[ClutchFans] Potential trade targets include Nene, Granger

Chris Broussard: Houston still a possible team for Carmelo(along with NY/LA). Then mentioned some other guys who could be moved in general. Mentioned Anthony Parker of Cleveland and talks about the Bulls looking for a SG. Then mentioned Brooks and Battier and says they could be on the move. Brooks unhappy, Battier an expiring. Says just about everyone on Portland is available except Batum, Wes Matthews, and Aldridge. Also said Camby could be moved. Talked about him or his agent "threating" retirement if traded but once place he wouldnt mind being traded to Houston since he lives here in the offseason. Says he is a piece Houston would go after if they got a guy like Carmelo to try to make a run.

 

While I disagree that Billups was a true #1, I understand where you're coming from. He wasn't really a big scorer or high assist man, but he stepped up when his team needed him to.

Miami may not win a championship THIS year; but are you willing to bet anything significant that they won't in the next two years? By year three, they may have the greatest NBA team.. ever. They may lose this year, but that would probably be to teams made up of multiple first-option guys (declining or not).

My assessment of Danny Granger may have been a tad harsh, but I wasn't being dishonest. Do you dispute anything I said? He might be a top five SF.. but if he is, he's #5 after LBJ, Durant, Carmelo, and Iguodala. You could make a strong case for Rudy Gay having a better year than Granger as well.

If you don't care what fans of the team he plays for say, there's not much to argue; you seem to have already made up your mind. You should be more open to the views of opposing fans, especially when they watch the player in question a lot more than you do.

As far as Martin showing how great of a 2nd go to guy he is on a championship team? Sure, he's done a great job of showing that by leading the Rockets to four games under .500?

So you think he has questionable shot selection but go off on me because I said he's a chucker? Ok. I would rate his slashing ability as average to below-average; he just doesn't have the handles to get past his man anytime he wants. I think you're in for a wake up call if you think DannyG will all of a sudden stop shooting so many bad shots once he gets here; he is who he is. The Pacers offense involves a lot of movement and back cuts, similar to Adelmans, so I see no reason why he suddenly would acquire a better shot selection. I also don't know of any examples of Adelman putting players in a position to be efficient.

Well, I hate to break it to ya, but we don't need more offense: we do need a closer though. A closer being someone that is capable of getting off their own shot and taking over games down the stretch. Danny Granger is not a closer -- no coffee for him.

 

What station was this on?

 

espn First Take

 

Thank you

 

Brooks, Battier, Bud and CLee are the most likely to go, IMHO. CLee is a good player, when Adelman gives him extended minutes he produces. He is a luxury on a team that has necessities to fill, I think the Bulls get him in some form. Camby for Brooks/Jeffries makes all the sense in the world, IF, Morey rents Melo and Portland can get rid of Miller.

 

I am probably one of the most open minded guys you will ever talk in this site, no problem at all at changing minds and admitting when wrong.

Iggy is not a SF, IMO

I said I don´t care about what fans think, because 99% of them talk with the heart. If I want to know how good K Mart is, I will not ask you what do you think about him, because knowing our record, you will probably say he sucks, and he is the leader of a sub 50% team. If I ask Dallas GM about him, he will only talk about what he puts every night on the floor, ignoring team record, and if his teammates have quality.

Yup, last year AB lead the team to a better record, so AB >>>>>>>>>>>>Martin
LBJ found a way to get one of the worst teams ever to the playoffs LBJ best player of all time

It is all about the record, I don´t even know how Iggy is as good as you might think, he is leading a 24-27 team.

Yup, saying a player has questionable shot selection is not the same thing as characterizing a player as a chucker, atleast in my mind.

You are wrong (IMO), players are not "who they are" regardless of what is surrounding them, I am talking about good players of course.

The Houston Rockets with Granger is more talented then Indiana. In Houston he would not need to take as many bad shots for our team to score. The other team would have to guard 2 dangerous perimeter scorers, that if you leave open in the 3pt line, they would let it fly, or if you are right on them they would pump fake, and take it to the basket, even without being great at doing it.

Carl Landry

My guess is that teams that don´t have a closer can´t win close games???
The problem with our offense in clutch situations is not about not having Melo (of course if we had him it would be easier), it is about teams being smart and cutting the only guy that consistently scores on our team, and that guy is Martin. If the ball doesn´t reach is hands, no one can score, it is that simple.

