salvatori.
    Mrs Salvatori said her son had called the family last night with the bad news.
    "He identified her early yesterday evening ... we've just all been together, and last night all together at my daughter's when we got the news of Kathy," she said.
    She said Craig was finding it difficult to come to terms with his wife's death.
    "He finds it very hard to talk to me because he's my boy and he just breaks up and cries all the time.
    "It's not sinking in properly. Kathy was always so much the life of the party.
    "It was her birthday yesterday and mine as well but ... God love her, she was 38 yesterday ... there was no birthday, there was no happy."
    Mrs Salvatori said the past few days had been very hard on the whole family.
    "She was so vivacious, we can't come to terms with ... Kathy's dead.
    "We come from a very close family ... Kathy's family and our family, and we all have each other's support.
    "But the days waiting to see if Kathy would be all right got worse because we didn't hear."
    Mrs Salvatori said the couple's six and nine-year-old daughters were yet to be told of their mother's death.
    She said Craig was hoping to bring Kathy's body back to Sydney by the end of the week.
    "He's got to get a death certificate for Kathy and then he's bringing her home.
    "We're hoping he can bring Kathy back by Friday, it'll depend on the government over there."
    She said she now understood how the families who lost people in last year's terror attacks in the United States felt.
    "You hear of September 11 and how our hearts went out and how we cried, but until it comes (and) hits your own family, you don't really, I think, truly understand how those people did feel."
     
  3. Elvis Costello

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    This is getting ugly. This tragedy and the recent Al-Queda linked attacks off the coast of Yemen, in Kuwait and Afghanistan today makes Bush's task of getting UN support for invading Iraq all the more difficult. I imagine a lot of nations will ask why the US should open a new front in a war when they haven't neutralised the original target. How is the US going to occupy Iraq and Afghanistan and continue to go after Al-Queda in Yemen, Indonesia and Pakistan without a lot of international help? Will we be able to keep Israel out of the war with Iraq? I don't think Bush is preparing the American people for the sacrifices this war and occupation is going to require of them.
    From watching the Australian media here in New Zealand, it seems that people there are pessimistic about engaging in a wider war against terrorism in Iraq. It seems like Australians want to concentrate on their own security. Is that accurate, Screaming Rocket Jet? My condolences to the Australians on the BBS.
     
  4. Cohen

    Cohen Contributing Member

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    SRJ,

    That's very very sad. Thanks for the posts.

    Our condolences and prayers to the families.
     
  5. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    I actually think it will make Bush's task of getting a coalition easier.

    I think that sensible people want all this sensless bloodshed to stop, and if countries are going to support it, they must be taken down.

    DD
     
  6. ScreamingRocketJet

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    I don't know where it's all going. There is talk that police will target Mosque's etc here and people are on 'watch lists'. That infringes their civil rights...is that what we want as a society? Do we have a choice?

    The Indonesian Muslim leaders said we were racist and culturally biased when our Government said they had terrorist cells operating that were targeting westerners in January this year.

    Now...it's proven true.

    What do you do?

    Punching a guy in the face because he gives you a dirty look and you think he'll hit you = you are charged with assault under all civilised law.

    Waiting for him to hit you first = stupidity and a lot of pain.

    So...what do you do in reality? I don't know if there's an answer.
     
  7. rockHEAD

    rockHEAD Contributing Member

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    a coalition to attack Iraq?

    How does Saddam = Bin Laden?

    Bush doesn't even seem worried about OBL anymore... his goal is to attack Iraq.
     
  8. F.D. Khan

    F.D. Khan Contributing Member

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    I just hope that Australia won't change its support of the US in its war with Al-Queda. And that this won't push other countries away from being our allies by fear of terrorist attacks. If that happens the terrorists truly win.
     

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