I've heard JVG say good things about him but always counters it with the high foul prone issue. TO me JVG does this keep young players hungry, always striving for more rare JVG praise. Juwon is already a veteran and JVG needs to assure him his work is appreciated and noticed. BUt Luther gets alot of JVG praise, mainly his 4th quarter big shot rep. Kinda puzzles me since Luther is like Hayes, still young pups. I'm guessing JVG knows his players and knows what certain psychological method will work on each player. On Hayes, 18 mil for 5 years is cheap considering that quality bigs who aren't wallflowers or lazy Cato types are hard to find. If Hayes was 3 inches taller this would be a moot point.
100% correct. Didn't we give Moochie Norris about 4.5 a year? Paying less than 4 mill a year for a player like Chuck is not crazy.
First I got to say that I wasnt too hyped about Chuckie when I first saw him but after watchin him for a while I have changed my mind. From what I see he is capable of much more than what he gives but he only gives what he is asked for. In other words he plays his role and then some. Dont forget this is only Chuckies second season so he has room to improve and I believe he will.
chucky hayes and Shane Battier are two of the most selfish players in the league this is especially important in our team since we need to take high% shots, and these guys ONLY take high% shots its very rare, even juwan tries to push his luck sometimes by attempting a low% shot just cuz he feels like it
You caught me. Well, I meant he will have a career like Haslem. It will be at least as good as Najera. Najera is making about $5 mil, next year. Najera can't even rebound Haslem is making over $6 mil, next year. He rebounds, so he gets $1 mil more. If we were to try and trade for a player similiar to Chuck, like Hayes or Najera, we would be paying for more than $3 mil each year. Short defensive PFs with no offense earn about $5-6 mil.
Since Yao's return, and Chucks' return to the starting lineup, his play has sky rocketed. He is the perfect role player next to Yao, hustles, does all the dirty work, doesn't demand the ball but somehow always manages to get open for the easy basket. Chuck Hayes is da man!
Hayes keeps giving me more than I expect of him, a little more each game. He does need to be more carefull using his fouls as he needs to be able to play longer minutes.Elevation of Game A+ He has turned out to be a very special role player and brings much needed energy into the game.
$3.5 million is not overpaying him now!!!! Look around at what other players are getting for crying out loud. Lorenzen Wright is getting $3 million a year. Drew Gooden is making $20 million over the next 3 years. Ira Newble is making over $3 million per year. Reggie Evans is owed over $23 million over the next 5 years! Nazr Mohammed, Tsakalidis, Michael Doleac, all junk players getting close to $3 million per. Udonis Haslem gets you 11 points and 8 boards while playing 31 minutes a night. 2/3 of of Haslem's salary. He's got over $19 million coming to him over the next 3 years. And $18 million over 5 years is unreasonable for Chuckie??? Whatever dude. Look, it really don't matter what you or I or anybody think he's worth. It's what the market will bear when he hits free agency. Look at what the market has done with some very poor to mediocre players. Chuck Hayes is severly underpaid right now. What you want to do is steal from him for another two years. I'll bet his agent is smarter than to let that happen. I am not going to list all the free agents who their teams wound up paying the price by not re-signing them. But I will mention just a couple obvious ones. 1. Steve Nash - Dallas fooled around and wouldn't extend him. They lost him altogether. Do you think they would have won the championship last year with him alongside Dirk and Howard???? Spin it any way you want to but not re-signing Nash cost Cuban at least one ring. 2. Chris Duhon - 2nd round draft pick, played his way onto the team and into the rotation in his rookie year. Instead of working a long term deal with Duhon, Chicago let him try FA and they would up having to match a 3 year nearly $10 million offer sheet from Toronto. Now, next year, Duhon's contract will be up, he will have 4 years of experience, and Chicago will have to hand some major dollars or watch him walk for nothing to another team that needs a starting point guard. There are too many cases in league history where a guy blows up in his contract year and then the team can't re-sign him for me to go back and name you every one. It is just as common as all the Matt Maloney contracts that are given out for players that subsequently underperform. My opinion is that the market is going to value Chuck at around $2.5 to $3 million per year on a 2 year deal. My opinion is Chuck is going to be a long term player in this league. I think he has the drive and the love of the game and is selfless enough to do whatever it takes to get on the court and make a positive contribution. In my opinion, he is a nuts and bolts player. While I think he does benefit from playing with McGrady and Yao, I think they benefit greatly from playing from him, and if he were to go to Cleveland, Lebron and Z would benefit from him, and if he were playing in Miami Shaq and DWade would benefit from him, and if he were in Detroit, Chancey and co. would benefit from him, and if he were in Minny KG and Foye would benefit from him, and if he were in SA, Duncan, Manu, and Parker would benefit from him. Chuck Hayes is the kind of ubiquitous player that can fit in anywhere and be a positive influence on a basketball team. What happens when teams have to concentrate on all these other guys? Chuck does the same thing for them he would do for us. He goes to the open spot on the floor, receives the ball and puts it in. And he defends and rebounds his fanny off.
