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Could we trade Alston?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by crash5179, Jul 15, 2006.

  1. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

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    It should be obvious to everybody that Rafer has to improve his shooting to be a 32 mpg point guard. I happen to believe he will increase his shooting percentages this year. Probably mostly because I expect him to be penetrating against fewer defenders because guys like Battier and Novak are going to be spacing the floor. If he does, he will get his 32 mpg and 10 assists to go with it. If he doesn't, obviously he will be getting fewer minutes.
     
  2. Clutch

    Clutch Administrator
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    Sorry crash - forgot to reply to this.

    The problem is while Rafer and Duhon are shooting similar numbers, Duhon is 23 years old, has played just two seasons (showing shooting improvement) and is on a reasonable rookie contract. Sweetney as well. Both players are young, have upside and can be unloaded with little financial ramifications if they don't like what they see.

    Rafer on the other hand is 30 next week and is locked in for 4 more years. He is a good playmaker and might improve as a shooter, but he now has a track record. He's as good, but you're not really thinking "plenty more to come" when you think Rafer.

    I wish I shared your optimism there. We'll see - I hope you're right. I don't think Battier is enough to mask a starting point guard playing 35 minutes. James wasn't going to back up Rafer Alston, and I don't think the Rockets start a smallish backcourt of Rafer/James. Mainly I think they wanted James so that eventually he would be the starter, putting Rafer where he should be -- 22 to 26 minutes as a third guard.

    Keep in mind - if the 2004-05 Bob Sura was on this team 100% healthy, would he be backing up Rafer Alston? When the Rockets made the deal, they did not think Sura's career was over but rather that it was going to be much longer (All-Star game break) before he would return. They didn't want to be without point guard help and poorly evaluated Mike James' ability to fill in.
     
  3. JeopardE

    JeopardE Member

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    Well...while the age concerns are definitely valid, it's also worthy of note that Rafer has historically been a pretty good 3 point shooter (discounting his first two years). He did average 39% in one season with the Raptors and has a 35.6% career 3pt percentage.

    So I think there's every reason to believe that his shot can/will improve next season. Obviously he very rarely takes midrange jumpers and doesn't do a lot in the paint (which probably explains his low FG%), but if he can shoot 36% from the 3, run the ballclub well and put up 7-8 assists per night, I don't see why he shouldn't get major minutes as a primary point guard. And I think there's a very good chance that this is what we will get from him next season. I would think that during an offseason like this, Rafer as a starting point has to be low on the list of concerns.
     
  4. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

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    Good stuff Clutch. Those 3pt % numbers during that stretch were awesome. No question that was their best moment in quite some time. Clearly we have to get back to that level again to take this team deep in the playoffs.

    Hilarious
     
  5. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Also worthy of note, back on page 2:

     
  6. weslinder

    weslinder Member

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    I haven't been on the board long, so I will comment about Rockets fans in general. A year ago, Rockets fans were clamoring for a real PG. One who could bring up the ball (sorry, but Mike James and Bob Sura couldn't). One who could make the entry pass (Sura could, James couldn't). One who could push tempo (Sura couldn't, James could). Now they have all that, but now the Rockets fans want a PG who can shoot. I'm glad fans don't run the team.
     
  7. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Which fans? Certan people were bashing James (which was silly at the time and looks even more so now) but that's it. I don't know where you get the fact that Sura and James can't bring the ball up or push the tempo. They're both fine in the former and as good or better than Alston in the latter.

    Quite honestly, I can't think of anything more panicky and ill fitting than the move to get Alston in the first place. "We need a playmaking PG". What? We have 2 playmakers already.
     
  8. JeopardE

    JeopardE Member

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    Sam, did you just imply that Sura is as good as Rafer at pushing the game tempo?
     
  9. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    In 2005 he certainly was. And he was much better at running a fast break.
     
  10. weslinder

    weslinder Member

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    When James or Sura were handling the point, they could not bring up the ball against the press. That job fell to McGrady. It's a weakness that you have to live with to get their scoring and toughness. Sura didn't push tempo nearly as well as Alston. James did, but he was looking to score. That's not an issue if you're on the court with the second unit. It is when you're on the court with the best center in the game.
     
  11. JeopardE

    JeopardE Member

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    Yeah, I agree it isn't a good trend. One could also argue that the teams he has started on have been progressively worse (03-Miami 04-Toronto 05-Houston), but ultimately we'll have to wait and see. Certainly he has no excuse if his production does not rise this season with a healthy ballclub to play with. Personally I'm more worried about Kirk Snyder's production than Rafer's...in other words, I'm not that concerned.
     
  12. weslinder

    weslinder Member

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    Dude, that's just not true. Sura was passing off to Wesley, Barry, James, and McGrady on the fast break. Alston was passing to Wesley, Bogans, Head, and Frahm. The inability to break last year had zero to do with the point guard.
     
  13. Clutch

    Clutch Administrator
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    Lame, revisionist history response. Typical when people don't like what they're reading, they lump all fans in to one universal opinion that was "wrong". Yes, Rockets fans all wanted Sura, Barry, Wesley, James and Padgett to be exchanged for Rafer Alston. That is what they wanted.

