heyp, At first, I just thought him to be some kind of fanatic...then, after things surfaced, I realized he was just trying very hard to cause problems. I do not think his knowledge of China was ever the point...he would learn enough just twist it to meet his view, but that same info (in full context) only would prove him wrong. That and the name calling all fell into place. People still say he won...lol! ------------------ Whitey will pay.
I know it is a joke...rimmy. We don't even have formal diplomatic relations with this island, yet the damn Treaty must.be.upheld. so the carpetbaggers can keep ownership of Formosa, and we keep our military objective and Eastern commerce port. This is very similar to how another carpetbagger, Batista, needed to be protected from the people's revolution of Catro. But what did the US do, stepped aside. We should step aside again. This is ridiculous to not give that island back to the sleeping giant.
Haven.... (sigh) Don't EVEN get me started about Sweden. You know EXACTLY why they have so many assets, and it ain't because of their production. PLEASE! Show me how the rest of Europe compares to the U.S. before preaching the praises of Socialism. Thanks. ------------------ "I never did like that "Dr. Stupid""-Monty Burns
Not being sarcastic. . . but could you enlighten me about this? or is that another thread Rocket River ------------------
I wasn't going to ask you, Clutch....because I got the definite impression that you didn't wish to discuss it..... But what's the deal? Closing this thread without an explanation. Closing kbm's thread with a very terse response. Then reopening this thread. I pride myself in not being a very curious person, but this is killing me. r.l.hablinski@worldnet.att.net ------------------ stop posting my damn signature
Pole, HeyPee's response in the following thread may answer your question : http://bbs.clutchcity.net/ubb/Forum5/HTML/000532.html ... or not ------------------ "So you say you want some intelligent responses? I say give me something intelligent to respond to." -- Dimwits beware, B-Ball freak tells it like it is. Sing it bro!
Obviously, with the way we are now, war is inevitable. Who has the weapons has nothing to do with it, though. One cause is not greater than another. The communist will kill for communism. The capitalist will kill for capitalism. The christian will slaughter the muslim. The muslim will behead the christian. You know what, screw that. I'm not going to war for anybodys freaking ideals. sir hangover was right. Kill me, send me to hell, or whatever. I can't think of one person over in china, like some nationalistic sob grandpa, I really hate enough to kill. I hope i didn't kill this thread. ------------------
as far as: 1 china the evil empire 2 communism, the insedious evil threat 3 America causing these problems is anything new?? It is a generally accepted understanding that for a nation to function at its bets there needs to be a common enemy. It is only through working for the better "common good" that people will pay higher taxes. will support extreme military expenditure etc. these sacrafices make the leaders richer and more powerfull. it also gives them a stronger legacy. you can name off the great evils our nation has fought in its short history. you can name the enemies of other nations. all of this is merely posturing. Are russians actually evil?? no they are generally cool people. are all the Russian chicks ugly?? no they are often more attractive than American women(and frisky too ) why does the government propigate these myths? so we can push our power over other nations. so we can spend close to 5% of our budget on the space race for 10 years. so we can starve our heartland to send food to potential allies. So we can rationalize inhumane tests on our own population so why is China so scary?? because the media is telling the sheep that they are scary. the same sheep that fully belived that Russia was Evil. oh sure the russians used us too. they were able to expand their empire for nearly 40 years for the safety of the world. they had to protect the world from Capitolism. Eww!! Evil Americans!! I see all of this China talk as just the next evil empire that we must rid the world of. Why? so the rich can keep getting richer. so the politicians have a legacy for our children to read about. so reporters have something top do. Seriously. its all BS, Its all Spin doctoring. just like in the gulf war when Hussain was made out to be the Anti Christ. when all middle eastern people were evil. but the Iraquis were just starving peasants not evil monsters.same with the Russians, and like the Germans/Japanese Citizenry before them. hell the population of the US was suffering during WWII, but you would have a hard time finding that in the media of the day. wow I just ranted. all in all I think its all another BS spin to give Baby Bush an enemy to fight. so he can be a big hero. yup there will be a military skirmish just before his re-election. and by then everyone will hate chinese people, and wear American flag T-shirts. we will be selling military stuff to Taiwan and others la de da the status Quo continues. Peace(pay no attention to my dyslexia/SP, I tried to fix most of it) I am re-posting this as to hopefully revive an important subject. do the governments really think they can gain from a armed or unarmed conflict between our two nations?? will the US be able to convert say N korea or Vietnam or cuba back to Capitolism. does China think they can get other nations like Taiwan to come over to Communism? its really about world power. the problem I see is that China appears to want Superpower status. they want a seat on the security council. going to war (cold or hot) will acomplish this. gaining satalite nations will accomplish this. invading mongolia, or S korea, or whatever will help their World power status. but is it our dfault for helping them belive this?? ------------------ Hanta-Force Paintball www.hanta-force.com
"Saying YES to the revolutionizing of the world! Spreading the teachings of the communist classics, the ABC of communism: to the ignorant, instruction about their situation, to the oppressed; class-consciousness, and to the class-conscious; the experience of revolution. Speading the net of the party for the guns of the CAPITALISTS. Sink down in the slime. Embrace the butcher. but change the world, it needs it. who are you?" Bertolt Brecht- The Measures Taken ------------------ "Playing with Steve makes my job so much easier, "He's such a complete player. He has some great moves and shoots from the outside and in the post. We communicate well on the floor." - Hakeem Olajuwon "It's great to have that inside-outside balance," Francis said. "We've tried to get that all season, with Hakeem and me clicking at the same time.
