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[ClutchFans] Houston Rockets Salary Cap Update

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by BimaThug, Jan 5, 2015.

  1. joesr

    joesr Member

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    If the options were picked up (playing a fourth year) I am pretty sure they become URFA. Declining the option is when you get the matching benefit..... (HENCE PARSONS)
     
  2. BimaThug

    BimaThug Resident Capologist
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    Nope. First round picks playing on rookie scale contracts whose fourth year options are picked up become restricted free agents following their fourth year (so long as the necessary qualifying offer is extended).

    Parsons was a second round pick, so his restricted free agency was subject to different rules.
     
  3. try

    try Member

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    No. There is a special set of rules for the contracts of first round picks (Jones, Motiejunas). The structure of the contract you can offer to your first round picks is pretty much set (2 years guaranteed, next two years are team options; plus, there is a salary scale and you can exceed the cap to sign the rookie). If one of the option years is declined, the player becomes an UFA (e.g. Jordan Hamilton who was on the Rockets last year).
    Source

    For second round picks like Parsons, these special rules don't apply. Non-first-round-picks have to have been in the NBA for three or less years in order to become a RFA. That's why he was a RFA last summer and would have been an UFA next summer after his fourth year.
    If you're confused about the Parsons contract, I recommend this excellent piece on that situation by BimaThug.
     
  4. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    So basically the whole non-sense that you heard from "certain posters" about how Morey needed to trade Jones & D-Mo because they would lose them in free agency is non-sense. If you've heard people saying since Nov of 2013 that Morey needs to trade Jones & D-Mo its because that poster just wants to trade Jones & D-Mo.

    Next year is going to really be the bargain year for both players in their contract season. I would expect both to be kept around unless there is a true superstar player they need to get, and those are few and far between nowadays.

    The nice thing about the year both Jones and D-Mo hit RFA is that its the same year that the cap is most likely looking to take a huge jump up from the TV money, and you are going to see half the NBA in free agency this year to try and take advantage of it.

    -Lebron James
    -Kevin Durant
    -Anthony Davis (if he doesn't take an extension from NOLA)
    -Dwight
    -etc.

    All could be in free agency that summer to take advantage of the new money coming in. D-Mo and Jones could be pretty far down the list of top targets, and that could really benefit the Rockets in RFA to get a team friendly deal for both players.
     
  5. BimaThug

    BimaThug Resident Capologist
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    Actually, I think the opposite might be true.

    Most teams will have a tremendous amount of cap room to spend, yet the top free agents can each only go to one team. Most teams will be left without their top target, flush with cap space and desperate to avoid leaving free agency empty-handed. That's how guys like Carlos Boozer, David Lee and Amare Stoudemire end up with ludicrous contracts.

    If D-Mo and Jones both have really good years next season, look for at least one other team to throw a boatload of money their way. I do not envision a scenario in which the Rockets keep both beyond 2016 unless one/both have a somewhat underwhelming season in 2015-16.
     
  6. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    I think it all comes down to supply and demand, but the supply of good available players need to actually be available and not fake available like Melo this past Summer. Where the Rockets would get in trouble would be if you see a scenario where teams that really don't have a shot at a max free agent, clear space to try and get one of these guys, and get stuck shelling out big bucks for a guy like Jones or D-Mo. The non big market teams seem to be getting smarter about their free agent targets, but who knows. That can change, and new owners like Vivek never cease to surprise.

    I guess I look at that long list that is sure to grow even more if players this year take 1 year deals, and I see a major timing issue hitting the middle class that year. The money is going to get held up if guys like KD, Lebron, etc. can't make their decisions in the first couple days, and some of the middle class guys jump on deals because they don't want to take the risk. Kind of the same thing you saw Lowry do early in FA this year.

    I also don't yet subscribe to the theory that the Rockets can't have both guys long term even if they are both quality players that attract attention in FA. Maybe that will change if I see that both guys could be at risk of getting a Chandler Parsons type of deal, but right now I really have a hard time seeing it. I think the Parsons contract was more or less person and an isolated incident due to Morey & Cuban's little smart guy beef.

    I guess time will tell. Right now, the Rockets really don't HAVE TO trade either guy until Feb of 2016 though if they are that concerned about keeping them in FA. IMO they should try and take advantage of another bargain year next year.
     
  7. micah1j

    micah1j Member

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    The issue with D-Mo and T. Jones is if they are still on the team come next Oct, which I certainly hope they are, that Oct 31st is the deadline to sign an extension with them before they are forced into RFA come July 1st. This was the same time we got James harden from OKC. Do you extend 1 and not the other? Do you try an extend both? Do you roll the dice and not extend either? My guess if you do not extend either that teams far and wide will go after both in RFA. Do you trade one during the season? Can you afford to sign both to extensions? What are young PFs with 12/6 - 14/7 worth? Got to be at least 8 million right? Maybe 10 million with the new cap or a RFA overpay like Parsons. From the Rockets point over view you try and extend both to reasonable amounts. Alot will depend on what happens with RFA in 2015: Jimmy Butler, Reggie Jackson, Kawhi Leonard, Tobias Harris, Tristan Thompson and our own Patrick Beverley
     
  8. joesr

    joesr Member

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    THXS!!!!
     
