[ClutchFans] The numbers are clear: Patrick Beverley deserves to start over Jeremy Lin

GTFO idiot

 

So you want to use a stat that lists Eric Bledsoe and Thomas ahead of Lillard, Wall and Parker....nicely done.

 

Man you are still salty or butthurt from the last time we talked, aren't you? If you don't even know where the player impact comes from then you have no business talking about the NBA. You have little knowledge about basketball in general. You are just not very good at talking about basketball at all. Everytime you post something it is just to degrade Lin and without any facts. And when you show stats, you only show the stats that suits you about how bad Lin is. Now go educate yourself more, if that is even possible and stop your hating.

 

You can't look at players in a vacuum. Consider the situations they are in. If you switch Lin's role with IT's or Kemba's role, their PERs reverse. And Lin is the bigger, stronger player. He's a better....d-e-f-e-n-d-e-r than either one of those guys...by far.

 

Found this graph from realgm. Is Lin's defense seriously underrated on this board? I thought back in the golden state warriors days defense was his strength.

 

You can't be serious if you rate him equal to felton....

Im surprise CP3 isn't a top 15pg

 

Thats a really cool chart!

 

This is where he got it from:

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=1304418

 

Should have included the explaination from the original post:

* all defensive stats(including rebounding) were adjusted by Pace and Minutes per game.
** all offensive stats(excluding offensive rebounding) were adjusted by Front Court Touches.
*** stats were all collected from the top 40 PGs in the first 3 months(GP>20，MPtot>800，MPpg>20).
**** Tran. & OT means Transition and other points scored, such as technical free throw mades.

 

Using team success as a criteria is silly. Kyrie doesn't play with 2 all star all nba players like Lin does.

Frankly, you opinion should be dismissed out of hand if you don't take Irving's superiority to Lin as a given.

 

This defense is based on steal, blocks and rim protection. Steals and blocks are debatable measures of defensive abilities. As for rim protection, Lin has Dwight to back him up. Dragic has Miles Plumlee, and Lowry has Jonas Valanciunas. That may be a factor in why the disparity is so large.

 

So how do we know if Lin is a good or poor defender? just by eye test?

Yea I agree having Dwight is a big factor, but the PGs have to know how to funnel the defense. The argument earlier is that Lin is a "very poor defender". I've watched every game closely this season, I think he on average has done pretty well so far

 

this thread is still running strong.

 

People just love to debat (fight) with eachother.

 

Lin might very well be a better defender than Lowry and Dragic. That graph, however, is not definitive evidence.

There is no absolute answer to how good a defender most players are. You have look at all the stats, which are all mediocre at best(according to Morey), and watch the games, and make up your own mind.

Btw, I do agree that Lin is at minimum average on defense.

 

I tend to think xRAPM and RAPM do the best job on judging a player's defensive ability if they play enough minutes. They usually need more than a season of data before getting accurate. Lowry, Lin, Dragic is the order xRAPM and RAPM rate them defensively.

 

lets end the debate...

its should not be if Lin starts or not... its should not be about Lin stats vs Bev Stats or Lin stats vs Dragic stats etc etc etc

it should be if Lin is being used properly


having him start, play 48 minutes a game

wont mean squat if Lin is not being used the right way...

playing as a SG running to the 3 point line... we will see a few break out games during the year... but Lin is a mediocre SG

and I suspect we will see more below average games than any other from Lin

id rather not see Lin play so many minutes when he is in Shooting Guard mode until the 4th quarter anyways

 

I remember Lin shutting down Lowrly last season when Lin was starting at PG. Lin could have shut down Dragic too if not for the 3 screens that Dragic constantly gets.

 

Talking about Rubio. That's making me laugh.... in agreement.

Man, you may be right, but would you be willing to take the time to post each game. I'd love to read thru it. And maybe watch each one if I have time. I know people are calling me a hater, but the proof is always there if it's true.

Agreed. It's not really trying to illustrate the order because Chris Paul is obviously the best in the league. I just hate him and was listing guys games I somewhat enjoy. The real point of the list is to say Lin is def not in the top 15. He just isn't. (for me, who watches the game and analyzes all the players, not just the one I love)

Ha, I'm not a LOH, I'm a LIWHI,ASMer. (Lin Is Who He Is, A Sixth Man=er)

I love him as a 6th man and wouldn't trade him without getting great value. His contribution from the bench is fantastic and this team needs him to do that consistently. Especially in the playoffs. If he chooses to play the playoffs this year.

More fodder! Dragic and Conley should be on the list!!

I'll give ya'll Raymond Felton, but Lin is not that much better than Felton as a point guard. He's head and heals better as Mr. Sixth man.

All you have to do is adjust my list. Put Lin lower!

It's a "Lin is not a top 15 POINT GUARD in the NBA" list.

I love you Panda, especially for the Rubio part. But Isaiah is legit and lots of teams struggle with him. His team is decent when he's on the floor. (+8 something)

http://www.82games.com/1314/1314SAC.HTM

You are a no good at talking of the trash. I'm off to school to go edgamacate myself so I can have a conversation with the Little General that everyone respects so much.

 

Jeremy Lin is winning the internet.