Hayes is a very nice role player but no team is going to fight for his services. In the last couple of games he has looked good because teams are betting on letting him wide open and his man is double teaming Yao or TMac. I would definitely prefer to have a guy that commands more respect from the other team's defense and give a little bit of breathing room for Yao to operate. When you have two players lock on Yao and a third coming for help, he is going to have a tough time scoring. I would sign him for 2 years 5 million deal
I love Rubber Chucky. I was at the blowout when he got his first court time. I looked at my buddy and asked who's that? He said, "Oh, some D-league player who just got a 10-day contract." By the time the game was over, everyone in the building knew who Chuck Hayes was. He is the highest energy player on the team. He never stops. And he might have the strongest legs in the NBA. When he gets position against anyone, he can keep them from posting up. I've seen him keep Shaq try to post him up and not be able to move him. I always buy jerseys of role players. When I decided to replace my David Wesley jersey this off-season, I knew that it had to be Chuck Hayes.
I've seen games against the Heat where Chuck has clearly out-played Haslem. Now Haslem had the unenviable task of helping Shaq guard Yao, but Hayes out-rebounded him, played better defense, and even got several really good basket cuts. Hayes doesn't have anything that compares to Haslem's 18-footer, but the difference isn't that great.
jopatmc, Duhon doesn't help your case. He had an incredibly horrible stretch earlier this season. The Bulls did just the right thing with him. He isn't that good and is definitely NOT a starting caliber NBA player. I agree with you on Nash. Letting him go could have cost the Mavs a championship or two. Your passion for Chuck is only matched by your hatred of Juwan. To each his own.
While I am in favor of a 3-year extension for Chuck, probably on the order of $8-10M, jopatmc's point is pretty valid, though I would think it happens more with players destined to be superstars. You usually see a player signed for long years commensurate with their future potential in baseball, as arbitration eligible youngsters sign big deals (Michael Young). In basketball, I can think of a few examples... Off the top of my head, I vaguely remember Devean George, a when he was with the Lakers didn't get a contract extension after the 3rd year of his rookie deal, and after blowing up the next season, forced the Lakers to use their entire MLE to resign him, when they could have had him for money more commensurate with the 23rd overall pick. Going with players a bit more talented than Chuck, I'm sure the Bobcats are kicking themselves over not giving Crash a longer contract last year; they're going to find themselves in a bidding war this summer... The Bucks only matched a 4-year offer sheet for Michael Redd, when he had already displayed a consistent and deadly shooting stroke. At the end of that contract, the Bucks had to max him out, and dealt with the constant fear that he was going to bolt to Cleveland. (As an aside, thank goodness they matched and prevented him from going to Dallas...) Finally, how about Joe Johnson and Phoenix? The Suns could have extended JJ before his walk year, and then had to trade him away when he got a max offer from Atlanta (obviously the Hawks made a blunder in the trade, since there was no way in hell Phoenix was going to match, but still, had it been a competent GM, Phoenix would have been set way back). Nevertheless, if you want to see how signing a bunch of role players to long-term deals in the hope that they'll improve can really mess up your team, look no further than my adopted Sixers, who sport Kyle Korver, Willie Green, Kevin Ollie, Steven Hunter, Greg Buckner and Aaron Mckie (still on the hook for both of them...), all of whom are various degrees of overpaid.
Dallas traded for Nash going into the third season of his Phoenix contract and extended him for the maximum number of years. They couldn't have signed him to a longer contract. He played out the contract and they didn't want to pay the $66 million Phoenix offered him. Being cheap when he became a free agent is not the same as signing him for too short of a contract years before. That was my question: when has a team signed a guy for too short a contract and regretted it? In Nash's case, they couldn't offer more years. That's like saying we should have signed Yao to a seven-year extension, you just can't do it! Again, when did they sign him for too short of a contract and when has it bitten them in the ass? Gee, they got to keep him for a reasonable contract for three more years? How terrible for them! Are people supposed to be handing out multi-year deals to rookies now? You're talking about major dollars when he's barely playing up to the contract he has now. If anything, his next contract will be around the same value as the current one. And it will likely be with Chicago (if they even want to keep him).
Chuck has played well as a starter so far, and we have played well with Chuck as a starter. Those who said he'd crash and burn in that role at the beginning of the season have been wrong up to this point.