  9. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Extensions typically turn out to be the best contracts over time. Some look bad initially, but over time the value as player salaries increase over time, against the market values they typically hold their own well.

    If Morey was going to extend one, I'd think he might extend both. Just at different levels depending on who was getting his vote of confidence as the starter moving forward.

    I think the Morris twins salary scale (8 mil per for starter & 5 mil per for backup) would be a very team friendly number to shoot for (although it might be slightly more even for each). Most likely Jones getting the Marcus Morris lower figure if he's viewed as the #1 reserve, and coming off of a injury plagued season.

    As the cap goes up, 8 Mil a year for an even more improved D-Mo, or 5 mil a year for an improved Jones could be excellent value in the future.

    Of course, nowadays it seems like EVERYONE thinks they are a max player. If that's the case, then an extension doesn't get done and you have the option to bring them back or not in RFA, or trade one of them by February beforehand.

    I'm really not that concerned about them being retained. If they aren't retained its probably for a really, really good reason.
     
  10. emcitymisfit

    emcitymisfit Member

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    Dmo is not getting less than 10, probably significantly more with the rI sing cap. If morey can lock up 4 yrs 48 that will be insane value.
     
  11. basketballholic

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    Whowwwww!

    That means Jones will for sure get a max deal! Because he's better than DMo you know. Jones shoots 72% at the rim and DMo only shoots 62% at the rim.

    Signed,

    'Certain posters'
     
    #71 basketballholic, Jan 13, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2015
  12. DaDakota

    DaDakota Contributing Member

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    I love these Bima - keep it up, also a request to add a podcast discussing big articles like this...

    Yes, I know...it takes time...but a fella can ask...

    DD
     
  13. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Lets's take a look at market comps from last year: (there isn't that many)

    -Patrick Patterson - 3 years/ 18.2 mil (6.06 per)
    -Gortat - 5 years/60 mil (12 per)
    -Diaw- 3 yr/22 mil (7.3 per)
    -Faried - 4 yr/50 mil (12.5 per)
    -M. Williams - 2 yr/14 mil (7 per)
    -Markieff Morris - 4yr/ 32 mil (8 per)
    -C. Frye - 4yr/32 mil (8 per)
    -N. Vucevic - 4yr/53 mil (13.25 per)

    If you average out all of those ranges of salaries you come up with 9.27 million per year.

    4/48 seems a bit high when the highest comp around from last year, Vucevic, is only make 1 mil more a year.

    Of course, this next year brings a whole new set of comps so we'll have to revisit. However, if D-Mo was hitting free agency today, it would be hard to see him getting more than the 4yrs/40 mil. You'd essentially be banking on future improvement to semi-star level. Not sure he's there yet outside of Houston.
     
  14. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Boy you really showed those "certain posters". I feel so embarrassed.

    FYI, nobody half-way smart ever said "Jones is better than D-Mo", "keep this guy, s#$% on the other guy" nonsense that you resort to. It has never really been like that for any one other than you and Cxbby. I think most folks are really just Rockets fans who root for everyone to do well. Favoritism happens, but nobody takes painting "enemies from within the gates" quite like you do.

    The only point that halfway smart people tried to make to you (and failed miserably) was that Jones was the clear cut starter last year over D-Mo. He clearly played better in his second season. D-Mo is currently playing better (and is healthy) in his 3rd season. If you say he wasn't then your completely full of crap.

    That doesn't mean people don't love D-Mo and that he hasn't had a whale of a season in terms of improvement and consistency. And the most important factor (the fact that Jones has been injured basically the entire season) shows that you simply have no shame in exposing your nonsensical opinions that turn into campaigns.

    I hope that Jones has a great comeback from injury not because I have some bologna Pick-Em, Pay-Em game going on where I pick my guy and if he wins I win, but because I'm a Rockets fan and I actually want ALL of the young players to grow and do well.

    And please don't all the sudden act like you are the one that anointed D-Mo (actually that might be DD). Lets go back to November of 2013 when you and Cxbby started your rant about how Jones AND D-Mo should be traded immediately because they were out of the rotation in the first 5 games of the season of their 2nd year in the league, and they should be traded because their trade value was about to decline drastically to zilch.

    Signed,

    "Certain Poster"
     
    #74 dobro1229, Jan 13, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2015
    1 person likes this.
  15. Tuk88

    Tuk88 Contributing Member

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    When Josh Smith signs a new contract for 2015 and beyond, is any of that subtracted from what the Pistons owe him? I know the amnesty deal worked that way, and one would think that would be only fair, but I'm guessing he's going to getting paid the equivalent of TWO salaries over the next two years? If that's the case, here's hoping he does the right thing.
     
  16. Mr. Dominant

    Mr. Dominant Contributing Member

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    Salary cap update.... any way we can get this guy to play for us?

    [​IMG]
     
  17. jbasket

    jbasket Member

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    I'm conflicted.

    I think it is not a good bump because it is completely irrelevant.

    But at the same time, it is JJ Watt in a Rockets uniform. I mean, JJ Watt anything is a fantastic bump :p
     
  18. joshuaao

    joshuaao Member

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    My dream scenario is that we go into 2016 with max cap space (and small cap holds for Jones and DMo), sign a top-tier FA with this cap space, and then sign one or both of them afterwards.
     

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