China is one of the five permanent members of the UN Security Council, so the part about their actions being a push to gain that seat is wrong. http://www.un.org/documents/scinfo.htm Mongolia? Landlocked with 3 million people and that will help China achieve Super Power status? http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/mg.html The entire concept of satellite nations for China is amusing. North Korea? The leaders/miltary have driven that country and its population to the brink of ruin. Viet Nam wants United States economic involvement and better trade relations with our country. China is much closer to those countries, but is totally prostrate in helping them develop economically. Using Military Force to subjugate neighboring countries? That has never been China's style to have colonies subservient to it. Russia had no problem being the dominant force in the Soviet Union, yet China has never shown a desire to create a collective of Asiatic Communist countries. Super Power status for China? Their military aircraft are perhaps a generation behind the United States. Deep Water Naval ships are minimal and they lack the basing rights throughout the world that the US enjoys. So, that limits major activity to spread their power/Communism to the Asian continent. Without being able to project military power throughout the world, Super Power status for China won't happen. Mango ------------------ Get it right or just don't do it! Resistance is futile....you will be assimilated. [This message has been edited by Mango (edited April 13, 2001).]
Mango hit it on the head. That's why the title of this thread is so ridiculous. China the new evil empire, eh? Not with only thirty nuclear warheads, pal! I guess the right wing just ain't happy unless they've got someone to hate. And now that Clinton is gone, they've gone back to fearing the evil red menace from Beijing. Like they say, ignorance is bliss! ------------------ "Blues is a Healer" --John Lee Hooker
RM95: You have yet to prove anything to me. Are those embryos human? Your arbitrariness is allowing them to die. And you're worried about me?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Worry about the innocents. ------------------ Time is a great teacher-- only problem is it kills all its pupils. PowerbizOnline.com
Why are we threatening Say_Jack with everything short of riding Ol' Sparky...? What did I miss? From what I can tell, the only thing he's guilty of is making haven look foolish. ------------------ Pollution rules! Clean air sucks! I hope you're coughing, where ever you are! [This message has been edited by BrianKagy (edited April 16, 2001).]
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Haven and Heypartner. Read the following article to see why we defended South Korea, and see what would have happened to the children of South Korea if our heroic soldiers had not intervened. Also, note what China did to North Korea by enslaving the people in the name of Communism. LIFE UNDER THE RED STAR A Prison Country A report from inside North Korea. BY NORBERT VOLLERTSEN Tuesday, April 17, 2001 12:01 a.m. EDT I know North Korea. I have lived there, and have witnessed its hell and madness. I was a doctor with a German medical group, "Cap Anamur," and entered North Korea in July 1999. I remained until my expulsion on Dec. 30, 2000, after I denounced the regime for its abuse of human rights, and its failure to distribute food aid to the people who needed it most. North Korea's starvation is not the result of natural disasters. The calamity is man-made. Only the regime's overthrow will end it. Human rights are nonexistent. Peasants, slaves to the regime, lead lives of utter destitution. It is as if a basic right to exist--to be--is denied. Ordinary people starve and die. They are detained at the caprice of the regime. Forced labor is the basic way in which "order" is maintained. I will recount some of my experiences. Early in my spell in North Korea I was summoned to treat a workman who had been badly burned by molten iron. I volunteered my own skin to be grafted onto him. With a penknife, my skin was pulled from my left thigh and applied to the patient. For this, I was acclaimed by the state media--the only media--and awarded the Friendship Medal, one of only two foreigners ever to receive this honor. I was also issued a "VIP passport" and a driver's license, which allowed me to travel to areas inaccessible to foreigners and ordinary citizens. I secretly photographed patients and their decrepit surroundings. Though I was assigned to a children's hospital in Pyongsong, 10 miles north of Pyongyang, I visited many hospitals in other provinces. In each one, I found unbelievable deprivation. Crude rubber drips were hooked to patients from old beer bottles. There were no bandages, scalpels, antibiotics or operation facilities, only broken beds on which children lay waiting to die. The children were emaciated, stunted, mute, emotionally depleted. In the hospitals one sees kids too small for their age, with hollow eyes and skin stretched tight across their faces. They wear blue-and-white striped pajamas, like the children in Hitler's Auschwitz. They are so malnourished, so drained of resistance, that a flu can kill them. Why are there so many orphans? Where are all the parents? What passes here for family life? In North Korea, a repressive apparatus uncoils whenever there is criticism. The suffocation, by surveillance, shadowing, wiretapping and mail interception, is total. Most patients in hospitals suffer from psychosomatic illnesses, worn out by compulsory drills, innumerable parades, "patriotic" assemblies at six in the morning and droning propaganda. They are toilworn, prostrate, at the end of