Congress OKs historic bailout bill; Bush signs it

Refman · Oct 3, 2008

Rocket River said:

This bill reminds me of the mass exodus of Hurricane Rita
More folx gonna be hurt by the evacuation than the actual storm

Rocket River
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And how many people would have been hurt by the storm had they not evacuated? We will never know for sure, but it would have been a lot more. I believe that Ike has reminded us of the consequences of not getting out of the way.

This economic mess is the same. If you do nothing, you are likely to have the problem worsen. That being said, this bill did not need to have any pork attached. It needed to be very narrowly drawn to do just what was needed to stabilize the market. Then the reparative work can begin a la regulation, etc.

thadeus · Oct 3, 2008

robbie380 said:

please take the time to read up on what is going on before reacting irrationally.
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I've read everything I can regarding the crisis. The typical response to everyone who has issues with the bailout is that "you just don't understand."

Well here's my response to the pro-bailout folks who insist on being condescending toward anyone who opposes them: you went in for the old PANIC PANIC PANIC political gimmick, and just supported the biggest theft in the history of the world.

Rocket River · Oct 3, 2008

Refman said:

And how many people would have been hurt by the storm had they not evacuated? We will never know for sure, but it would have been a lot more. I believe that Ike has reminded us of the consequences of not getting out of the way.

This economic mess is the same. If you do nothing, you are likely to have the problem worsen. That being said, this bill did not need to have any pork attached. It needed to be very narrowly drawn to do just what was needed to stabilize the market. Then the reparative work can begin a la regulation, etc.
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Considering Rita missed us by a large margin
and we barely got any rain . . . . I suspect not many

they scared people into a panic
they cried fire in a pack theater

same as they did this time

Rocket River

rhester · Oct 3, 2008

Would someone wake me up when the credit markets unfreeze.

Another 700 billion...

Should we merge this thread with the end of the world thread now that we are closer.

rimrocker · Oct 3, 2008

CaseyH said:

Did you notice what happened the longer the bill stayed in congress?

It got fatter and fatter. It got more expensive. The only thing these jerks no how to do is spend money and this is the ONLY reason it got voted down on Monday. I know for a fact the two local reps voted it down because it did not do anything for low income housing.
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That happened because it was a crap bill and they had to load it up to buy votes to pass the damn thing. Plus, a bunch of the Repubs are absolutely nuts and a bunch of the Dems are spineless.

Landlord Landry · Oct 4, 2008

this totally validates George Bushs' tenure as president.

rimrocker · Oct 4, 2008

Some recent Krugman remarks...

Has the bailout already failed?

OK, I know that’s premature. And I place no weight at all on the fact that the Dow plunged after the vote.

But it is interesting that short-term Treasury yields are down — only 0.13% on one-month — suggesting that the flight to safety continues unabated. Against this, John Jansen reports some signs that money markets are unfreezing, slightly.

We’ll learn more next week. But I have a prediction: well before January 20, Congress will be asked to vote on bailout 2.0.
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Basically, Paulson has placed us all in a miserable predicament, with a lousy plan that has to be passed in some form to prevent total panic. Jan. 20 won’t come a moment too soon, and may well come about 4 1/2 months too late.
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For the fact is that the plan on offer is a stinker — and inexcusably so. The financial system has been under severe stress for more than a year, and there should have been carefully thought-out contingency plans ready to roll out in case the markets melted down. Obviously, there weren’t: the Paulson plan was clearly drawn up in haste and confusion. And Treasury officials have yet to offer any clear explanation of how the plan is supposed to work, probably because they themselves have no idea what they’re doing.

Despite this, as I said, I hope the plan passes, because otherwise we’ll probably see even worse panic in the markets. But at best, the plan will buy some time to seek a real solution to the crisis.

And that raises the question: Do we have that time?

A solution to our economic woes will have to start with a much better-conceived rescue of the financial system — one that will almost surely involve the U.S. government taking partial, temporary ownership of that system, the way Sweden’s government did in the early 1990s. Yet it’s hard to imagine the Bush administration taking that step.

We also desperately need an economic stimulus plan to push back against the slump in spending and employment. And this time it had better be a serious plan that doesn’t rely on the magic of tax cuts, but instead spends money where it’s needed. (Aid to cash-strapped state and local governments, which are slashing spending at precisely the worst moment, is also a priority.) Yet it’s hard to imagine the Bush administration, in its final months, overseeing the creation of a new Works Progress Administration.

So we probably have to wait for the next administration, which should be much more inclined to do the right thing — although even that’s by no means a sure thing, given the uncertainty of the election outcome. (I’m not a fan of Mr. Paulson’s, but I’d rather have him at the Treasury than, say, Phil “nation of whiners” Gramm.)

And while the election is only 32 days away, it will be almost four months until the next administration takes office. A lot can — and probably will — go wrong in those four months.

One thing’s for sure: The next administration’s economic team had better be ready to hit the ground running, because from day one it will find itself dealing with the worst financial and economic crisis since the Great Depression.
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http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/03/opinion/03krugman.html?_r=1&ref=opinion&oref=slogin

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/

IROC it · Oct 4, 2008

FWIW - Texas got $100 B of it for Ike relief... they voted down some relief for areas hit by Ike earlier, didn't they?

That's about the only positive add-on.

Wooden arrow manufacturers? Wool manufacturers? Movie company perks?

Bandwagoner · Oct 4, 2008

IROC it said:

? Movie company perks?
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well most movies are not made int he USA these days because of cost.

Canada is making a killing on this.

Rocket River · Oct 4, 2008

I wonder how much will end up in Foreign Banks

Rocket River

BetterThanEver · Oct 4, 2008

$700 billion is just a drop in the bucket, when the home mortgage industry is 1$11-12 trillion.

For many banks, it's already too late.

I am curious what a $700 billion small business and startup package would do for the economy? How about giving tax breaks going to venture capitalists and small business owners? How about providing more security for small business loans to provide them capital for expansion and growth? The next Dell is in somebody's dorm room and will grow faster with a loan. In this tight credit market, many small businesses can't find the cash.

rhadamanthus · Oct 4, 2008

Truly sickening.

That's all I can say really.

Chomsky was right.

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Congress OKs historic bailout bill; Bush signs it

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