ClutchCity.net Game Thread: Rockets @ Knicks 2/25/2003

Right now, Yao's just not a very good 1 on 1 player. You really need quickness or a great shot to be that type of player.

Yao's lateral quickness is an oxymoron. Although he's not a slow runner, he plods along in the paint.

If someone makes a quick double team against him while he's making his move, he can't react fast enough to pass out of it - especially if the closest teammate is halfway across the court.

He needs to work on his quickness, upper body strength, and a simple bump to the shoulder before making his move.

Once his quickness improves he can face the basket and drive. His outside shot could also improve if he didnt have to do that turnaround.

Not bad for a 22 year old rookie. But definitely areas for improvement.

 

Don't know where that came from, I was really asking...

 

I respectfully disagree REIT. Let me tell you what I think of Yao's assets and then why I have some trouble I with your thesis.

First off, I think Yao's foot work and quickness is just fine for his size. There are many forms of quickness. For big guys, the best quickness is "pivot" speed. With long legs, it's easy for them to cover 3, 4 ,5 feet of distance to get to the hole with one simple pivot. On this note, I think Yao will be unstoppable. Tonite, we got a taste of his nifty spinmove into the baseline for dunks. There's no reason why:
1) it can't be done, rolling the other way, into a hook or jumper
2) it can't be "sped" up by making a decisive move upon receiving the entry past
3) it can't be used while "rolling" even MORE aggressively into/off the defender who will most likely be liable for a foul (i.e. no defensive position)

The double that hurt him result from Yao putting the ball on the floor for TOO LONG. The long dribbles and patient backing down worked well for the Barkey's of the world. But to qualify for consistent success you need either:
1) a big a$$ or
2) great court awareness

I think Yao can develop both

As to your theory about more Yao needing more quickness, more girth, and if i understand you correctly, that first "bump" off a move... I agree with number 3 only. The quickness thing should be taken in context of how he's built. Quite frankly, I don't know many 7 footers who are all that "quick" in terms of sheer speed. Hakeem was an exception, but even HE was really one for quick pivots and arm motions than anything. Yao does a more than decent job motoring up and down the court. As to girth, I think this is THE BIGGEST MISTAKE Western style BBALL could do to Yao.

Like anything else, the body is all about balance. Add more muscle, and you will probably "slow down" some. Moreover, that added weight is also added pressure on the joints and knees. On this note, I sincerely feel sorry for Shaq, for whom I think is TOO BIG for his own good. Those knee and toe problems can't possibly be helped by having over 250 lbs - 300 lbs (depending where you start to measure) weighing on them.

I don't want to see Yao developing knee and joint and back problems at the age of 25. That would be a travesty and one associated with the modern Western myth.

BIGGER IS NOT NECESSARILY BETTER


IMHO



thinkinSAGE

 

The Rockets panic again at the end of a close game...they have only one player worthy of trust, and the other team will not let him beat them.....Yao is the only player that does not panic.

The other team knows this and forces him to give it up...the rest of the Rocks choke for some reason.

How many 1 foot shots did Steve and Cat miss...unbelievable.

DD

 

If poise is what we're calling for, then XO is the answer.

RudyT forgot to break out the XO in the 4th... w/o it we're just a bunch of nervous wrecks.



theSAGE

 

Gutsy performance by Steve and Yao. Can't blame the loss on either one of them. Both of them play with injury down the stretch ( with Steve nursing a bad back and Yao nursing an elbow injury). We lost mainly because the Knicks can't missed down the stretch making something like 11 of 12 Fg or something like that. When the game is close and they hit 11 out of 12 shots they deserve to win the game. They happen to get hot at the end of the game like we did last night against Boston. Those two turnsovers at the end of the game by Yao are just tough luck. On one of those turnovers where Thomas reach around Yao and knock the ball away, Bill Worrell was saying Yao was clearly got foul but no call was made. If that the case then it's not his fault. If the foul was call then Yao would shoot two free throws and it would be a four point turn around for the Rockets. The other turnover was a force turnover in which Sprewell took a chance and steal the ball. Again when a player reaching in and swipe at the ball he is taking a chance that a foul also might be call. That time he got it cleanly so the gamble paid off. So, I wouldn't blame Yao for losing the ball game for us because of those two turnovers. He did play great in the first half that result in Houston getting the lead and he did score some key baskets down the stretch. On the defensive end, I agree that Posey should of beem in the game instead of Rice. Clearly, Rice is in there only for one purpose and that is shooting the ball. If they don't get him the ball then he is a defensive liability at the other end. But as I said before the Knicks deserve to win down the stretch because they execute well and hit all those clutch shots. Overall it was an entertaining game.

 

It may be easier to cover 3 or 4 feet but the paint isnt that wide and he wont have that advanatge to make sweeping moves without getting double-teamed from a defender unless he moves quicker and is more decisive.

The reason he dribbles so long is because he's having a hard time moving the defender. They just start pushing hard on his back.

Also, this is why he falls down. he has to exert so much force, when it's taken away, he's just helpless. A little less pushing and a little more quickness could alleviate that.

Shaq is incredibly quick for his size. It's his rare combination of quickness and strength that makes him unstoppable. The misconception is it's pure strength. It's not. He's incredibly quick.

I agree that a lot of big men have foot problems.

Yao is vertically challenged and cant really jump so it should save him some wear and tear on his knees. However, he does seem to have really strong legs.

As far as strength. He needs to get stronger. One reason people can take the ball away from is because he lacks upper body strngth.

If he gets stronger, He'll be able to get more rebounds and finish with authority.

If we expect him to carry us to a championship, he needs to be able to play with contact. You need upper body strength for that.

