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Climate Change

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by ItsMyFault, Nov 9, 2016.

  1. ItsMyFault

    ItsMyFault Contributing Member

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    I know this issue was hardly brought up in this election, and I know neither candidate really put it as a big issue (although Hillary somewhat addressed it more) on their agenda. Now that we have elected a president, I'm just curious to get some thoughts on how the next 4 years are going to be in regards to this issue. We already know what Trump's stance is on this issue, and I was reading an article earlier this morning about what kind of impact Trump's presidency could have on climate change for at least the next 4 years. I still remain hopeful though that Trump will change his stance on this issue and do something greater than Obama did to help the planet.

    Couldn't post the full article so the link is below.

    There’s no way around it: Donald Trump is going to be a disaster for the planet
     
  2. SamFisher

    SamFisher Virtuous

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    Yes, not really much to discuss.

    This might have been our last shot.

    But you can't give up on saving the damn planet, as horrifying as today is.
     
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  3. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    WOLF!!!!!!!!!!

    No, seriously this time

    WOLF!!!!!!!!!!
     
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  4. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    More or less agree. Not only will he gut US environmental efforts to get some incremental business advantage, he'll force other countries into also sacrificing their environmental efforts in an attempt to compete with the US on price.
     
  5. txtony

    txtony Member

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    I have a wait and see attitude regarding this.
     
  6. B-Bob

    B-Bob my celli weighs a ton

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    Really?
    1. You have the party of climate denial in full power now. Why on Earth would they support the Paris Accord or next steps, at all? It's drill baby drill time for at least four years.
    2. Any compromise on our energy demands or energy sources will just strike Trump as a "bad deal." And he has actively said he thinks it's all a hoax. None of his inner circle takes climate or environmental concerns seriously.
    3. One of the many ways that the president elect seems to resonate with Russia is on climate. Russia has never liked all this hand-wringing on climate. A warming northland opens more shipping to them, and they're super dependent on an oil and gas economy to boot.

    The "wait and see" part, to me, is whether we still have an EPA in four years. The right wing of our political spectrum will treat this election as a complete mandate to do everything they want. Taking the Anthrocene seriously is not anywhere close to that agenda.
     
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  7. txtony

    txtony Member

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    The wait and see to me is all Trump. He isn't a Republican. He does his own thing. I know what he has said. I believe he can flip, as he so often does. I will wait to see what he really does.
     
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  8. seclusion

    seclusion rip chadwick
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    This is one of the things that concerns me most, and yet people don't care.

    "Wait and see", my oh my ignorance is bliss.
     
  9. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    On the Paris climate accords, Trump would be wise to forward that agreement to the US Senate for ratification as a treaty, which takes 67 votes. Needless to say, that will be the death of our involvement in that. But it would re-establish the balance of powers under the US Constitution for treaties that Obama undermined with the executive order he signed to get us into this.

    I will be at least somewhat surprised if he doesn't do this.
     
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  10. Rocketman1981

    Rocketman1981 Member

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    When the Democrats caved to the enviro-crazies, it was a pathway to failure.

    The greatest help to our planet has been technology and business efficiency leading to advancements in
    energy efficiency, computing and communications and such which make a cleaner and less waste and pollutant
    free world.

    A politicized EPA and government has been a job killer and the people have spoken.
     
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  11. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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  12. okierock

    okierock Contributing Member

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    No industry has had a greater positive impact on the amount of CO2 being created by man than the oil industry. The move from coal to natural gas for power generation has no peers when it comes to climate impacts.... and the oil industry has made natural gas amazingly cheap and abundant.

    Also, with oil and gas prices what they are drill baby drill ain't happening. Drilling technology improvements have created what is currently a state of abundance for oil and especially natural gas that should keep prices down and people looking for more was to use natural gas which should do nothing but help "climate change".

    Tell your favorite Exxon or Koch employee thanks when you get the chance.
     
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  13. B-Bob

    B-Bob my celli weighs a ton

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    1. I totally acknowledge that burning natural gas is contributing less CO2 to the atmosphere than burning oil or coal -- most definitely that has been moderate good news!

    In terms of "positive impact," it's kind of like arguing budget deficits, right? A liberal would point to how much Obama decreased the yearly budget deficit, while a conservative would say "but the national debt still grew like crazy!" Both are correct. Our CO2 is still growing pretty fast, on Earth, and the question is will we have a government that cares. For a few years, probably not much. But we'll see. I hope we can keep diversifying our energy portfolio and I hope to god the government supports research into things like cleaner jet fuels. Air travel is still pretty nasty for the atmosphere. (no chem trails reference intended).

    2. Well, let's not get out of hand here. :D
     
  14. ItsMyFault

    ItsMyFault Contributing Member

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    What climate change? - Donald Trump's rumored pick to head the EPA wants everyone to "love global warming"

    Wellp this can't be a good start if it's true.
     
  15. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    Partial solace: Though the EPA will report to Trump, a lot of their recent action to reduce CO2 is the result of court orders. In order to ditch the Clean Power Plan altogether, for example, the new EPA would have to issue an order with a scientific finding that CO2 is not a public health hazard. That shouldn't be too hard, but they'll be sued by just as many companies as when they ordered the CPP in the first place. More likely, they make some revisions to the CPP to lower targets and become very accommodating to whatever fulfillment plans the states offer. That will neuter the plan but keep it in place. However, states and energy companies will know that there's still risk the enforcement changes again after Trump. If a coal plant started looking economic to build again in the Trump Era, you still wouldn't build it because of the regulatory uncertainty. Would Illinois decide it's okay to let shutter their uneconomic nuclear plants because they won't need them after all for the CPP? Risky, because after Trump you might want them again and you'll need to build 4 CCGTs to replace the capacity of each nuke you retired -- or who knows how much acreage of solar. CO2 has a target on its back with or without Trump. It's going to be impossible for people in the energy business to assume it's not going to be a regulatory problem.
     
  16. Svpernaut

    Svpernaut Contributing Member

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    Climate change deniers might as well be up there with those who think the moon landings were fake, that the world is flat, or that the world is only thousands of years old. In the face of overwhelming evidence, they still choose to blindly follow ignorance.

    With that said, I don't think that global warming will be solved by governments, but the economy.
     
  17. Trader_Jorge

    Trader_Jorge King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    [Premium Post]
    Climate change efforts are dead. Myron Ebell will lead the EPA and will gut it. The Paris Accord will die a slow death by being totally ignored by the US. The Clean Power Plan will die. The EPA's overreaching efforts to use the Clean Water Act as a weapon will be significantly impaired. Obama's climate legacy will be snuffed out and defecated upon. The same global warming bedwetters who have insulted, mocked, and tried to drive the energy industry out of business over the last 8 years will cry themselves to sleep at night. And it will be GLORIOUS. Economic prosperity trumps the global warming fantasies each and every day in the eyes of voters. Hopefully, with Trump's new access to information as President, he can expose the fraud that is climate change. It will be hard to convince the ivory tower liberals that they have been conned by the entire climate change fraud, though. It's easy to con someone, much harder to convince someone that they've been conned.

    GOOD DAY
     
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  18. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost clean your room bucko
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    When a vast plurality of scientists say wolf, shut up and get your shotgun.

     
  19. pirc1

    pirc1 Contributing Member

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    If climate change is real, will be hosed down the line, hopefully in a century or more. If it is not true, great job mr. Trump, although I trusts the leading scientists in the field way more than I trust Trump, so we will see. Congratulations Republicans on ignoring the warnings, you win.
     
  20. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Yep 100% agree...you are a perfect example of that.
     

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