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[Controversial Take] LeBron is a God amongst men, but ...

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by plutoblue11, Mar 12, 2022.

  1. plutoblue11

    plutoblue11 Member

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    I think what LeBron did last night was beyond incredible, especially for 37 year old basketball player. Still feel like he's a top 2 to top 10 at worst player. I also think he's a great businessman and has been awesome athlete to follow or for children to look up to. He's a model citizen, I dare say an ubermensch. Considering his early childhood, as his family lived, also throw in the declining economy of Akron. He's accomplished alot.

    Though, for the Lakers (and other teams that he's played for), he probably at most of times should've taken a backseat. After seeing how this is turning out for Russell Westbrook and even the Lakers, they've been mediocre also season tinkering with awfulness. I feel like Lebron's short-sightedness has gotten them, here. He's the reason they may not make the playoffs or even the play-in rounds.

    I know alot of his critics, such MJ fans, Kobe fans, or notorious LeBron haters (Skip Bayless/Karceno -- YouTuber), say it's because he doesn't have a killer instinct or too much control of the team. The latter point, I already mentioned, but will come back to it. While, having a killer instinct is a very good trait to have, it can be somewhat meaningless in the construct of team or franchise. Especially, when the team around you is mediocre. You can have all the killer instinct you want, but a below average or mediocre team is not going to change too much or get you to championships.

    Though, putting this aspect back on MJ and Kobe, it's almost god-send that they did not have enough power or pull to make most or all of the player transactions. I've read a few books and articles about the Bulls over the years, and it seems like as oddly as this sound MJ could've been the biggest obstacle that kept the Bulls from being a championship or dynasty team. Initially, he went against several moves that Krause and the front office made (Cartwright/Oakley, Horace Grant pick, and the Kukoc draft pick).

    https://www.thebiglead.com/posts/je...bbied-for-help-is-revisionist-bs-01dxksrjjfdv

    I'm not saying Krause is a saint or genius, by any stretch of the imagination. But, the way he was portrayed in the Last Dance (along with Scottie Pippen) is revisionist and unfair. One of the biggest reason, a last dance existed was in part ... to Mr. Krause. From about 86-98, he orchestrated every major move and draft pick for the team. In that time period, the Bulls had one of the better front offices in the league. But, many fans and revisions say poor MJ and the Bulls can't win anything, because of Krause. "They could've won....8 to 10 championships and dominated the league." There's this nostalgia and ignorance that props up one legend, but totally disrespects the other teams and champions of that period. We already know how this forum feels about the Rockets chances against the Bulls, during his first retirement years. Chicago had never faced a team as good as the Rockets at any point, during their entire championship run. The Jazz, Suns, Knicks, and Supersonic teams were a tier below any championship Rocket teams. Considering how the Pacers came close to beating them, I honestly don't think the Bulls would've necessarily made it out of the East in 99, unless Krause made another great move. I still will go out on a ledge say they've would've been beaten soundly by the Spurs. Even Portland, may have been a handful, as they disposed of Utah, pretty quickly. Then, we start looking over the Wizard and Bobcat/Hornets years, MJ was never meant to be in a GM role. Seeing what happened to some of his draft picks, he could not cultivate talent, like that. No, Phil Jackson should not have been GM, as you could see with what happened with tenure in New York. If I hear another damn word about the Triangle offense and trying to institute on every damn team you go to... This is why I don't put him in the same class with Belichick or Popovich.

    Same for Kobe, who is much more egregious. 1. Agent already said Kobe is going to LA, no if's or but's about it. Star draft picks have that kind of leverage, but the revisionists who keep acting like the NBA teams and front offices were incompetent to pass up Kobe. Let's stop that, granted some teams are grossly handled, but 12+ teams c'mon now. There were probably 7-10 teams that would've drafted Kobe without hesitation, if no strings were attached. Every former coach from nearly each one of those teams said they wanted the Kobe, but Tellem said absolutely not. The teams' hands are tied.

    2. He didn't vibe with the late 90s Lakers, and they essentially had super team with... 4 all-stars. Four all-stars. Shaq with Van Exel and Jones. Also, Fox, Horry, Fisher, and Campbell. I don't think there's been too many better lineups than that in modern NBA history. But, they couldn't win. Some people say that Van Exel and Jones, other veterans would ice Kobe out. People said they were selfish players. Which is a blatant lie. Because, both players were superbly unselfish players, before Kobe and after. Van Exel could fit into any offense, and was creative with the basketball. I know he was traded, because of a "...joke." Yes, a joke at practice. I don't think I ever had any reason to question NVE commitment to the game. Jones was a swiss army knife. Though, he became expendable, because Kobe matured as a player. Still, Glen Rice was a great scorer, but faded out very quickly, while Jones played for another eight season, arguably 6 at very high level.

    3. Shaq - Kobe feud. Enough said.

    4. Kobe's trade demands (2006-2007). A situation that he created, more or less. Though, I'm with him on the Caron Butler/Chucky Atkins trade. That trade was pretty awful. Caron and Chucky were both positives for the team, I believe that teams was playoff bound with a healthy Kobe. You could've found a serviceable center from anywhere, even at that time and let Bynum develop.

    5. Post Championship Years - Dwight Howard and a serious of bad signings. I think Kobe was starting to realize this at that time, while he couldn't get to where he was due to age and injuries. Though, he helped cultivate alot of the younger guys, before he retired, which I can give him credit for.


    This is the aspect of the game where I think LeBron is supreme over both MJ and Kobe. He can make the best plays to win the game or take a secondary role, comfortably. It's not and will not be about having the last shot, leading scoring, that's nice and all, if you get the opportunity. But, if there's a shooter sitting wide open under the basket or 3 point line, common basketball knowledge, just pass the ball. Hitting a game winning shot over 2 players at buzzer is incredible, but you aren't going to hit that shot every game and actual statistics say it is very low percentage shot, even for great offensive players.

    Here's where LeBron fails, like MJ. He's assessment of players and how they work within the structure of a team vs. other NBA teams. Like MJ, he has affinity for veterans, who are past their time and adding them to teams that are pretty young and quickly improving. This is why you have an LA disaster in 2022. He can only see the team from one perspective, unlike most GMs, who spend their entire job with tinkering with rosters, scouting players, and analyzing stats/metrics to see how they will work into a given team. Pelinka made a lot of really good moves over the last 3 years. I felt like some made in the offseason were right on the nose, especially Monk and Nunn. The Westbrook move was a LeBron move that has backfired. Though, in all fairness, it was the only big move that could be made. I actually think Hield move would not have made them better, especially with the way he played to start the season. The media would've eaten him alive in LA. Only go for that move, if it is almost straight up for Kuzma, maybe another player, but not 3 or 4. Definitely no draft picks.
     
    Slyonebluejay likes this.
  2. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
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    losing to the Rockets gave him some motivation
     
    juanm34 likes this.
  3. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

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    His longevity and endurance is impressive. No God though. And no point to all this.

    Seems like he really is pushing himself to further injury IMO. And to lose ro Phoen
     

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