 

If there is ONE COMPLAINT I have of tonite's game, it has to do with how the Rox played in the third quarter. I think they entered halftime with a 6 point lead but entered the 4th down one. Well anyways, by my recollection the Knicks were in the penalty very early in the 3rd... early enough for our Rox to either:

1) get more fouls on Thomas and Doleac - both of whom I think were flirting with foul trouble.
2) get to the stripe for more FTs **** very key, IMO
3) slow the game down when the Knicks were making their run

The Rox, thanks to Yao, Cat, and SF, have a consistent way of getting the opposing team in early foul trouble. Case in point, tonite's Knicks. Yet the Rox really don't milk the free throw line as much as I'd like them to.

I'm not all too fond of speculation but I'll make an exception here. Think about it for a second. If Thomas HAD picked up an early 4th or 5th foul in the 3rd, what then could the Knicks do defensively on Yao??? No Thomas, no 4th quarter "charge calls against the Rox" and no "steal off Yao." Meanwhile, Doleac was also in foul trouble in my recollection and was the reason we lost an earlier meeting against the Knicks in Houston. Between SF' driving and Cat's driving and Yao's posting, the Knicks and other teams, accumulate fouls damn fast.

As a team, though I don't know where we stand, I consider us a pretty damn good free throw shooting time. Heck, if the average Rock is shooting 70% FT across two shots vs. 45% for a 2-pt field goal, doesn't it make sense to milk the FT line whenever possible??? I don't know why this hasn't sunk into the Rox yet. They could have such a field day with so many teams by systematically getting the opposing teams "key defenders" into foul trouble. This is esp true for any opposing centers thrown at Yao.

All through the nite, the Knicks broadcasters talked abuot how timid the Knicks were in attacking the Rox hoop and getting fouls on Yao. Yet if there is one area of improvement that is rarely highlighted this season, it's Yao's improved ability to STAY OUT OF FOUL TROUBLE. Moreover, he's had a knack of getting his own DEFENDER in serious foul trouble. These kinds of knick-knacks (no pun intended) should be used to our advantage. If you look at recent fouls for vs. against, I think you'll see what I mean. Moreover, this is something I think we could do every nite against our opponents. Why the Rox don't do it more is beyond me.

With a little XO, everything becomes clear...
Foul'em out one by one



theSAGE

 

Key moments in tonight's game:

Howard Eisley stole the ball from Mobley before hitting a 3 with 2:44 remaining to give the Knicks their first lead of the fourth quarter, 91-89. Yao answered with a three-point play, executing a nifty drop step move around Weatherspoon for a dunk.

After a missed 3 by Eisley, the Rockets tried to run the same play -- but Sprewell sneaked inside and swatted the ball away before pulling up for a 3-pointer that gave New York a 94-92 lead with 1:50 left.

``Once I got the steal, guys were playing off me, and I told myself this was do-or-die and I'm going to live with the results on this one. So I just let it go,'' Sprewell said.

Yao answered with a short jumper, but he didn't leave his feet at the other end to try to block Weatherspoon's 4-footer that gave New York the lead for good.

Thomas had his most significant defensive play of the night on the next possession, deflecting the ball away from Yao in the low post. It led to a 14-footer by Sprewell for a four-point lead.


source: espn.com Rockets-Knicks recap

While Yao's two turnovers down the final stretch keyed the Knicks win, the Rockets had their chances. So I'm not one to put the loss all on him. He is partly @ fault, but we (the Rockets) aren't even in the position to win if Yao doesn't make some huge baskets down the stretch.

With that said, what I don't like from some of you is all the passafying of Yao whenever he is @ fault. A lot of you are quick to point out that it was TEAM loss and Yao was not the only player @ fault. While this is true, I would advise many of you to follow that way of thinking when wanting to blame Steve Francis or Cuttion Mobley ENTIRELY for a TEAM loss. Some of you Yao fans can't have your cake and eat it too.; it cuts both ways. It's called a double-standard, no?

All in all, it was a good game -- wish the Rox pulled it out. Yao was great, Mobley had a real nice first half and Francis (19 points, 12 rebounds, 4 assist) is being a gamer out there!

GO ROX!!!

 

pacifying**

 

stronger is the best in the nba.. there is a difference... and as far as him being bigger i would say maybe about 10-20 more lbs of muscle would be good... so that would be about 315-325 lb worth of strong enough to play nba ball.

but he does need to protect the ball a lot better.

 

WHOA!!!

Could it be, that there is such a thing as an ANTI-Yao-only fan???

ahhhhhh... Freedom of expression... ya gotta love this bbs!!!



theSAGE

 

nothing serious,we still have future

 

Yao took responsibility for his turnovers! Were that our other players as quick to own responsibility for their mistakes.

Even though we lost, I thought that offensively it was one of our best games all year. Except for the turnovers, we actually looked as though we had a system in place and all the players were participating in it!! What a concept.

Unfortunately, our turnovers (19) and our lack of defense in the second half cost us the game. I do think that Rudy should have used someone besides Rice to guard the perimeter shooters and that he could have made an adustment to shut down the penetrations they were getting right down the middle of the lane which caused Yao to have to abandon the center to help out.

Still, it was a good game to watch. I think we will win in Washington and still be on a roll when we get back home for San Antonio. Hell, I think we might even be able to catch Utah!!

 

Uh no. I think his point has some validity. Most losses are team losses and no one should blame one player.

And Steve Francis was unbelievably gutsy tonight.

And yes there are the Anti-Yao only fans (actually a lot).

 

how could I insert Image, anyone tell me

 

Well Yao need to learn that he won't get a call from the ref at the end of the game and be really careful with his ball.

 

The mere fact that we have a "go to" rookie should tell you something.

He's a bad-ass!