ClutchFans Game Thread: Rockets @ Spurs 10/26/2007 (PRESEASON)

Man tmac's legs really are like chicken legs.

I wonder if he used to put on those sleeves to cover his skinny legs? haha, coz it sure felt like it wasn't this skinny.

I am analyzing tmac's legs....

 

I'm going to assume most of the Rockets negatives (and Spurs positives) can be attributed to a concern over injuries before the opener, given the regular rotation was in. It felt as though no physical aggressiveness on both ends was allowed. Also, Scola was likely nervous about starting, especially against the defending champs.

 

If we are making comparisons, I see Mike James as our Bobby Jackson.

Add Bonzi and Francis (who looked lost during pre-season but should find a niche at some point) and we have three 6th man type of players. That is true depth.

 

Hey guys did Chuck play ok last night? I haven't seen the game...just looked at the stats.

 

Based on the preseason games, it seems they want him to play in the high post at least half the time, and they seem to have gotten rid of the post/repost/triple post which was so helpful for Yao to get good position. Now if Yao passes it back out, he doesn't see it again, if he even gets the ball at all, which seems to be a problem since the team looks allergic to feeding him in the post. 2/3 is not enough. He needs it down there 80-90% of the time, and he needs to get the posting and reposting back.

Divac/Miller were decent players, but compared to Yao they are stiffs capable of nothing but shooting jumpers and a few nice passes a game. The defense seemed perfectly willing to let them shoot on most games. Honestly, I have heard their names way too much over the last 3 months and don't want to ever hear about them again in conjunction with Yao.

Honestly I'd rather not put Yao at the high post at all. It's simply not a good use of his skills. JVG was absolutely right when he said outside of 10 feet Yao is very average. Why put Yao in a position to fail? It would be like saying, "Tracy, go take a few halfcourt treys a game." He could probably make the shot on occasion, but it's terrible offense and putting him in a position to fail.

 

Yes he did.

 

Sorry he played but did he play well? Let me think. I don't remember any play with him. Just normal

 

If Yao is kept on being treated like this (no focus on his low post game) and Rox are not winning before the allstar, I would expect either a forced trade from Yao or coach A out.

This game is basically unwatchable. The even worse part is that it didn't indicate any positive sign for the coming regular season. Yao was like a stiff in the high post and the whole offsence was stagnant. The only thing left was TMac's one-on-one iso since the lane was wide open. But nobody else could do this. The reason we braught in Ralfer, Shane, was because they are good at getting the ball to Yao in the deep position not for their ability to attacking the rim. Coach A's system only takes Yao's strongest part of his game away.

On the defensive end, it's even worse. As a fan a JVG, that kind of lousy and lazy rotation cover is unacceptable. Yes, Spurs did hit many jumpers, but most of them were WIDE OPEN without any contest. Our championship dream is really in jeopardy. Loose defenese plus disjointed offsense won't bring any team to anywhere promising. Rox now look like a bottom line playoff team in the west. Nothing more.

Our only hope is coach A has learned things from this game and makes his adjustment. His system in Kings and Portland doesn't work for this squad, especially for Yao. Yao is about to be the next dominant big man in this league and having him play like Divac or Miller is totally a joke.

Somebody might say this is only a preseason game but again this is also the last game before the regular season opener and the 6th game this team play together. I haven't seen any improvement in both end since the first game. Actually the defense looks like even getting worse. And I never saw coach A tried any set play for Yao. As long as Yao was fronted, the effort for low post play was over.

The only positive thing happened during these preseason games was Bonzi's play. His game became very solid again and he's in incredible shape. Had he played like this, we would have beat Utah in 6 in the last playoff purely due to his contribution off the bench.

With this roster, we are at least a solid contender on paper. I hope coach A can finally realize where is Yao's territory. By the way, please don't start Mike James as the point guard, which is gonna be the disarster for this team.

 

Very well put, and I agree 100%.

2/3 of the time in the low post is NOT enough. It should be at least 80%. I'd like to see 100%, but with Adelman as coach that's not going to happen.

Honestly, if you're going to complain about JVG putting Spanoulis, Snyder, and Alston in positions to fail, then what do you have to say about Adelman putting Yao in a position to fail? Yao is more important to the team than all of those scrubs put together. I never wanted Adelman hired at all and if he doesn't adjust I want him fired.

 

You know when Yao is less than average? When he's so tired he can't fight good position under the basket, or when smaller, quicker defenders front him.

If Tracy attempted half court shots, not only is that extremely low percentage, it's not getting anyone else on the team involved in the offense. Putting Yao in the high post has the exact opposite effect. It gets more players on the team involved, and generally results in high percentage shots if run well.