their tether. Clinical depression is rampant. Alcoholism is common because of mindnumbing rigidities, regimentation and hopelessness. In patients' eyes I saw no life, only lassitude and a constant fear. Once, I had an opportunity to visit my driver, a member of the military, who was in the hospital because of injury. The authorities were vexed that I wanted to see him, but I was able to overcome objections. As was my custom on hospital visits, I took bandages and antibiotics--basics. On this occasion, I was embarrassed to see that, unlike any other hospital I visited, this one looked as modern as any in Germany. It was equipped with the latest medical apparatus, such as magnetic resonance imaging, ultrasound, electrocardiograms and X-ray machines. There are two worlds in North Korea, one for the senior military and the elite; and a living hell for the rest. I didn't see any improvement in the availability of food and medicine in any of the hospitals I worked in during my entire stay. One can only imagine what conditions are like in the "reform institutions," where whole families are imprisoned when any one member does or says something that offends the regime. These camps are closed to foreigners. My initial naiveté that the starvation was the result of weather conditions disappeared when I saw that much of the food aid was being denied those who needed it most. Before Cap Anamur came to North Korea, other agencies such as Oxfam and CARE pulled out because they weren't allowed to distribute aid directly to the people. They had to turn it over to the authorities, who took complete charge of distribution. Monitoring is impossible. Nobody really knows where the aid is going, except that it is not going to the starving citizens. If a doctor's diagnosis is that North Korea suffers from society-wide fear and depression because of the cruel system, he has to think about the right therapy and to speak out against repression. The international community, especially humanitarian groups, must demand access to the shadowy world of labor camps. They have to look for the violence that is hidden from us by the system. The system's beneficiaries are members of the Communist Party and high-ranking military personnel. In Pyongyang, these people enjoy a comfortable lifestyle--obscene in the context--with fancy restaurants and nightclubs. In diplomatic shops, they can buy such delicacies as Argentine steak, with which they supplement their supplies of food diverted from humanitarian aid. In the countryside, starving people, bypassed by the aid intended for them, forage for food. Pyongyang is fooling the world. As a German, I know too well the guilt of my grandparents' generation for its silence under the Nazis. I feel it is my duty to expose this satanic regime, which has deified "Dear Leader" Kim Jong Il, just as it did his late father. Even though virtually the entire North Korean economy is geared to the military, we should help ordinary citizens. But this must be on condition that aid goes to the deserving. Foreign NGOs, journalists and diplomats must be free to travel unannounced to the provinces to ensure that aid isn't misdirected. Only pressure on North Korea can save lives. The people can't help themselves. They are brainwashed, and too afraid to be able to overthrow their rulers. That's the medical diagnosis. Only the outside world can administer the right therapy, and bring about a reformation of this depraved nation. Dr. Vollertsen, a physician from Germany, worked in hospitals in North Korea from July 1999 to December 2000. ------------------
I've got a question for you: Who in their right mind equates everything to the left of Pat Robertson with Communism? You do, and that is why your posts are so comical. They come straight from a paranoid, John Birch Society vision of the world. You ought to stick your head out of your trailer once in a while and see what the real world is all about, rather than hide and believe everything Rush Limbaugh tells you to believe! ------------------ "Blues is a Healer" --John Lee Hooker
RocketMan Tex, Your reference made me think about this song. Uneasy Rider "............... I'm a faithful follower of Brother John Birch, And I belong to the Antioch Baptist Church, ................" http://www.numachi.com/cgi-bin/rickheit/dtrad/lookup?ti=UNEASYRD --------------------------------------------- China is not an Empire and is incapable of becoming one in the near future. Mango ------------------ Get it right or just don't do it! Resistance is futile....you will be assimilated.
Jim: Communism and democracy are *not* mutually exclusive... I believe that's the sense you understood my comment in. But alas, self-determination doesn't necessitate democracy... simply that a government is considered legitimate by the people. That doesn't require voting. BC is actually a rather conservative school, much to my chagrin. It's called being "open minded." It's also always good to have some basic cognisance of the topic you're discussing, which you don't. Argh! I *can't* make myself stop responding . ------------------ I would believe only in a God who could dance. - Friedrich Nietzsche Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001 [This message has been edited by haven (edited April 17, 2001).]
My God... he's not done yet. Clutch, close up the thread, please... evidently that's the only thing that works. Jim, or whatever: your credibility is shot. The article is irrelevant, in any event. Nobody here has argued for repression and tolitarianism, only self-determination, and reason instead of paranoia. ------------------ I would believe only in a God who could dance. - Friedrich Nietzsche Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001