No need to talk more about Granger, we are going for Melo, like I always said, don´t ever count DM out :grin: :grin: :grin:

PeAcE

 

Teams that don't have closers struggle in close games; it doesn't mean that they are incapable of winning them. The Rockets this year have 7 wins, 11 losses in games decided by five points or less. That's a winning percentage in close games (defined as outcome being 5 points or less) of 39%.

The ball doesn't reach Martin's hands because he's not a good 1-on-1 player. Instead, we have to run him off picks and hope he can find room to get off his shot or create a foul. Think about our end-of-the-clock situations: whose hands is the ball in? Usually, it's Lowry who handles the ball in last-second situations -- we're not going to win many games like that (and haven't).

Danny Granger doesn't help us in this area. He's another weapon on the perimeter for other teams to be cognizant of, but you're not putting the ball in his hands and getting out of the way. I don't mean to say that he's not a good player (the_hustle; he's definitely top ten at his position, possibly top five) -- just that he's overrated on this board in the sense that adding him to this team wouldn't be a significant step closer to being a contender as I've seen a lot of people assume. I think Nene, while perhaps being less skilled than Granger, fills a bigger need and makes us a better team today than Danny Granger would.

All my opinion, of course.

 

Here is the problem with your logic, most of those teams you name are very,very close to the playoffs. Being in the playoffs is golden for owners because they dont pay full salaries to players and they get to keep the gate.

In case you didnt know, Indy was losing money when they were going to the finals. They have an older stadium which is the main culprit of that situation. They make the playoff and the can recover alot of that money.

Detroit is a very profitable team in case you didnt know. They have so overpaid guys,but they're not trading Monroe. If there is any team I know alot about its the pistons and hornets in respect to knowing people really,really high up. Of course they would love to trade rip, but prince in getting big time calls and offers from just about all the playoff teams and even some of the younger teams.

Charlotte has MJ as majority owner and since brown was let go,they're in the playoff picture really strong. Now they might move Jackson and Nazr to La for artest only because ron has this year plus 1 left on his contract. They're not trading wallace for Yao contract.

Philly were sellers earliers, but again,they're in the playoff picture so they're not giving away Iggy.Now If someone wants to take brand with iggy and send them more young talent, they might listen.

The bucks arent trading bogut. Again,team waas losing money when they had cassell and company and they still didnt pawn off players. They will probably trade maggette,but thats about it.

The kings are poised for big free agent run next season. If they trade someone, it will be garcia and beno for added space next year. They will lump cassipi in there to turn the deal, but no team is getting,cousins,evans.

 

Maybe not for just Yao's contract, but if we threw in the NY 2012 1st rounder? That might get it closer to being done. Gerald Wallace is very much available and was almost a Cavalier until the Bobcats insisted on a 1st rounder in addition to the trade exception.

 

But there is no problem in Martin needing those screens to get open, the problem is, that it is easier to the opposite team to deny the ball to him, when you have guys like Hayes or Battier on the floor (specially Battier).

In my mind, if you don´t have a closer, that can dominate the ball and create, you can still be effective in ending game offensive execution. What you need is more then one option, and right now, we don´t have that, and one of the reasons is the fact that Battier can´t do much more than spot up shoot. If the defense can "ignore" just one of our players, all the other 4 will have alot of trouble doing anything. If you don´t have THE guy, you need a very balanced team, to keep the defense on their toes.

Granger would not be THAT guy, but he would be a guy that would help Martin and the team, to execute late in the game, just by his presence on the floor, even if he doesn´t move, because you can´t let this man open, because he will shoot it, and if it is wide open, it is going in.

Discussing if we need more Nene or Granger is not that relevant, simply because if Morey trades for Granger, we would still be out there looking for a center, and if we get Nene, I think he would still look for an upgrade at the SF spot, and we don´t know who those players are so...... We need to upgrade both positions so no doubt as active as Morey is, he will look for upgrades regardless.

(I have a feeling we are going hard after Greg Olden in FA if we don´t get trades going before the deadline)

PeAcE

 

Lakers Receive - Carmelo Anthony
Rockets Receive - Ron Artest and Nene
Denver Receives - Andrew Bynum, Jordan Hill, Yao Ming, Devin Ebanks, Rockets 1st rounder 2011.