 

When smaller quicker defenders front him there is also backside help, otherwise the Rockets could just lob. That means someone has an open shot and/or McGrady has single coverage. The Suns game late in the year was a perfect example of this. The Suns were doubling Yao off the ball and letting Marion guarding McGrady 1v1, and McGrady went off, so they went back to a more traditional defense, and Yao carved them up in the 4th quarter. The fronting issue is overblown; it is an overcompensating defense designed to allow someone else to get an open shot, and if that guy is making the open shot the fronting will go away.

I think Yao's fatigue issues in the playoffs were from the fact that he wasn't really in shape after the knee injury.

All I saw yesterday from the high post was Yao handing off to a guard, maybe setting a scren, and then the guard jacking up a contested 20 footer i.e the most inefficient way of scoring possible. I didn't see open cutters at all. It's not that hard to stick with your cutters or bump them off their cuts if you don't have to worry about helping on the ballhandler.

 

Yao can stay in the elbow area only when
1. he is tired so he can take a rest and let Tracy, Bonzi, Shane or KJ penetrate/post up in the lane. This will make the game more balanced;
2. sometimes maybe in early of a game, after Yao have established himself download for a couple of plays, he might go out and try to get his teammate involved in the offsensive.

I think JVG hasn't done well in these two regards. As a result, Yao is always overused and Ralfer/Shane seems like forgetting to cut and become only a spot jumper shooter.

 

What about Golden State at the end of the season? Yao couldn't get any good shots on them, and they were guarding him with midgets.

It's not just fronting defenses either. Smaller players who play behind him also really bother him if they are active. And if you still haven't addressed the fact that Yao's effectiveness dropped significantly in the second and fourth quarters in general, because opposing defenses adjusted to how he was playing and he got tired from all the banging. The fourth quarter, in particular, it became more and more difficult to get him the ball in good position around the basket.

You didn't see many open cutters, because the Rockets didn't play well. It doesn't all fall on Yao; all the other four players on the court need to work in concert to keep the defense off balance and draw help defenders away from the cutters. They're still working on getting that timing down.

San Antonio is a good defensive team. The Rockets are still developing chemistry with a new offensive system. To look at one or two preseason games and draw your conclusion that the offense flat out won't work (when its been proven to work very well in the past) is simply short-sighted.

 

McGrady was "injured" in that game. Shane shot 3/11 from 3pt and Rafer shot 4/9. This wasn't good enough to compensate, even though Luther shot well.

If smaller players play behind him, they don't bother him. They'll try to steal the entry pass, but that's about all they can do if they play behind him. If they don't get the steal, Yao has a dunk.

I didn't say run every play for Yao. That's what McGrady is there for. Runs isos for him and pick and rolls for both. As I said Yao had very poor conditioning after the knee injury. He was fine before the knee injury.

The offense worked in the past for Sacto because Miller and Divac are better passers than Yao, and Miller and Divac were content to stand around the perimeter and shoot jumpers from kickout passes. It seems pretty obvious with the way we are trying to run the offense from the high post, if we see a legitimate team it won't work. That's not how you want to run an offense.

 

Sadly no. Yao didn't come into the league wanting to be a 7-foot point guard...

 

yes this is all through 6 preseason games. our D will be great (top 5 easily). we have good defenders. even jon feign noted that maybe it's not the reg. season so the intensity is not there. our defense in the first 2 preseason games were PHENOMENAL and it got worse. the only explanation is getting tired of the preseason.

yao will be in the low post 80% of the time at least. he got 14 low post touches out of his 25 v. the spurs and adelman said it is WAY WAY too low. i expect that to change.

we all thought yao got some skills on the outside, apparently not good enough. adelman recognizes that now.

relax.

 

How do u figure we are top 5 in D easily? Even Aldeman said in the interview after Spurs game that our D is just not there. Spurs shot 55% from the field. And that's what you call top 5 D in the league?

 

ok, u base that one game so how do u know they won't?

how do i know? defense is effort. and these guys, esp. tmac, battier, yao, hayes, and alston will retain that defensive strategies/effort from JVG. they know and i know JVG is a great defensive coach.

we were just a step slow last night. we shut down the paint, which was what jvg usually does. we gave up some open shots b/c we were slow to close out. and they made some tough shots.

it's all about effort. the defensive strategies are similar to JVG. that's why i think they'll still be top 5.

plus, adelman's kings and blazers team during their best years were always top 5 in defensive efficiency. so he does know the importance of defense.

 

Maybe not top 5 but we can defend well - it NEEDS TIME. We sucked defensivly and offensivly against Spurs and remember they were on fire, makin' unbelivable shoots. We should have lost this game by at least 20 points.

But we have new, healthly team. Do not expect Adelman to be JVG on defense. He'll be JVG on offense. No offense killed us against Utah

 

JVG - average sometimes pathetic offense - always superb defense

adelman - always superb offense (even when shoot bad still get pts b/c of more possessions) - very good to potentially great defense

now which is more balanced? i think our D will get near the level under JVG b/c our main guys are guys under JVG so they understand the importance of D.