[ClutchFans] The numbers are clear: Patrick Beverley deserves to start over Jeremy Lin

Unless both of them get hurt again for approximately half the games but separate from each other, then no, we will have really no more significant addition to the sample size of Lin with starters lineup.

 

People overvalue Beverley's intensity to insane levels. Beverley is a scrub who did one thing right in the playoffs. He can't shoot, can't throw an entry pass, and can't run a play to save his life. If I wanted intensity and defense I would rather have it from this guy :

The Black Patrick Beverley

 

I guess the Lin crazies are the real player-only haters here.

 

Starting is one thing... The flow of the game is entirely different....

When the Rockets had Kenny and Sam during the championship years, Kenny started; but who finished depended on the flow of the game and how each were playing...

One thing for Stats on who starts and plays with a unit... But the flow and finish are entirely different...

T_Man

 

This.

The Rockets offense is not geared to Lin doing what he wants, much less playing to his strengths. How often have you seen a PnR run for Lin this year?

If Lin had been left as a starter, the offense would probably have evolved in a different direction. Parsons' role for example would likely have been much more limited, and focused more on finishing. We saw that offense in the first few games of the preseason when the Rockets dominated the Pelicans as well as the Pacers.

With Lin's benching, a decision was likely made that the core group going forward should be Parsons, Harden and Howard, with Parsons getting most of the touches that would have gone to Lin had he continued as a starter.

So in a way, the starting unit is now tailor made for a Bev type PG . Given that, is it that surprising that the starting unit's numbers are better with Bev playing? The way that unit is configured now Bev does "fit" better. It didn't have to be that way necessarily, but it is now.

 

Again wrong and this was posted earlier... I guarantee you over 98% of the posters on the posters don't hate Lin... They don't care for a lot of his fan base that take fanatics to an entire different level....

So saying that posters hate Lin is entirely untrue.....

T_Man

 

when are we trading lin?

 

Ok... Again not entirely true...

1) You are correct that the offense is not geared for Lin... The offense is geared for Howard and Harden, Lin is not a superstar on this team neither is Bev. So why should they gear the offense for Lin or Bev. You create an offense where your stars can blossom.

So even if Lin would continue to start the offense would not evolve around him and that's what a lot of people can't understand.

2) Lin and Harden have very similar playing styles and it makes sense for Lin to come off the bench where he can be free to have the ball in hands when Harden is on the bench. So Lin is getting his opportunity and chance to shine... He has to use that opportunity to his advantage.

T_Man

 

Please explain how using 4th quarter lineups to justify at least giving Lin a chance to play more in the 4th/finish games regularly, makes me a PBev hater? I have stated numerous times I love what Bev brings to the team - we just have to put the TEAM in the BEST possible position to win games. If you can ignore a 38 pt differential between lineups in the 4th, and not only that, but that Bev's lineup is in the NEGATIVES, then I don't know what to say. Ignoring that stat will definitely not help us win more games.

 

As soon as we can get someone better I'm assuming.

 

That's ludicrous. If a player is in a slump, they get pulled from the starting lineup all the time. So Lin is flowin right now and should be starting based on your theory.

And if the stats were close between Lin and Bev in the 4th Quarter, then maybe the flow argument works. But you go with the unit that performs the best consistently as your base- and that would be Lin, not Bev in the 4th.

 

If we take out the Lin vs Bev stuff that seems to fire everyone up, we can simply say that Lin (based on lineup AND personal stats) could and should be used more/more effectively in the 4th.

 

Not Ludicrous sir....

There have been several players who have come off the bench and finished games and played more minutes that a starter... One being the McHale, then you have Vinnie (the Micorwave) and Cassell just to name a few.

As I stated in another response... Lin is better coming off the bench where he can be himself to lead the team when Harden is on the bench... He will not have this opportunity starting with Harden. They both need the ball in their hands.

It's not always about shooting percentage, it's about balance. There's only one ball and Harden and Lin can't have the ball in their hand at the same time.

T_Man

 

Actually, that comment was directed to the poster above me. No need to explain yourself away, I don't think you're one of those Lin crazies.

 

Oh, ok. sorry.:grin:

 

I believe some of us here all agree that PB should start as the coaching staff likes his energy and swagger and some stats support that argument. But what we sometimes were puzzled is why Lin wasn't in the end of 4th quarter when the offense was needed like last night. The same stats. (in roughly the same set of games) Clutch used in his article to support PB starting were used to support Lin finishing more games. The difference btw stats. Clutch uses and ed_tx uses is that the one ed_tx uses were only in the 4th quarter. So if stats. support Clutch's argument should also support ed_tx's argument.

I'm indifferent to who should start as I like both PB and Lin. They are both good NBA players. They have different skill sets and complement each other. As long as both are members of the Rockets, I will support both unconditionally. I don't care about their fans and I care more about them the players and what is good to the Rockets' success like you do. Ideally, I prefer a PG with skill sets from both Lin and PB. A player closely to resemble a player molded with both PB and Lin is Chris Paul. But how many Chris Pauls are there (if you ignore his pseudo brother Cliff Paul :grin, the answer is exactly one. Since we are not going to get Chris Paul, we can only make the best of both Lin and PB. Lin has proven to have a more polished offense. If a game needs more offense, I'd have played more Lin and had him finishing instead of PB like last night if it were up to me.

 

Is it about winning?? cuz +27 is gonna win you a lot more games than -9. Also, I think we all agree that Bev should start - just saying Lin should be used more in the 4th/closing - simple!!

 

T_Man:

Pls. read ed_tx and Clarinetmonster's posts more carefully next time. They are not arguing who should start. They actually AGREE with you that PB should start. They are arguing who should FINISH games more. Based on the stats. they support to have Lin finishing more games.

 

I agree with the could, but not the should...

This is where the difference comes in at... A coach does not have to play a player at any given time. All of us on this board get that Lin could be used more effectively, so could D-Mo and other players... But when fans start making bad comments about a coach or players, because their favorite didn't get the playing time they wanted him to get that's where the separation happens.

This is not the first time the board has went thru this type of attitude. It happened with the T_Mac fanatics and Yao fanatics.

So when you see posters with the start date of 1999 to 2002 (Before Yao was drafted) these are posters who care only about the Rockets winning, they don't give a crap about who starts and who played what minutes.

So for us it's not about Lin vs Bev, it's about fans and those who are fanatics about a certain player instead of the entire team.

T_Man

 

This. Last night was a perfect example of Lin being taken out when he was just starting to get things going (made midrange shot, got to the Line and then bye bye.)