Indiana Receives - Aaron Brooks, Jared Jeffries, Shane Battier
Rockets Receives - Danny Granger, Solomon Jones

Lowry/Williams/Smith
Martin/Lee/Budinger
Granger/Artest/Budinger
Scola/Patterson/Hayes
Nene/Miller/Hayes

 

Some of these teams are close to the playoffs but that will be even more defined in a couple weeks. Milwaukee is not making the playoffs in the East. They may not break it down.....but they should.

Charlotte has currently moved into playoff contention as has Indiana. But both are not likely to make it. Two weeks will better define this.

Philly, if they could get rid of Brand's deal, would probably still do a deal. They're not winning with that mix and if they could dump Brand, I am convinced they'd trade Brand, Iggy, and something else of value to expedite a rebuild.

If Indy sees that they are not going to be in the playoff mix, if Charlotte pulls ahead of them substantially, don't be surprised if they fold their cards and start over.

Detroit.........they're making money...........and losing games. They're going nowhere with that mix of contracts. You know it, I know it, Dumars knows it. So, do you think Dumars is going to sit there for another three years and do nothing? Dude, he was turning handstands in the bathroom at the thought of getting rid of RIP for an expiring.

 

All I'm saying and you kinda proved it for me, all the teams who are supposed to be sellers are in the playoff hunt Charlotte,Indy,and Phiily are close enough and will be 2 weeks from now they're looking to upgrade vs downgrade. Those teams are closer to the playoffs than the rockets are. I'm sure some of those team are willing to dump the higher paid,non producing players, but they're not giving up their top talent.

Philly would like to dump brand, but they're like 8 games over .500 since that horrendous start. They will dump brand, but its not like they're going to give up holiday,evans, or the ga tech kid just to dump brand.

Dumars would love to get rid of Villanueva and rip, especially rip, but he's not giving up monroe or daye to dump rip.

Indy is and will listen to offers for granger, but they're also looking to add a 4 man. Since the coaching change, they're in the hunt and have 3 very attractive expiring contracts in foster,ford,and dunleavy.

The bucks arent in it, but that doesnt mean they will cough up bogut or jennings to get rid of maggette or salmons.

All those teams excepts the bucks are going to be in the playoff push going forward. Now if those teams go on a big time losing streak, something might change and even then they will still be within an earshot of the playoffs. Thats gold for owners.

 

Let me chime in on the granger thing with long time fan. I agree with most of what he says about granger. Granger is a good player, but he has a magnetis attraction to the 3 pt line. Since his breakout season 3 yrs ago, he's been on a slow,steady decline. Addd to the fact that he is alot like martin only further the fact he's just another guy.

He's not as effecient as marttin, but he's kinda in the same mold as an offensive player. He's a short dribble guy on the perimeter. If he has to take more than 3 dribbles, he's not doing anything with the ball. Also what LTF said about him not being a closer is true also.He can generate a late shot a little better than martin,but its not by a wide margin. This leads back into the crux of the rockets problem.

They are in danger of collecting alot of good players and tying up alot of money and not going anywhere. When a team starts collecting these 11-12m players who cant close games and are just good,not high end players, you wind up in the middle. This is where the rockets are right now and it seems in the future. Martin and scola, the 2 most consistent players are probably 2/3/4 type of options on championship caliber teams. Their overral impact isnt as good as the stats indicate on a nightly basis. Granger fits into that same mold. If he were as good as people think, how come his team have never been above .500?

 

Adrian Wojnarowski
[rquoter]After winning seven of their first nine games under interim coach Frank Vogel, the Indiana Pacers have backed away from the trade market and are no longer aggressively looking to shake up their roster, sources said. Indiana previously had been willing to listen to offers for Danny Granger[/rquoter]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A0wNddICxFtNcA0A1gm8vLYF?slug=aw-anthonynuggets021511

 

The thing about Granger is he can play at a high level till his mid thirties if he wanted to. He can run off screens and be a really good jump shooter. He doesn't rely on his athleticism too much which is great.

The Pacers wont trade him this year though

 

I cansee why they are willing to part with Granger. I've watched him the last month and hr is not worth the contract he has.

He's not aggressive. He doesn't play defense and is in love with the 3 point line and takes horrible ones. Pass.

 

I believe Granger is in another K-Mart situation like in Sacramento last year..George is waiting in the wings...but after watching his game against the Heat, he's not the "star" we're looking for.

 

It was pretty obvious the Pacers weren't going to trade Granger this season. They really had no reason to.

But seriously, some of you guys are incredibly picky. Everyone says the Rockets need to upgrade the SF position and yet some of you guys say pass to Granger?

My goodness.