    Yeah, that Sura sucked on the fast break before Wesley, Barry and James.

    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/2953438.html
     
  14. leeegend

    leeegend Rookie

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    I just dont understand this boards man crush with Bobby freaking Sura...hes best served as a bench player, theres nothing tremendous about him. And saying that hes a better point guard is the most ridiculous thing Ive ever heard in my life....

    Bobby Sura isnt or wasnt a better up tempo point guard than Rafer Alston. nor is he more athletic than Sura

    At least Rafer has an outstanding quality about him...

    He's a pure point guard

    He's probably the best guard in the NBA when it comes to handling the ball...(might I add light years ahead of Sura)

    Hes a good passer

    He's quick...

    His major flaw is probably his defense...but other than that...what the hell else do you expect of a PG? He averaged 12 points...and 7 assists..and 2 steals.with an injury depleted Rockets team...while Sura averaged 10 points and 5 assists with a healthy Yao and McGrady...wow you guys do the math

    I just cant even fathom how some of you say Bobby Sura is a better up tempo PG than Rafer..lmao

    I mean Sura couldnt even push the rock up the court when Defenses pressured...they had to let McGrady do it...

    and well...you've guys have seen Rafer with the ball in his hands..
     
  15. weslinder

    weslinder Member

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    Nice article, but Jim Jackson, McGrady, and Padgett are also better than Wesley, Head, Bogans, and Frahm. So I don't back off of my statement.

    The fact is that Alston was what a huge number of Rockets fans were hoping for in a point guard for several years now. At least since they saw that Francis was not the winning model at PG. The team sucked last year of no fault of his own. But he's an easy scapegoat.
     
  16. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    You make a good point in bringing up Francis.

    His 6.5 assists put rafer's 7 assists in perspective as being not that impressive.
     
  17. imoffg33

    imoffg33 Member

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    here's a better question:
    can we trade cd and jvg for someone's future second round pick?
     
  18. solid

    solid Member

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    Alston did not have an impressive season, his shooting was very inconsistent and his defense was weak. I would have never traded James for him, and I still don't understand why they did. He just doesn't have much of a court presence, like he is going to come up big at "crunchtime" or take over games. He pushes up the tempo and passes well, but I don't see him as a starter. Maybe his complimentary skills will blend with a healthy TMac and Ming, but if he doesn't improve, he is likely to sit down more. I would trade him in a second for a good offer, I don't like his contract. Too much "buck" for too little of a "bang."
     
  19. Rockets111

    Rockets111 Member

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    Actually it is, since Francis had the ball A LOT more than Rafer. Alston pretty much just comes up the court, passes to the wing, and when he gets it back, he'll penetrate or make the third pass to an open player. Francis had the ball about 80% of the time on an offensive set, whereas TMac, Yao and even Howard had more ball control during a set as Alston.

    You're kidding, right? Sura better than Alston at running a fast-break? Rafer's whole game is pushing tempo and getting teammates quick and easy shots early. The Rockets HARDLY fast-breaked during Sura's tenure here. Yea, they didnt do it as much last year either but TMac missed a great deal of the year, and Bogans was the only one willing to run with Rafer, and he wasn't the best of finishers. I guarantee they would have been a better fast break team last year because all they talked about during preseason was how they were going to be faster and pushing the ball more and more since Alston was on board.
     
  20. hoang17

    hoang17 Member

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    you guys have to realize that last year's team was a catastrophe and it hindered on Rafer's true ability: A Pure Passing Point Guard.

    Do you remember the starting lineups that he had to play with throughout the whole season? Tmac was in and out of the lineup. Yao was in and out of the lineup. At one point, I think the lineup was Alston, Head, Bogans, Howard, and Deke. Now tell me, how are you supposed to succed with that kind of lineup?

    When all the injuries hit, Alston's game was hit the worst out of the team. His forte is finding the open mand and controlling the tempo/offense of the game. When you force him to create his own shots and shoot the ball 13-15 times a game, of course he's gonna look bad, because that's not his game.

    To me, the way I truly see Rafer's game was that 2 week period in January/February when Tmac and Yao were both healthy. During that span, we had an great record and Rafer was averaging 10 points/11 assists per game. He was making great feeds to Yao in the post and setting up Tmacs for jumpers left and right. If anybody can youtube the Clippers Game (2/14/06), that kinda shows you what you can expect from Rafer if everyone's healthy.

    All in all, it's obvious that Rafer needs to work on his shooting. But you can't truly grade his play for the Rockets yet because last year, everybody deserved a failing grade. Let him play the whole season with a healthy Yao/Tmac/Battier and you'll see his numbers improve greatly. My projections for the upcoming season:

    PPG - 12
    Asts - 9
    Stls - 1.5

    Edit: In fact, after goign through that stretch (Feb.1-Feb.22) Alston averaged 9 assists/game (81 assists in 9 games, double digit assists in 4 of those games) and the team went 7-2 in those games
     
    #80 hoang17, Jul 17, 2006
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2006

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